30k speed limits for all urban areas on the way

How did you come up with this calculation exactly

At 9 the issue is you are going to get stuck at lights, that wouldn't be reduced by going at 30

You'd be down to about 20k average speed

The rest of the day throuhput would drop and traffic would be worse

The problem in Ireland is pedestrians crossing anywhere they want, walking between cars, crossing on the red light (even Garda), not the speed. We all know that nobody cares about these 30 km/h restrictions as no one is enforcing it.

Damn all those pedestrians killing hundreds of people a year by crossing where they want

They're killing themselves by not even both sides of the road before crossing the road! This isn't a room or a forest, pedestrians aren't wild animals either. However, they act like ones: without a common sense and caution, like if they'd be living in a civilisation for the first day in their lives. If they die due to their careless actions than it's a natural selection. Stupid ones don't get to survive.

Again victim blaming, the thing that kills pedestrians is being mowed down by cars driving too fast (>30mph) in urban areas. Magicbastardar makes some very good points above.

There is zero excuse for double standards. Double standards are generally for freeloaders, fraudulant people, dishonest people and obnoxious people. In most cases, double standards are displayed by dark triad types who frequently feign victimhood where the reality is they are irresponsible.

A recent example of such dishonesty includes the tram surfer who was unfortunately awarded half a million for getting injured by their own stupidity.

In my opinion, obliviously walking out in front of moving traffic is tantamount to suicide and not homicide as yourself and @magicbastarder are often seen to be claiming. Just because one group of road user is more brittle or vulnerable does not and should not obsolve them of looking out for their safety.

Then again, being observant and orderly pedestrians is something that you two seem to think is too much hassle and in fact, refuse to do out of rebellion towards motorists.

Back to the main topic, I've heard numerous green party officials on the radio saying that the objective of 30KMH zones is to handicap motorised transport in a begrudgery driven attempt to bring them down to cyclist level speed. Like the DMURS, this is a socialist approach to operating/designing roads. It will also serve to de-optimize bus travel by increasing journey lengths substantially.

Instead, we should be focusing on reducing journey lengths for buses NOT increasing them in some fraudulent attempt to prop up inherently slower and weaker travel modes.

Crossing on the red is illegal although it can sometime feel like a seriously imbalanced set up when, if you're on foot, you have to press a button and stand in the rain for 30 seconds before being given permission to cross, but even though you're warm and dry in a car, you get priority except for that short stretch of time when people on foot have waited long enough in the rain. Who decided that the journeys of people travelling in one direction are more important than the journeys of other people travelling perpendicular to them, just because the former are in cars?

But crossing wherever is convenient is completely legal, unless you happen to be within 15m of a pedestrian crossing. and crossing between cars is not only legal, with the predominance of legally and illegally parked cars, is frequently the only way to get around.

Ignoring 30km/h limits, on the other hand, is always illegal.

So the real problem in Ireland is actually the mentality that thinks that ignoring speed limits is normal but people on foot behaving legally and predictably is the actual issue.

You have a right to complain so more crossing would be installed and existing lights to be changed in favour to the pedestrians. But crossing the red light is illegal and highly dangerous.

I completely agree. I may sound cynical but I am a driver, public transport user and a pedestrian too. I'm not obsessed to drive everywhere, I sometimes take a bus/train to the city centre as certainly not avoiding longer walks. So I'm familiar with all the issues. But I don't care about the speed limit as it's not enforced. And I also don't care about red pedestrian traffic light either. Obviously, when driving, I do seriously respect red lights and are careful towards cyclists and the pedestrians. However, I think the problem is that there is no enforcement so this 30 km/h limit means nothing to me. I don't understand numbers lower than 50 ;)

Yes, I'm extremely careful taking turns as a driver and crossing at the junctions or close to any turn to the house etc. Turns have blind spots in most cars. Especially hard to notice shorter people (kids), especially if they run. The best is always stop, look around, asses the situation and risks and make slow step on the road. Lots of people in city centre cross anywhere they like, often on phone or talking to friends. If it's dark and raining it's even worse. I'm also shocked how many drivers don't use lights when raining, even if it's the middle of the day and not too dark, it's important to use lights. Not for drivers, but for pedestrians to see approaching vehicle for farer. I most times use lights, especially during school times (morning and 2-4 pm), when raining, foggy, and obviously, when getting dark.

Exactly. I'm not afraid of speeding because there is no enforcement. If Garda don't care, I don't care either. Of course, I do try not to get to jail and I am certainly not speeding around people and many cars around putting others in danger or generally acting like a lunatic unlike some drivers. However, If the road is free and I see no obstacles around, I don't care about speed limits. However, there is never 100% guarantee that it's safe. Despite of speed, there is always a risk. As I said, I want to see enforcement. But there isn't so I enjoy speed when I see a chance to enjoy it.

Thank you, much appreciated ;) I'm sometimes a selfish **** too :)

When I was I I young we were taught to cross roads at lights/crossings, look both ways and be wary of the traffic around us.

Nowadays as with everything, its a case of "can't someone else do it" - pedestrians and cyclists want to be held to no standards, no obligation to look after their own safety as well, and as seen in this thread are perpetual victims.

Yes motorists have obligations too but the difference there is that they do face penalties when caught and have to pay handsomely to be behind the wheel in the first place as well as having achieved a minimum standard of skill and awareness first

It never ceases to amaze me that I could go buy a bike right now and take to the roads with no notion of the rules of the road, signalling, changing lanes etc and should have no concern about this because "someone else" should look out for me even when I do something stupid or dangerous.

Equally as a pedestrian I should be entitled to cross wherever and whenever I like regardless of traffic and without looking or warning because those motorists should be ready to hit the brakes every time anyway.

Modern Western society has become so infantalised it's ridiculous. You can see it in the childish responses on this thread alone.

Sharing the road, also means sharing responsibility.

No disputing that.. as a motorist it drives me mad as well the behaviour of other drivers a lot of the time.

But cyclists certainly don't help themselves either and do stupid risky things - eg: a while back I was in town at the top of a junction waiting to turn left with the indicator on (something I do religiously as no indicating drives me demented!). The lights went green and I moved forward and was about to take the turn when in my blind spot was a woman on a bike at my rear bumper trying to cut inside me. Now who's fault was that? Me or the idiot who felt entitled to do what she wanted or perhaps (per my post above) has no notion of what to do in those situations?

I've seen posts on this site of people getting run down by cyclists who sped through junctions and ending up with broken bones or hospital trips as a result (I'd imagine elderly pedestrians would be especially vulnerable to this). Also, who pays in that case as there's no insurance to claim from right?

As I said, all road users have an obligation for their own safety and that of others and behaving appropriately. It's not a case of shifting it to "someone else" - including drivers!

‘Much closer’? Really?

Cyclists have killed two people since the turn of the century. Motorists have killed about 4,000 people over the same period.

That might help people to understand the ‘double standards’ and‘shared responsibility’ nonsense.

Read the post again..

I was top of the queue, indicator on, waiting to turn.

This cyclist approached from the rear, would have seen this and decided to peddle on regardless on my inside - what she SHOULD probably have done is:

• Wait until I completed the turn. Being on a bike doesn't allow you right of way ahead of other traffic in such a scenario, especially if you try to undertake them to do so.
• Overtake on my right to continue ahead
• Not be so stupid and put herself at unnecessary risk

It's no wonder that some unfortunately end up under trucks at junctions with this attitude.

Nope.. No cycle lane and the cyclist was behind me on the inside, not ahead of me or in a stopping area.

I had right of way and she either chanced her arm or had a dangerous sense of entitlement.

Its lucky I spotted the silly twit and more so that I wasn't driving something larger with a bigger blind spot like a bus or truck

Your trust in motorists stopping when they see a red light is unfounded.

We don't need more tech solutions. We need drivers to look around before they turn.

Again, why would you think that you had right of way? And indicator does not give right of way.

If the cyclist is filtering past a line of traffic, as they are legally entitled to do, they are continuing on their journey straight ahead. If you're turning across that lane, you need make sure it is clear before you cross it.