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Ukraine (Mod Note & Threadbanned Users in OP)

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    #182
    AyeGer
    Registered Users Posts: 1,336 ✭✭✭AyeGer


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118673832#Comment_118673832

    I thought about that the other evening, is Putin accepting he will lose territory in the east where he has very little population. So he decided he wants to expand west and hoover up larger populations for his state. Russia would go from 140 million to about 200 million taking back those former Eastern European countries.



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    #183
    josip
    Registered Users Posts: 13,889 ✭✭✭✭josip


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674196#Comment_118674196

    Are you mixing up Republika Srpska with Serbia?



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    #184
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118673635#Comment_118673635

    They are going to have peacekeeping talks about Ukraine we are told... Russia big problem is that they do not want Ukraine to be part of NATO so that basically rules NATO out as peace-keepers it seems clear that NATO as a force are not going to get involved...

    Isreal is pretty much the same for me with the opposite as it suits America to leave it as is... EU bystanders...



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    #185
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118673662#Comment_118673662

    They should but this started in 2014 when Russia invaded Crimea and were left to do as they wanted... i see that being mentioned by Russian minister...

    Irs grear how the media works as it seems Afghanistan was decades ago...



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    #186
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118673662#Comment_118673662

    Of course they should decide their own future... tell that to Putin... Russia will do as they please... Its a big-boys game...



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    #187
    timmyntc
    Registered Users Posts: 7,035 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674146#Comment_118674146

    China and Russia are closer than ever. Their very existence depends on them sticking together against "the west"

    They will have seen what's happened the world over in South America, North Africa, Middle East, and Ukraine with colour revolutions and attempts to remove leaders and replace them with ones more aligned to the Western interest. There is no chance that Russia or China turn on each other in the near future, if there were it would be being strained and exploited by the West at every opportunity to weaken them both.

    The Chinese will back Putin regardless of his actions in Ukraine, and that backing (along with the ever present threat of nuclear destruction) will ensure that no other country steps up to defend Ukraine. There will likely be a decade long affair of sanctions and proxy wars in Ukraine, where arms manufacturers win and Ukrainians lose.



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    #188
    Yurt2
    Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674475#Comment_118674475

    See Wang Yi's statement on sovereignity and the Minsk accords. The Chinese will lose their nerve and to an extent already have. Besides that, China has significant interests in Ukraine and won't like what it sees. Russia and China will never be as integrated economically and politically as the West with their long-standing post-war institutions. They fundamentally don't trust each other and the long shadow of the Sino-Soviet split looms large. You may think that's ancient history, but the institutional memory of China does not.

    Fundamentally, it's lonely being an autocratic country. Institutionally, both countries are laced with incredible amounts of paranoia and think that disaster lurks around the corner.

    I'll repeat what I said. The next Sino-Russian bunfight is only one slip up away, and it will almost certainly involve Central Asian countries. Where China has the economic goodies to bribe the elites, but Russia deep down views as their stomping ground. We already saw a wobble with Khazakastan. Watch that space very closely.

    "Never closer" is the press release from Zhongnanhai and the Kremlin. You'd be naïve to believe it. "No honour among thieves" would be an appropriate idiom when thinking about the Russia China relationship and its coherency going forward.

    Post edited by Yurt2 on


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    #189
    Flinty997
    Registered Users Posts: 12,003 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    ...



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    #190
    Larbre34
    Registered Users Posts: 24,008 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Foreign Minister Landsbergis of Lithuania giving a full run down of 1930s Hitler comparisons on CNN there.

    Not a man known for hysterics.



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    #191
    amacca
    Registered Users Posts: 6,869 ✭✭✭amacca


    Looks like Putins long term plans don't end in Ukraine to me.



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    #192
    Brussels Sprout
    Registered Users Posts: 7,106 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    This is good.


    https://twitter.com/SamRamani2/status/1496184573163671555




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    #193
    maestroamado
    Registered Users Posts: 4,426 ✭✭✭maestroamado


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674630#Comment_118674630

    So we cannot say that... i will check previous conversation as cannot remember...



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    #194
    breezy1985
    Registered Users Posts: 25,740 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674190#Comment_118674190

    Who cares really if it gets to that stage. If the US and Russia go to war the planet is over anyway. Doesn't matter how prepared anyone else is.



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    #195
    timmymagoo
    Registered Users Posts: 110 ✭✭timmymagoo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674947#Comment_118674947

    until America and Russia don’t go to war and America chooses instead to let Russia run amok in Europe unchallenged

    if Europe won’t defend themselves than why will American bother



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    #196
    breezy1985
    Registered Users Posts: 25,740 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674961#Comment_118674961

    Europe has nukes too. It's all over if any of us go to war.



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    #197
    timmymagoo
    Registered Users Posts: 110 ✭✭timmymagoo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674966#Comment_118674966

    france and uk have nukes, they will not self destruct to save Eastern Europe which is what Putin wants



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    #198
    breezy1985
    Registered Users Posts: 25,740 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674982#Comment_118674982

    Right but you said the "EU needs to get it's sht together" so your proposed EU army will have nukes and if they step in to stop Putin what we all get is a dead northern hemisphere at best.

    Its fking awful what's happening but the world wouldnt risk nuclear war for Iraq or Afghanistan so essentially we have to just live in hope that sanctions and diplomacy work.



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    #199
    gmisk
    Registered Users Posts: 32,670 ✭✭✭✭gmisk


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118674799#Comment_118674799

    They will just retreat to their UK homes I would say. The Tories won't want to annoy some of their donors.

    Johnson said he was going after Abramovich...he isn't, he lied.

    https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-roman-abramovich-sanctions-b2020535.html




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    #200
    Larbre34
    Registered Users Posts: 24,008 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    A cousin of mine worked in Irish political lobby circles in Washington and has known Joe Biden for over 30 years.

    What concerns my cousin the most is that Biden is very clearly and obviously ailing. He sees that the Presidency, at his age and in such tough times is killing him, alarmingly quickly.

    It's not a great set of circumstances, a paranoid loony in the Kremlin and a deteriorating old man in the White House.

    Now more than ever, the EU will have to plot its own course and look after its own interests. We only have ourselves to rely on at the moment.



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    #201
    Gatling
    Registered Users Posts: 40,291 ✭✭✭✭Gatling


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675115#Comment_118675115

    And none of the EU is united ,they let putin in through to many doors , putin has the ability to **** with the eu from within and not a lot can be done about it

    360_F_102352090_ie3kLjDIvgrT1sxVDknWCUh8PxgMYzM7.jpg




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    #202
    Flinty997
    Registered Users Posts: 12,003 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    We've had worse then Biden and Putin.



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    #203
    Flinty997
    Registered Users Posts: 12,003 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997





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    #204
    Flinty997
    Registered Users Posts: 12,003 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    Bit of hysteria from some posters.



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    #205
    Strumms
    Registered Users Posts: 25,296 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675115#Comment_118675115

    Biden assumed the presidency as a 79 year old… he's 80 in a few months. Not great considering the responsibility and the workload that the position demands… an 83 year old when exiting the White House, this first term anyway…not great.



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    #206
    gmisk
    Registered Users Posts: 32,670 ✭✭✭✭gmisk


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675279#Comment_118675279

    The alternative isn't much better I would suggest age and definitely not health wise. Let's be honest a president is a figurehead the people around him make the majority of the decisions



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    #207
    Strumms
    Registered Users Posts: 25,296 ✭✭✭✭Strumms


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675287#Comment_118675287

    Well no, another 4 of Trump would be less desirable…

    Biden he is still a decision making person of responsibility who has the ultimate say as opposed to simply a conduit… he has plenty of advisors but he is the ‘man’..



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    #208
    gmisk
    Registered Users Posts: 32,670 ✭✭✭✭gmisk


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675480#Comment_118675480

    Oh god as absolutely brainless as usual...I have kind of enjoyed not hearing anything from him for a while...



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    #209
    Larbre34
    Registered Users Posts: 24,008 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118675210#Comment_118675210

    Not both at once.

    Yes I know Trump and Putin co-existed, but that was Putin before Covid paranoia and he was quite happy to try and manipulate Trump and sit back and profit from the chaos, especially when Trump had no thought for Ukraine.

    Reagan was balanced out ultimately by Gorbachev.

    Yeltsin was balanced out by Clinton.

    Putin V1.0 looked positively statesmanlike next to Dubya Bush.

    I'm just not sure Biden has the heft left in him to take on Putin in this state of mind. Not without a strong British PM and, well........



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    #210
    AMKC
    Registered Users Posts: 15,975 ✭✭✭✭AMKC
    Ms


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118676093#Comment_118676093

    Well it looks like Boris Johnson has weathered all that has being thrown at him so far. Will he still be there in a year never mind 3 years I do not know. Who would be better in charge of the UK do?

    As for Biden. It was great that he beat Trump to the Presidency and hopefully he lasts his term and does what needs to be done. Hopefully there is no war but its unfortunetly looking more and more likely each passing day. I think Putin wants a Border the whole way along Ukraine from Belarus across to Dunisk and Lahansk. So ye I do not think he is finished. He is a very sly sneaky horrible person but very smart too unfortunately.

    Live long and Prosper

    Peace and long life.



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    #211
    Yurt2
    Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    One has to ask, depending on the scale and scope of the invasion, what has Putin or what will Putin actually gain from this?

    If he stops at tightening the grip on Donbass, He has roused NATO and European institutions from their slumber, took painful sanctions in the jugular and trashed anything left of Russia's reputation as an honest actor. Donbass is a wreck after 8 years of war he sponsored so he'll have to cough up billions to reconstruct what was already a rust belt before the conflict. Ukraine wasn't even a NATO applicant country but will now be supplied out the wazoo by Western countries and Ukraine politically will move further to the West. The likelihood of NATO acceding to his demands is remote.

    If he broadens the invasion, there will be immense bloodletting of both Ukranians and Russians, and once the coffins start coming back East to their families, flashbacks of Afghanistan in the Russian psyche won't be long coming. Russia will be a full-on pariah state for a long time with every country that matters that isn't called China (and even they privately will be deeply shaken). His domestic political position will be severely weakened and someone in the regime might get the idea to dust of the polonium vial.

    As this uncoils, I think it's becoming ever more clear that the man has severely miscalculated.



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