30k speed limits for all urban areas on the way

Flinty997 · 21-03-2022 1:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813570#Comment_118813570

But the intent is to have go slower all the time. Not just when its congested.

I'm not sure why this is difficult to grasp.

Flinty997 · 21-03-2022 1:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813564#Comment_118813564

While I would agree the limit of 30 is stupid in the park on the main road.

A car with speed limiter or cruise control will solve the problem of being unable to drive at those speeds. Danger of severe injury increases with speed not decreases. Though if a speed limit is inappropriate it can increase the frequency of minor accidents. They can't reapply argue its about safety when there isn't a single pedestrian crossing on the road.

Cyclists were moved to road to deconflict them from pedestrians. That's a story with a long history. As its the fallacy of mandatory cycle lanes. You can't really have a valid opinion of either if you are not aware of the history or the research into it.

You can't really argue it increase or decreases danger without statistics. But there are no reliable statistic or metrics for either argument on this road or path.

The ultimate aim in the park is to remove the majority of car traffic. The OPW have not been shy about this over many years.

AndrewJRenko · 21-03-2022 1:49pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813442#Comment_118813442

Please keep up.

21-03-2022 1:49pm

I use adaptive cruise control to maintain an indicated 32kmph in a 30kmph zone which runs for a nearly 3KM uninterupted on the far side of the river much to the chagrin of the cyclists(not commuter cyclists) behind me who seem to think the rules don't apply to them. They could slipstream behind my car and obey the speed limit but don't like it.

It is 30kmph because that particular side of the River attracts a lot of pedestrian tourists. There is also a separated bike lane there but this particular type of cyclist doesn't like being slowed down by commuter cyclists either.

Seth Brundle · 21-03-2022 1:50pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813493#Comment_118813493

What is the definition of urban area?

You might define it as a built up area but you are trying to define something to suit an approach to road safety that may also include small villages so I won't box myself into a simple definition here.

For instance is the Rock Road in Booterstown to Blackrock included as it is urban area?

What about Stillorgan dual carriageway or the Wolfe Tone Quay or Victoria Quay out at Heuston station?

What about Dublin Road out by Parkway shopping centre in Limerick or the Ballysimon Road ?

Is the Lough Atalia Road in Galway part of Galway city that the Chief Superintendent wants to implement as a 30kph zone ?

These are roads and not "areas".

Have you asked the Galway Chief Super why he wants to change the limit to 30km/h?

As for the likes of Victoria Quay in Dublin, there are a lot of people either walking or cycling along there. Plus you have large trucks exiting the Diageo plant coupled with traffic changing lanes. Do you really think we should allow faster speeds here and what is your assesment based on?

And we all know why a Garda wants to bring this in and it is because it will be like shooting fish in a barrel for his lads to dish out penalty points and more importantly fines that will make his division and by extension himself look good.

Why? There is plenty of speeding and other road traffic offences being routinely committed but the resources aren't there to police them. The fish in a barrel line is a common enough one to throw out there (I used to throw it out there myself) but look around - where and when was the last garda speed check you saw?

Most people would consider these to be in the cities concerned, but yet they are pretty good roads and critical to moving traffic into and out of the cities.

And what? If they are suitable for speeds higher than 30km/h then they will get them.

A 30kph on these roads would be infantile, but we all know how some will go to any lengths to push their agenda.

Road safety is for all road users not just the ones in the big metal boxes. Surely if experts decide that it is not safe for all road users and there are no alternatives for those whose safety would be compromised by a higher limit, then having a higher limit is not suitable? I'm not sure what is infantile about that. Plus there is no agenda in saying that!

Remember the clammer by some for a zero drink drive limit that would have your granny over the limit due to her sherry trifle.

Nobody is looking for a zero drink driving limit so I'm not sure why you add this!

AndrewJRenko · 21-03-2022 1:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813685#Comment_118813685

The rules don't apply to them. Speed limits don't apply to cyclists.

Did you know already know this?

km991148 · 21-03-2022 1:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813685#Comment_118813685

The 30kmph rules don't apply to them. There is no legal accurate way to measure the speed. It is a bit annoying being held up with vehicular traffic tbh, but if I want to use the city by bike its something I just have to put up with.. thats the point, its all about compromise.

Question - on the motorway - lots of trucks at ~100kmph and a clear overtaking lane.. do you overtake at 120 - or are you the "particular type" of driver that doesn't like being slown down by slower traffic? Who cares if a cyclist uses a non cycling lane - you should still be grateful they aren't taking up even more space in a car and have already contributed to a smaller size of traffic.

Seth Brundle · 21-03-2022 1:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813685#Comment_118813685

I use adaptive cruise control to maintain an indicated 32kmph in a 30kmph zone which runs for a nearly 3KM uninterupted on the far side of the river much to the chagrin of the cyclists(not commuter cyclists) behind me who seem to think the rules don't apply to them. They could slipstream behind my car and obey the speed limit but don't like it.

I assume the river is the Liffey. When I cycle along there I don't slipstream behind cars becaue I'm using the bus lane &/or cycle path. I've yet to see people cycling choose not to use these and trail one of the cars in the adjacent lane!

It is 30kmph because that particular side of the River attracts a lot of pedestrian tourists. There is also a separated bike lane there but this particular type of cyclist doesn't like being slowed down by commuter cyclists either.

I'm curious to know what "this particular type of cyclist" means. You do know that you simply referring to a persion on a bike and they are no different to a person in a car (although possibly healthier!) and no different to a person walking along.

Or do you mean that they don't like being held up by someone moving more slowly than them? Where have I heard that before?

km991148 · 21-03-2022 2:01pm

Inflammatory language like "particular type" just conjures up the image of a person that sees all cyclists as a homogenous group, each with a target on their back.

I could be wrong in that assertion, but that's what springs to mind.

21-03-2022 2:07pm

IMO, everything inside of the canals in Dublin (and east of Islandbridge / Kilmainham) should be 30kph without exception, and cameras installed. Outside of that, key arterial roads could be 50kph by exception (but all residential still 30kph)

Flinty997 · 21-03-2022 2:07pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813685#Comment_118813685

If you are a fast cyclist, you aren't held up by anything, other than your leg power. As the bike lane isn't mandatory unless its indicated as such. So they could just use the car lane and do whatever speed they like. So I'm not sure why a cyclist would be annoyed at what speed a car is going, its irrelevant to a cyclists speed.

Flinty997 · 21-03-2022 2:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813775#Comment_118813775

Well if its not enforced its meaningless.

if through planning you run a lot of traffic through suburb areas on feeder roads, what's an arterial road becomes fuzzy.

21-03-2022 2:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813684#Comment_118813684

Please keep within the broad postal code of the discussion and you'll find things progress swimmingly.

AndrewJRenko · 21-03-2022 2:16pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813802#Comment_118813802

Please keep to your own lane and stop trying to moderate. If you've a problem with my post, report it.

TheTruth89 · 21-03-2022 2:16pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118758411#Comment_118758411

https://www.rsa.ie/news-events/news/details/2022/01/01/2021-records-lowest-number-of-road-fatalities-since-recording-began-in-1959

The current system seems to be working fairly well, 30km is ridiculously slow, i can only imagine the tail backs and chaos it would cause in most places... school runs or travelling around that time would be great craic with those rules..

Flinty997 · 21-03-2022 2:31pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813828#Comment_118813828

Depends on how you define well...

https://greennews.ie/dublin-congested-europe/

Seth Brundle · 21-03-2022 2:32pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813828#Comment_118813828

The middle of a pandemic when most people are not out driving is probably not the best time to make year-on-year comparisons on road safety!

21-03-2022 2:36pm

The 30kmph zone referred to is not the Liffey and not in Ireland and these cyclists are engaging in their "Hobby" not with a view to reach a destination as part of their daily activities. As the road is well paved but narrow and with oncoming traffic and many pedestrians these cyclists are unable to overtake and see motorists abiding by speed limits as a hinderance to their pursuit of their activities.

30km is 15km below the speed limit for Mopeds and Quadricyles, neither of which require a conventional driving licence in this jurisdiction.

Flinty997 · 21-03-2022 2:45pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118813933#Comment_118813933

Your theory being if someone wanted to go fast for leisure they would choose a route congested with traffic both cars and pedestrians rather than somewhere that isn't.

That makes sense to you?

Flinty997 · 21-03-2022 2:47pm

30km is 15km below the speed limit for Mopeds and Quadricyles, neither of which require a conventional driving licence in this jurisdiction.

Er what?

21-03-2022 2:48pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814000#Comment_118814000

They want to use this road because there is a particularly impressive sight to behold. That is also the reason why there are so many tourists on foot. Having to patiently travel behind other road users obeying the rules of the road is the fly in the ointment for these cyclists.

Flinty997 · 21-03-2022 2:50pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814019#Comment_118814019

I think this road is in your imagination or you wouldn't be so coy about it.

21-03-2022 2:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814014#Comment_118814014

Do you not think that other Local and National governments have to address speed restriction topics.

Quadricycles and Mopeds here have a maximum speed limit of 45kmph as they are intended for use in Urban areas.

Certain people on this thread believe that a higher speed limit is reckless.

21-03-2022 3:01pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814037#Comment_118814037

we've been through this before. I don't disclose information about my situation as some other posters here are abusive.

Flinty997 · 21-03-2022 3:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814047#Comment_118814047

The speed limit for a road is not the same as for the vehicle classification. Do you really not realize the difference.

km991148 · 21-03-2022 3:08pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814019#Comment_118814019

Sounds like you have a bit of a chip on your shoulder about cyclists.

The roads are for the public to use. There is no entitlement to its use based on mode of transport or reasons for using a particular mode of transport.

If the area is popular (like Howth for example) then it can hardly be a surprise that it's busy and maybe you should consider moving to somewhere less busy? Of course no doubt you want to enjoy the specific properties of the area exclusively. I'm sorry, it just doesn't work like that and you may as well get used to it, as things will only get worse as populations increase and vehicular traffic increases.

21-03-2022 3:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814177#Comment_118814177

Of course but they have good reason to tally. I've been ticketed in the past for trying to observe a 30kmph speed limts which was actually 20kmph. Thankfully there aren't too many of those zones around.

km991148 · 21-03-2022 3:13pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814216#Comment_118814216

I'm lost?

The mopeds etc are limited as that was a random "safe" number chosen years ago.

The road speed limits were the same. Now they are being revised as the conditions have changed (more traffic for one).

21-03-2022 3:14pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814196#Comment_118814196

Sounds like you are in the habit of jumping to conclusions based on personal prejudices.

km991148 · 21-03-2022 3:15pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814253#Comment_118814253

Ok, but that's what your rants about a certain type of cyclist sound like. Explain why I'm wrong?

Incidentally if those cyclists are riding dangerously or causing issues or acting illegally, I'd say report them.

Edit: I have no personal prejudice, just based on what you have written these past few posts.

I'm interested in your view point, but don't want you to feel ganged up on or anything.

21-03-2022 3:16pm

Did I mention that there are also 25kmph restricted Mopeds too but the availability of Pedelecs and emmissions controls means they are a dying breed.

21-03-2022 3:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814266#Comment_118814266

Which cyclist in spandex with no licence plate should I report or should I rather expect them to stop and give me their name and registered postal address so that I may report them to the police?

AndrewJRenko · 21-03-2022 3:33pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814311#Comment_118814311

Have you ever managed to report a burglary or an assault? Did the perp wear a licence plate?

What's your obsession with what other people wear all about?

km991148 · 21-03-2022 3:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814311#Comment_118814311

there you go.. "which cyclist in spandex..." sounds very chippy to me..

But seriously - if there is a persistent problem, then I am sure your local authority would be interested in taking action. They take safety concerns seriously. Maybe they could drop the speed limit or put some humps down. Especially if people are being injured or killed.

21-03-2022 3:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814266#Comment_118814266

Since my bike is within touching distance of me here where I sit I don't see how I could be prejudiced against bikes or cyclists in general. I do find there is a very vocal majority who are very quick to proclaim their rights and injustices they percieve to have suffered while oblivious to the needs of other road users including those pedestrians, other cyclists, moped users, public transport users, motorists, mobilty carts and motorists.

I do find that they represent a risk to pedestrians in particular as just a painted line separate cyclists from pedestrians on manz of the busiest thoroghfares. I often shelter behind the safety of street furniture while waiting to cross at intersections as some of the cyclists can't be trusted to give pedestrians space.

km991148 · 21-03-2022 3:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814407#Comment_118814407

I mean personally I can't stand the new obsession with baggy jeans. tbh - that is a safety issue if people are cycling about on them. But I fear this is going beyond the thread topic.

21-03-2022 3:43pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814407#Comment_118814407

Here you go dragging off topic again. I'm not going to outline why people don't report theft or burglary in Dublin these days and where they do it is usually only for PULSE number. Stick on topic.

km991148 · 21-03-2022 3:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814452#Comment_118814452

You keep quoting a certain stereotype of cyclist. Maybe there is a prevalence of this type in your area, I have no clue. But I would engage the local authority instead of moaning on a thread about lowering the speed limits in built up areas.

AndrewJRenko · 21-03-2022 3:49pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814477#Comment_118814477

Hilarious how you bring up the question of reporting offences and cyclist clothing and then accuse me of going off topic.

Yet again, please keep up.

https://mobile.twitter.com/oconnoroisin/status/1196727373028372480

magicbastarder · 21-03-2022 3:54pm

i am curious as to which road this is which has so many cyclists who are irritated about having to draft behind a car at 32km/h.

21-03-2022 3:56pm

You see, I am asked to describe the Cyclists who are breaking speed limits(100% on topic) and in an attempt to describe them without bringing the rest of the cycling public(of which I am a member) in to discussion I point out that they typically wear cycling clothing so you see that as an opportunity to bait me.

Can you understand why nobody is able to engage with you with regard to any subject on this platform?

km991148 · 21-03-2022 3:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814559#Comment_118814559

ok - so - let me ask - do you have a chip on your shoulder or an other problem about what you perceive to be "leisure cyclists" - i.e. cyclists that are not commuting (or otherwise using their bicycles for whatever approved list of activities you think is acceptable).

Does that term work?

And follow up question - what problem are these cyclists causing (in your area)? - as that might have been lost in the noise.

magicbastarder · 21-03-2022 4:00pm

Cyclists who are breaking speed limits(100% on topic)

100% on topic, 0% of cyclists

21-03-2022 4:02pm

The hate that some have for cyclists is nothing other than amusing to me

21-03-2022 4:02pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814510#Comment_118814510

Considering the bike to work scheme has been running for many years do you think this rusted bike is a representative example of the type of bike which members of the public have in their possession or rather a deflection of the legitimate concerns of other multi-modal road users?

21-03-2022 4:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814582#Comment_118814582

0%? seriously. Speed limits certainly apply to cyclists in this jurisdiction.

magicbastarder · 21-03-2022 4:07pm

no, they don't. this is basic stuff. you've been arguing with people on this forum long enough and seem to claim to know your stuff to such an extent, so as to not know that is amazing.

21-03-2022 4:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814578#Comment_118814578

"leisure cyclist" is a leading definition. I cycle for leisure and also for various errands but cycling at speed is not something all cyclists find enjoyable. You cast your net too wide.

km991148 · 21-03-2022 4:15pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814638#Comment_118814638

So really fitter leisure cyclists capable of higher speeds? I am still not quite sure your issue here? Is it because they are wearing clothing appropriate to their activity? Do you have an issue with joggers on the pavement? Or people driving boats to the harbour?

21-03-2022 4:15pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118814625#Comment_118814625

We are dealing with an Urban bye-law speed limit ruling which as yet and hopefully never will be implemented. The conversation is about an irreal situation. modh coinníollach or wunschsatz. That is the discussion. You are trying to frame the discussion retrospectively.

30k speed limits for all urban areas on the way

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