Cork Pension Fraud

No death certificate was issued, he never went to register the deaths, this in itself is an offence, suppossed to be registered within 3 months.

What I wonder is will 'his' council house be sitting idle for him for 3 years until he is released from jail to add an additional €50k plus to the fraud?

Absolutely, it shouldn't be up to the next of kin to register the death. Daft. As far as I am aware the current penalty is 40 shillings for non declarance and ten pounds for the undertaker under the nineteenth century law.

What crime?

If that's the case EVERY undertaker in the country is committing a crime as death certs can take weeks/months to be issued depending on the circumstances of the death, even if they were applied for on the day after the death itself or the day of the death itself.

It's not always practical to have the cert issued "fast" in its current guise.

In the first instance - The guy in this case broke a number of laws over a long period of time - the sentance handed down is nowwhere near enough to deter anyone else who might wish to do the same.

In the second instance - some flaws have been exposed in the processes around death, pensions and the Public Services Card - these should be shored up (if they haven't been already) without placing unneeded extra paperwork/work on the citizen or the department.

Quote from the 1874 Act.

' The registrar, upon registering any death or upon receiving a written requisition to attend at a house to register a death, or upon receiving such written notice of the occurrence of a death, accompanied by a medical certificate as is before provided by this Act, shall forthwith, or as soon after as he is required, give, without fee or reward, either to the person giving information concerning the death or sending the requisition or notice, or to the undertaker or other person having charge of the funeral of the deceased, a certificate under his hand that he has registered or received notice of the death, as the case may be.

Every such order of the coroner and certificate of the registrar shall be delivered to the person who buries or performs any funeral or religious service for the burial of the body of the deceased; and any person to whom such order or certificate was given by the coroner or registrar who fails so to deliver or cause to be delivered the same shall be liable to a penalty not exceeding forty shillings.

The person who buries or performs any funeral or religious service for the burial of any dead body, as to which no order or certificate under this section is delivered to him, shall, within seven days after the burial, give notice thereof in writing to the registrar, and if he fail so to do shall be liable to a penalty not exceeding ten pounds.'

Looks like it.

Yes. At present the Doctor/Hospital issue a cause of death statement. Not a legal death cert, this is then used to get a Death Cert by a next of kin (if they register it). Daft.

Reading the regulations it seems if the undertaker isn't furnished with a cert or statement of death within 7 days of burial they must inform the registrar. I'd say this is never done.

They would already have the PRSI no on record.

True. Would simplify things too.

Well I'd say they do.

When the Inspector arrives at the door the following may apply, they can't get in (often) or told person is sick so can't see them, the're gone away to hospital/family, holiday. Maybe even get an old person to stand in if they have notice? If asked difficult questions say they are confused/memory loss.

Would be time consuming for the majority genuine cases and there would be a huge outcry if pensions were stopped in a genuine case. Much easier/simplier/cheaper to have a proper death registration system to start with.

It cant really be to much to ask a pensioner to verify their actual existence on an annual basis either in person or in writing with a GP / garda stamp.

The Uk do this and they have pensioners, literally, in every single country in the world.

Yep. It’s a bit of a mystery. Medical card do reviews. The councils do means tests every year. But you can have Disability Allowance Carers Allowance Pension etc for years and years and never hear anything. I can’t explain it.

The letter would come to the address where the claimant was living and woold be return by him. Not much of a check there.

The system should check that the person has been seen alive at some point in the recent past.

If a person cannot collect their own pension they must be under the care of a doctor. It would be very odd if such a person was not seen in person by their doctor several times a year. A bit of joined up thinking is needed.

True. Always resistance to tightening up the systems. People walking around unregistered and others not legally dead!