Married Men - A Gay Lads View - Have you ever had an experience?

16-02-2022 12:07am

Reading through this it seems someone wants to re-live the 70's.

Liberty_Bear · 16-02-2022 12:09am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638180#Comment_118638180

Music was fab...

Can hear ABBA in my ears ...

Liberty_Bear · 16-02-2022 12:13am

While we are on the topic - there is a support group for married men

https://gcn.ie/listing/married-mens-support-group/

16-02-2022 12:15am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638206#Comment_118638206

Forget ABBA when you had Three Dog Night,Electric Light Orchestra,and The Kinks.

Liberty_Bear · 16-02-2022 12:17am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638217#Comment_118638217

Dying to see ELO live

o1s1n · 16-02-2022 12:21am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638217#Comment_118638217

Only one of those bands formed in the 70s ;)

16-02-2022 12:23am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638222#Comment_118638222

Saw them at Disneyland of all places in 86 I think.

AllForIt · 16-02-2022 12:23am

..

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118634493#Comment_118634493

Gay means having a sexual interest in one's own sex.

MSM means exactly the same thing, as does WSW.

So MSM is just as much a label as Gay is, it's just semantics.

It's funny how some people don't want a label in this era of identity politics. Figure that one out.

Liberty_Bear · 16-02-2022 12:34am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638259#Comment_118638259

If a person has a same sex attraction but has not had sex with a man they are gay then what does it make MSM?

Curious

ohnonotgmail · 16-02-2022 9:49am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638259#Comment_118638259

people are free to label their sexuality as they wish. this is other people deciding what their sexuality is. can you not see the difference?

Wibbs · 16-02-2022 9:50am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638304#Comment_118638304

As I noted earlier "MSM" was just an extra box to tick for men who didn't want to say they were Gay or Bi on medical surveys that arose out of the AIDS crisis in the 1980's. It was a practical way of bypassing most of the cultural and personal attitudes around being Gay or Bi, cultural and personal attitudes that were worse in the past and are still around now. This is even more in play in some cultures and subcultures. It also included men who were sex workers. The MSM box brought more men into the epidemiological surveys that would otherwise be missed. The WSW tag is much less in play, simply because they were seen as one of the lower risk groups for HIV infection.

Your question? If an "MSM" has exclusively same sex attraction they're Gay, if they have an attraction to both sexes they're Bi. Virgins or not. The virgin thing is a bit of a silly argument anyway. As I type this I'm not shagging, does this mean I'm in some shrodinger state of undecided until I am? Nope.

16-02-2022 9:57am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638041#Comment_118638041

I've a news flash for you. If you managed to get an erection you were sexually attracted to them. You may also be attracted to Ham sandwiches (is that similar to Apple Pie?) Anyway, no judgement here.

16-02-2022 9:58am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638958#Comment_118638958

They are, but they are not free to have their label accepted by others. You can buy a cheap knock off and call it a Rolex, but don't expect anyone to give you €20k for it.

16-02-2022 10:00am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638304#Comment_118638304

Curious... what point do you think you're making?

ohnonotgmail · 16-02-2022 10:22am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638994#Comment_118638994

why is your opinion of somebodies sexuality important?

16-02-2022 10:25am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118639109#Comment_118639109

Because it's my opinion. Why wouldn't that be important?

ohnonotgmail · 16-02-2022 10:26am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118639130#Comment_118639130

why would it be important?

16-02-2022 10:27am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118639135#Comment_118639135

Because it's my opinion. I believe my opinion is important. What further explanation do you require?

ohnonotgmail · 16-02-2022 10:28am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118639144#Comment_118639144

i'm sure YOU think it is important. that doesn't make it so.

16-02-2022 10:29am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118639147#Comment_118639147

It's clearly important to you, or why else would you be challenging it. Thank you.

zv2 · 16-02-2022 10:48am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118637388#Comment_118637388

Was it on a Tuesday? If so you are a Tuesday hetro. If it was on Wednesday...you get my drift...

Mad_maxx · 16-02-2022 11:27am

I Don't think my opinion is important but I do believe you can't be heterosexual and sleep with men

The rest is just word salad

AllForIt · 16-02-2022 11:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638958#Comment_118638958

No, I don't actually.

Sexuality is really simple. Noone has a unique sexuality that 'only oneself' can define.

I see when it comes to gender there are those who are pushing that similar idea, that one has a unique gender, that only oneself can define, as if one has a unique gender (hence 100+ genders), and it seems of late that this attitude is being applied to sexuality as well. It's total nonsense.

Gael23 · 16-02-2022 11:52pm

I’m gay and while some part of me does desire to be “normal” and be straight I’ve come to be at peace with the fact that I’m not. I’ve come to accept the reality that if I ever get married I’m going to have a husband instead of a wife.

Being genetic might be a bit far fetched but I can assure you it’s not a choice. I’m not attracted to women and I can’t felt that, it’s just not there, but for the reasons above with the fell of counselling I’ve come to accept that reality. But to really emphasise being gay isn’t a lifestyle choice I’ve made, it’s just me.

Liberty_Bear · 17-02-2022 12:02am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118644068#Comment_118644068

I think that regardless of our orientation, we would still face the same problems. I think based on the large body of evidence available it is genetic (penguins and dolphins come to mind)

Its hard to explain to people when they read that we desire to be straight, had that feeling myself at one point that lead to a suicide attempt at 18 then I just enjoyed being who I am

Id even do monogamy (and thats an exception I find in the gay world!)

Liberty_Bear · 17-02-2022 12:34am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118644068#Comment_118644068

Is the implication of your first sentence that you are not normal?

Gael23 · 17-02-2022 12:52am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118644273#Comment_118644273

That doesn’t read how I meant it. The norm in society is that a man falls in love with a woman and vice versa, goes on to have a few kids, and of course nit have to del with coming out, just to fall into why people expect nartually that I’ll have a girlfriend. That said I now accept that I’ve no feelings for girls so I’m growing to be ok with things being a little different.

ive never once felt suicidal or self harmed over it. I’ve had notions that I’ll just stay single so as to avoid confronting it but that’s all. But therapy has allowed me embrace or more, to just accept me as myself and to allow in feelings that I fancy men

Liberty_Bear · 17-02-2022 12:55am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118644340#Comment_118644340

And my apologies I never wanted to take you up wrong on that point either , I read it like you were not accepting of it so mea culpa. That road of self acceptance is a long one for a lot of people in that they gradually accept their sense of self and either tolerate it or embrace it or just live with it. Once you are happy and living that is all that really matters at the end of the day. Hope you do find that inner balance.

17-02-2022 10:38am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118644340#Comment_118644340

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118644352#Comment_118644352

Society was tragically uncaring for the most of Christianity at least, possibly longer, although it seemed at various times in human history to be less of an issue or accepted (ancient Greece). It makes me angry never mind someone that actually had/has to suffer such intollerance. Whether it was for moral (which we just make up anyway) or for inheritance/legacy or other selfish reasons it became a serious societal taboo (again, man made) punishable by death/prison at various times, and only very recently legal. AND only very very recently normal, and with the same legal rights and protections as us boring straights. I've no doubt many young men have taken their lives and despite the slow societal change, some will in the future.

Here's my story. About two months ago my son (we had our family young) said he'd travelled up to Dublin and spent the night with someone in a hotel. No pronouns and we didn't delve any further. Just left it to what he was comfortable talking about. The next day the two us were in the car together and he said, he'd spent most of his time with (male name) around Dublin and I asked if this was the person he stayed in the hotel with, and the reply was a sheepish, 'maybe'. So, I said that's good to hear, ye seem to like each other a lot. I then said, 'Clean up your room and you can invite him around' (The absolute lengths a parent will go to get a child to clean their room! 😀 ).

Here comes the relevant bit to this thread. My daughter, one year younger than my son says and shorlty after the boyfriend visit, 'you know he's bi?'. And this is my dilema. My son hasn't said anything about his sexuality, but I'd be fairly certain he's gay and not bi. I'll give one example. We were driving in a car and we stopped at traffic lights and there were girls around his age to the left of us, and it being summer were dressed for summer and he gave them no attention and continued talking (can't remember what we were talking about) looking straight ahead, but myself at that age would have forgot my dad even existed and would have been 'eyes left'. That's just one example.

Last year he started college and he dated girls (he's a good looking lad) and they always ended very quickly. I think girls can pick up on it very quickly. I think he dated girls to fit in with his new, straight college friends. Whereas when his boyfriend visited (I'm delighted to say he cleaned up his room sharpish) he was completely relaxed. My son was always very chirpy (he puts the gay into gay!), but it's come out he didn't always enjoy school, because the other boys probably saw him as different. That broke my heart. I've zero doubt that it's genetic. And he is the way he is partially because of me. He is super smart (pretty much a polymath), outgoing and a joy to be around. Some of that is down to me too. He has said in the past he'd love a family, but since meeting his boyfriend, it's more like, 'meh, who needs that hassle'. Anyway, I've wandered... I want him to be happy with being gay or bi, whatever he actually is, rather than saying bi or anything that he thinks would be more socially acceptable. In farileness, I've only ever heard his sister say he was bi - he hasn't said it. But, they are very close, and maybe he has said it to her.

Liberty_Bear · 17-02-2022 10:42am

Jesus mate you sound like my da ! Fair play though you gave him the latitude and the understanding for him to feel like that. My own dad embraced my ex like a son. It destroyed him when they broke up. You sound like the type of da that a lot of guys would love fir guidance and understanding.

17-02-2022 10:58am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118645211#Comment_118645211

Funny story for you. He doesn't have a car, and we'd still drive him around a fair bit. In the last year or so we were dropping him off to places we weren't familiar with, but these were college friends so, naturally not the usual... turns out it was hookups. It only seems like yesterday we were dropping him to play dates... I suppose we still were! 😂 And for sure I got my parents to drop me/pick me up from dates back in the day, so...

LLMMLL · 19-02-2022 6:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638259#Comment_118638259

Not really. MSM would include male prostitutes or porn actors who are only having sex with other man for money. They are not gay.

LLMMLL · 19-02-2022 6:53pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638990#Comment_118638990

Not true. You can get an erection for many reasons. Direct stimulation, or just feeling generally horny.

19-02-2022 7:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118659761#Comment_118659761

I think if he was with a woman we can assume it was because he was with a woman. Unless he says he told her 'hang on a second I need to self stimulate myself for a minute, smoke if you got them'.

If he was independently horny why was he with a woman, he could have sorted himself out. That's just silly. If he was with someone and wasn't attracted it'd be a distraction. Again, there is no man I'd be 'horny' around and think I'll have sex with them There would be no interest or physical possibility.

LLMMLL · 19-02-2022 10:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118659843#Comment_118659843

Why would you assume anything. The poster who said that is in the thread. You can just ask him. Though I expect if he says anything that's not what you want to hear you will dismiss it.

The point is many men (including myself) respond quite strongly to physical stimulation. If a woman rubbed my penis it would get hard. Other men need a strong sense of sexual attraction to get it up. I don't know if you're a man or woman but if you're a man I wouldn't assume all men are exactly like you.

It is perfectly possible for a man to have sex with a woman he is not sexually attracted to, whether that's because he is gay or just not into the particular woman. And no, they don't have to go off to the bathroom to get themselves hard and come back to do the deed.

19-02-2022 10:23pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118660769#Comment_118660769

Makes ZERO sense to have sex with someone you have zero attraction to you. You may very well stick it in a ham sandwich.

But, I presume you're not a fan of the Kinsey scale considering you've ruled out any attraction. You can't have it both ways (no giggles from those in the back)

Also, to have no attraction would be practically impossible. It's very much more likely to be some attraction or a degree of repulsion.

LLMMLL · 19-02-2022 10:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118660794#Comment_118660794

That's such a limited way of thinking. If it makes zero sense to YOU that someone would have sex with someone they are not attracted to, how do you deal with the inevitable situation when someone tells they had sex with someone they weren't attracted to? The only option to you is to portray them as lying. Since the facts don't fit your theory, attack the facts.

Sensible reasons why someone could have sex with someone they're not attracted to:

Money (porn actors, prostitutes)

Hiding their sexuality (many gay men have had children with women, how did this happen if it makes no sense for a gay man to have sex with a woman?)

Curiosity (some people will try it as an experience even if they believe they won't be into it)

Uncomfortable rejecting someone. I have many friends who go to a NSA hookup from online dating, are not into the person, but have sex with them rather than reject them.

Hundreds of thousands of people have sex for the above reasons among others. How do you explain these encounters if having sex with someone you're not attracted to makes no sense. Are these people insane?

Also the ham sandwich analogy is ridiculous. If you think having sex with a human you are not attracted to would be in any way similar to having sex with an inanimate object...well I could make a snide dark about your sex life but I'm sure you're smart enough to see the differences.

19-02-2022 10:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118660884#Comment_118660884

See, I've never had sex with someone I wasn't attracted to, so the Ham Sandwich (was brought up by someone else) seems just as sensible as having sex with someone they say they have no sexual attraction to. Why would having sex with someone you've no attraction to be any different to an inanimate object? I think you're revealing more about your own sex life here than mine.

And my answer is that there is some degree of sexual attraction, or there is in the vast majority of cases. In the other cases drugs/fluffers are probably used.

And it looks like you missed my point earlier (edited) that it's virtually impossible to have no attraction. There's either attraction or repulsion.

LLMMLL · 19-02-2022 11:02pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118660914#Comment_118660914

See, I've never had sex with someone I wasn't attracted to, so the Ham Sandwich (was brought up by someone else) seems just as sensible as having sex with someone they say they have no sexual attraction to. Why would having sex with someone you've no attraction to be any different to an inanimate object? I think you're revealing more about your own sex life here than mine.

Your thinking seems to be "having sex with a ham sandwich and having sex with a person I'm not attracted to are equally unappealing TO ME, therefore there is no actual difference between having sex with a ham sandwich and a person that someone is not attracted to". It's incredibly egocentric to think that your personal experience can be used to explain other people's behaviour.

A ham sandwich can't give a blowjob for example. There's one reason (among MANY) sex with a human they're not attracted to is different to sex with a ham sandwich and someone might not see them as the same thing. I can't actually believe I have to point this out.

And my answer is that there is some degree of sexual attraction, or there is in the vast majority of cases. In the other cases drugs/fluffers are probably used.

So all those gay men who married women to hide their sexuality are actually attracted to women and all are bisexual? I don't even feel the need to argue this one. I'll just let everyone read it and see how silly it is for themselves.

And it looks like you missed my point earlier (edited) that it's virtually impossible to have no attraction. There's either attraction or repulsion.

I did miss that point. And now that I've seen it I completely disagree. Sticking with the ham sandwich example I am not sexually repulsed by them. I just never consider sticking my dick in one and never will. But I'm more bemused by the idea than repulsed.

As for women the same applies. I'm not interested in them but I'm not sexually repulsed. I don't have some big over the top gag reaction if someone asks me would I have sex with a woman.

Just because you (probably) have that reaction to whatever gender it is that you're not into, doesn't mean we all do. It's just another egocentric "this is my experience, everyone must be like me, and if they say they aren't they're actually secretly bi". Ridiculous.

19-02-2022 11:07pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118660996#Comment_118660996

I started reading this and thought, hang on, I don't have the same sexual orientation as you, so what do I know about you. Maybe you're quite happy to get a blow job from a man, woman or whatever... I've stopped reading there. Whatever floats your boat, maybe you can get enjoyment out getting a blowjob from someone you're not attracted to. That really is completely outside my sphere of understanding. Some men are from mars others are from some far flung planet even hubble couldn't identify. I'm going to have to let the rest of your response to my imagination. Good night.

LLMMLL · 19-02-2022 11:13pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118661026#Comment_118661026

Depends what you mean by sexual orientation.

If you mean I'm gay and you're straight and gay people will get a bj off anyone then you're being bizarre.

If you mean some kind of personal sexual orientation that includes sexual behaviour then that's the point I'm making all along and I'm happy you've finally seen it. Not everyone is exactly like you in their sexual behaviour.

19-02-2022 11:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118661062#Comment_118661062

"If you mean some kind of personal sexual orientation that includes sexual behaviour then that's the point I'm making all along ..."

I've no idea what that sentence is supposed to mean, but at least you kept it short enough to read.

LLMMLL · 19-02-2022 11:26pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118661087#Comment_118661087

What do you mean by sexual orientation? For most people it means gay/bi/straight.

Because me being gay and you being (presumably) straight has nothing to do with this.

If you're saying it does then that's pretty dodgy.

Wombatman · 20-02-2022 12:00am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118645186#Comment_118645186

"And this is my dilema. My son hasn't said anything about his sexuality, but I'd be fairly certain he's gay and not bi."

What difference dose it make to you? Could change over time anyway.

Wombatman · 20-02-2022 12:08am

"Lay here on the bed and put the blind fold on.

Your erotic therapist will soon be in to give you a wonderful full body message followed by delightful oral sex."

Nice.

After the erotic therapist finishes and leaves the room and you take off the blind, do you wonder to yourself if you are still gay or bi or straight or into animals or whatever.