Ukraine (Mod Note & Threadbanned Users in OP)

Are Ukraine the good guys? Can you confirm that is your opinion? Ukraine are fighting legitimately against an illegitimate Russian invasion? Yes or no? An illegitimate Russian invasion which is a war crime as an act of aggressive warfare? Yes or no?

Strange how your curiosity never extends on this thread to anything Pro Russian reported in the media, or made by their official representative or outlets. You are the one without perspective or balance -or at least that is how your posts are seen from what you have posted here. Your thoughts only ever run in one direction, or are allowed to. And that is only ever to question the Ukranian reports or Western media. Have you ever on this thread questioned a Russian version of events? Because apparently you don't just automatically assume they are lies... and yet none of those questions made it to this thread. So you say one thing, but your actions (posts) show a different pattern.

Nope, yet again you run away from any question directly put to them which in answering could be interpreted in any way as critical of Russia.

I refer to the previous questions which have been directly put to you about Russian lies and whether you accept or reject them.

Well its hard to disagree with your description of the situation, While i would question any information being put out by the Russian state (support in Russia for Putin, the war, 'the weather'), i have no doubt that propaganda works. And many Russians (perhaps a majority) do genuinely believe the official story. And yes the brain drain is real.

The fact is this is Russia's problem. We cannot fix it, only they can. The west will continue to offer the news, based on reality, and some of it will leak into Russia. The 20th century Russian, 'holding a radio to their ear to listen to the BBC Russian World Service', has been replaced by his 21st century counterpart. Using the TOR browser to access foreign news services and reports. Will it make a difference? I dont know. i hope so, but we wont know for some time

The other thing is the soldiers. Clearly the Russians will continue to downplay the seriousness of the conflict. 'Official casualties' will remain low, and the Putin Regime will continue to paint the war in glowing terms. But they have no control over what the average Russian soldier sees in the Ukraine. He is going to come home, with thousands (if not tens of thousands) of body bags. That will be a narrative, difficult to spin. They will talk, and some people will listen. And the horrors of this misadventure will become common knowledge, in stark contrast to the official narrative

Eric Bogle said it better than i ever could:

And so now every April, I sit on me porch

And I watch the parades pass before me

And I see my old comrades, how proudly they march

Reviving old dreams of past glories

And the old men march slowly, old bones stiff and sore

They're tired old heroes from a forgotten war

And the young people ask, "what are they marching for?"

And I ask myself the same question

Of course I condemn the Russian invasion.

If people want an echo chamber or a safe space in which only one view is allowed and the thread becomes a nodding dog with analysis limited to how terrible the Russians are, which there are.

If everything is dismissed and posters are accused of being pro Russian or even Russian for pointing out facts like the presence of Neo Nazis in Ukrainian forces or that some Ukrainian reports are not 100% true then perhaps start a thread where only one view is allowed.

As for some other posters. If you cannot stand for your opinion to be queried or share a thread with people whose views differ from yours why do you engage in a “discussion” board.

Regarding uploading a photo of the lotto and eaten Taytos I think it doesn’t bode well for a United Ireland that posters are convinced that someone who doesn’t share their opinion simply cannot be Irish.

In any case I haven’t played the lotto since a quick pick was €2 and I am more of a Kings crisps fan than Tayto .

I am also unconvinced that fellow Boardsies would appreciate a photo of “eaten Taytos”

That isn't a different view point though. It is a completely separate topic. Any neo nazis in Ukraine have no relevance to this war any more than what their murder rate is. I am sure there are many terrible people in the Ukraine. That does not justify this invasion and it isn't a reason it happened either. You are just repeating a propaganda piece.

It may be rather self serving in a way. But there is precedent for all of this. Id compare it to Remingtons tweet last week

I saw this and commented on it in CA. Then i done some research (contacted someone with more knowledge RE military munitions. Seems that the above could only supply basic ammo which is widely available in Ukraine, and easier to source closer to the region. So its just PR.

The thing is @Pussyhands PR does matter. If it did not, the Russians would not bother with their current 'carpet bombing' of the global media with their false narrative. So i view the knighthood as positive. Its not going to help win the war, but its a salvo in the PR conflict. Do remember also that Russia has long history of handing buckets of medals, to itself, and its soldiers/generals. Plenty of jokes on this over the years

"Leonid is in surgery."

"His heart again?"

"No, chest expansion surgery, to make room for one more Gold Star medal."

@Pussyhands - Just in general. Iv been responding to you for a few days, Think you have replied a few times (Turning point, the drone etc) - I think we certainly have a different take on a few things, and maybe even on the war in general. iv questioned your tone a few times also. But there are others on the thread who are, in my view, trying to derail it. Repeatedly posting nonsensical Moscow-sourced-disinformation, dodging criticism, and in effect spamming the thread with irrelevant and/or easily falsified statements. Even in disagreeing with you on many things, i do not view your posts in the same light as the aforementioned. I think there is a big difference there, and i have personally noted it. Anyway, call it an olive branch if you want but.. happy to debate

I think Sinn Fein are doing the right thing, I think many have been opposed to NATO for many years, and not without reason (North Atlantic Treaty Organization, operating in Afghanistan etc) - its complicated, and there were two sides to this - thats from my exp in college.

I think this is an attempt to build a 'cavity wall' between them, and PbP - i have a friend who compaigns for PbP, and they asked me what i thought. I felt i had to be stark and say, if it were me, i would disassociate from them. PbP are in a state of what i will call 'Moral Confusion', and willfully so, it seems. I voted for them in the past (not 1st prefs but certainly they were in the mix) - that will NOT be the case now

Im happy for any political party or politician to alter position. It means they are in touch with reality.

I haven't read all of the back and forth posts but your sentence about not having played the lotto since a quick pick was €2 and being more of a Kings crisps fan just reminds me so much of call centre employees desperately answering questions about what the weather is like where they are and where they live to try and convince me that they actually are based in Ireland.

I have no interest in where you actually are, that just leapt out and amused me.

I think in one respect we are all so used to having certain views of USFP, and Western Policy making since 9/11. Many mistakes, missteps and willful misadventure. We are also all used to their being some balance to these conflicts. My uncle who i met at a wedding this weekend, stated that he is having great issues deciding on this.

'Liam, its being portrayed as the most black and white war since vietnam.' - its a valid point. The problem, as i see it, is the failings of the past 20+ years, means we all EXPECT balance. And are actively looking for it. But IMHO, its not present. This conflict is as black and white as its possible to get. Its the most black and white since world war 2 - imho

i think there is a willful 'moral confusion' in equating many of these previous crises with what we are witnessing in the current situation. One of my favorite authors Sam Harris talks frequently about 'Intention' as being vital to understanding the goals and judgement of a state or non-state actor. If we look at previous conflicts and ask the 'intention' question; it is very difficult. Iraq (topple Saddam, democratize, Oil, etc). Afghanistan (Topple the Taliban, democratize, natural resources etc)

The intention in this crisis,is fairly blunt. Russia is trying to conquer the Ukraine, either by destroying their government and replacing it with a puppet - or full scale annexation.

politics 101 - the world has changed. I expect all (most anyway) are re-evaluating their positions on many issues, from irish neutrality, to NATO, to EU Militarization. Name calling is politics 101 imho

I couldn't agree with you more. Two patterns ,may emerge from this situation.

One is in touch with reality. The world has changed. They are AWARE of this. There positions reflect this. Certainly old opinions will be weaponized and we can expect much name calling and hypocrisy being thrown around.

The other is NOT in touch with reality. Will continue to offer 'morally confused' positions on NATO Imperialism. and EU Aggression. Will also (imho) become very difficult to take seriously

With regard to providing accommodation for refugees, I’m a little worried about the potential legal aspects of this. What if you eventually need them to leave or it simply doesn’t work out? Are they protected under tenancy law?

I believe anyone living in a property after 6 months is protected ,but if you are living with someone who invited by the owner occupier you to stay they are a licencee and can be kicked out at any time

The red cross said they will review the accommodations after 6 months , there will be issues going forward

We have not seen aerial bombings - YET.

What we have seen is an escalation of force, and deliberate targeting of civilian infrastructure - followed swiftly by outrageous statements that 'said buildings were occupied by NAZI/Nationalist troops'

Its not speculation to suggest that things will continue to escalate. We MAY YET SEE, more deliberate use of indiscriminate munitions. Another point of confusion, you mention 'precision munitions' - as to suggest Russia is using them. Well, they aren't very precise are they? Hospitals? Factories? Apartment blocks?

I wont touch the equivocation between Iraq and the Ukraine - trying to compare the two conflicts is pure confusion and false equivalency

I presume you didn’t accuse your uncle of being a Putin apologist or Russian bot for expressing a different opinion.

I presume you didn’t ignore your uncle and recommend everyone else do the same because his interpretation of events was different from yours.

Well while i have questioned Putin's state as a rational actor - its ambiguous at the moment. His government is using 'Loud Speaker Diplomacy' on a grand scale these days. And its counter productive, as they have united the west against them. When Switzerland decides to sanction a state, said state should take notice.

RE the Western media painting Russia using indiscriminate tactics - i dont think they need to. I think it is fairly obvious that civilian infrastructure is being targeted. If Russia have not used Aerial bombings, or purely indiscriminate weapons. OK we can accept this. Seemingly what they have done, is use 'precision capable weapons' with the 'precision settings switched to ZERO'. This may have a lot to do with optics, and the perception they wish to convey both domestically and internationally. And it is subject to change, if the war continues and Ukraine maintains defiance to Moscow.

Yes indeed, there has been several videos emerging recently of mass graves in Mariupol and clearly the people being buried were civilians, not Ukrainian soldiers.

Seriously you don't actually believe that

Yes - there were several pregnant ladies injured in the attack. At least one is seemingly ok. Sky news carried a picture of the lady and her new born baby, and they were alive. Sadly this lady didnt make it, nor did her baby.

There has been much said by Russia in relation to this attack. I wont over use links and such, as most have been posted elsewhere. Rough summary of the Russian LIES would be

• Use of crisis actors - ladies wearing heavy make up
• The hospital was Empty
• The hospital was 'being used by Neo Nazi Paramilitary units' (lavrov)
• 'We did not actually attack the hospital it was the Ukrainian nationalists' (Russian military)

Utterly despicable - a disgrace

I saw someone mention that 'If Russia tells you its raining, you should definitely check' - i would go as far as to say, if they tell you its raining, ASSUME A SUNNY CLOUDLESS DAY

No different lady.

And to think it was Played down by some as a propaganda even suggesting the maternity hospital was a legitimate military target