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"Green" policies are destroying this country

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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,242 ✭✭✭brokenangel


    Not sure what the point of this rant is?

    You do realise a house with bad insulation is cost the tax payer more as they burn heating oil which has to be paid for. So by upgrading houses it costs less for the state to run them than before.

    I have no idea about top up electricity cards or what system is put in place, but if they get oil to heat the house why do you suddenly think they get nothing to use electricity to heat the house? are you aware of anything you posted above actually happening in real life?



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,072 ✭✭✭✭Furze99


    May not be a problem for much longer as public tolerance of the nonsense of carbon taxes will reach peak levels in a month. If this government imposes additional carbon taxes in May, they're fecked. Expect the ears of every TD to be severely & repeatedly burnt.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,150 ✭✭✭opinionated3


    Speaking of "real life", you still haven't answered the question of how working people with mortgages and other bills are supposed to handle the added( and not insignificant) debt that the greens expect them to take on with these "upgrades".



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,304 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78




  • Registered Users Posts: 10,377 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Just following your logic with the condescending tone.

    Fine. You don’t think In the midst of a gas shortage that the UK will keep the lights and heat solely for its own people but will keep us in the loop also, especially when they know that we have barryroe gas field undeveloped because reasons.

    That’s great however I think it’s highly naive on your part.

    We are going around in circles here so I’ll leave it there.

    Best of luck.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,358 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69


    Yet are expected to pay for other peoples upgrades when they can’t afford it themselves?



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,242 ✭✭✭brokenangel


    This was all discussed in detail about the cost to upgrade a house. I suggest you read the thread. An upgrade as everyone has agreed can start at 15 euro. Read the thread and if still unclear come back to me but I suggest it already has been answered



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,242 ✭✭✭brokenangel


    If a person is in social housing they get everything paid for anyway. Making that house more efficient will save the government money. You are going to pay for it anyway.

    I don't understand your logic apart from having a moan at people in social housing.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,150 ✭✭✭opinionated3


    Those that can't, won't. And will be continually punished for this by added "green" taxes. How is that in any way fair FFS



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,304 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    yes, there will always be some in society that simply will never be able to afford such needs, hence our creation of the welfare system, but we ve put impossible limitations in place to maintain this, we ll have to urgently change these limitations, as the workforce simply cannot pay for it all, we still havent truly accepted these limitations, and the urgent need to change them....



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,358 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69


    My logic is I don’t want to pay for someone to get something that I can’t afford to get myself.


    Pretty simple logic.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,049 ✭✭✭Mecanudo


    I did not refer to "the rising price of gas". I detailed the costs relating to electricity generation, electricity prices, the current policy towards that and future security of supply

    But I guess from what you're saying that despite your protests here - you don't agree with Mr Ryans policies providing additional gas generation plants no? You better let him know you know better. We have more renewables than ever and yet with the EU green marginal price policy for energy costs - electricity prices have never been higher. Go figure.

    And as detailed it's already been shown that a safe, secure and reliable source of natural gas is needed to provide stability with regard to renewable energy generation over the next 30 years. To do that we need to avail of our own available and known resources and reserves and/or LNG. Which bit do you not understand?

    The cost of any LNG facility will be covered by whichever company has contracted to build the facility , and whilst the price of gas will be the same as other sources of gas as per the market at that point - what that does ensure is a security of supply as highlighted by the Commission for the Regulation of Utilities

    "All of this has been explained to you many many times. And you accuse others of "ranting". Give us a break.

    Post edited by Mecanudo on


  • Registered Users Posts: 4,242 ✭✭✭brokenangel


    You made up a ridiculous scenario which as I said makes no sense and companies use risk. As you couldn't answer my question as usual the poster starts with condescending comments to try and get a reaction. Exactly what you have done so you don't have to answer the questions I raised. This is not the first time you have thrown your toys out of the pram when you couldn't answer a question. I doubt it will be the last



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,242 ✭✭✭brokenangel




  • Registered Users Posts: 858 ✭✭✭jolivmmx


    What about the people earning 30k per annum? They will never be able to fund the Green projects. They are the people who are switching off their heating. And they are in the poor energy-rating homes. How will Greens help them? When you have a mortgage and earn 30k, 5k can be a huge amount. The Greens don’t get this



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,242 ✭✭✭brokenangel


    This is a broader conversation, I think covid when we had 500k people out of work and the tax intake didn't decrease shows the huge issue we have in Ireland. People rant about "make the rich pay" while ignoring huge sections of Ireland pay nothing toward the running of Ireland. We need a more level system that everyone contributes



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,304 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    unfortunately they dont, and this is becoming a major issue for them, they simply dont understand where most works are, the fact they simply cannot pay much more tax and take on even more debt, so something is going to have to give....



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,049 ✭✭✭Mecanudo


    Why what's the problem - are you seriously suggesting the Commission for the Regulation of Utilities is lying?

    I quoted the relevant section. Go off and dig up the entirety of it if you really are interested. And I don't know what articles you've been reading about Barryroe but I'd suggest you do a bit of research about a) the estimated end date of the corrib gas field and b) the plan of extraction for Barryroe if and when Eamon gets his finger out of his hole. Which of course is exactly what is currently holding up the entire project. But more importantly the issue is not necessarily the immediacy of any start date for extraction, rather that we need a safe, secure and reliable source of natural gas for the next 30 years up to 2050 and beyond. The sooner we get started on that the better

    Post edited by Mecanudo on


  • Registered Users Posts: 858 ✭✭✭jolivmmx


    It is easy to be a proponent of Green policies when you occupy the upper echelons of society. But for the ordinary person, who is literally trying to cut down on the electricity and number of excursions in the car, they cannot be shilled for any more.

    The Greens focus too much on a push policy and not enough on a pull. They should be promoting initiatives like Too Good To Go, good transport, plastic-alternatives and long-lasting consumables. They need to ask what the average person is willing to tolerate. They seem unable to do this.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,358 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69




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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,150 ✭✭✭opinionated3


    The thread is 213 pages long, I won't be going back over it. The point I'm making is still valid. The greens want us all to have electric cars, heat pumps and major insulation upgrades carried out at our own expense, unless you're on social welfare.

    The average cost of these upgrades is huge, and rising all the time. Most people on the average wage simply cannot afford this. In the meantime the greens will continue to implement tax hikes to further punish those who don't go along with their wishes/demands.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,304 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    wealth distribution is a highly complex beast globally, not just here, yes wealthier individuals definitely should be paying higher taxes, again, not just here, but globally, but wealth is also accumulating in wealthy institutions and corporations etc. theres clearly a strong resistance to increasing taxation on these wealthy entities, and the fact, even trying to do so, its bloody complicated, due to the ease of movement of capital globally. taxation alone also wont solve these issues, wealth is generally stored in the value of assets such as property and land, but yet we re still strongly opposed to appropriately taxing this wealth, this resistance also exists in the so called political left, this to needs to be urgently dealt with. asset ownership is also a major issue, as it is tending towards a skewed profile, again this is generally how we store wealth, but is we continue towards this skewing, we still have a major problem, i.e. we need to find functioning ways to spread this ownership, known methods are available to us, but yet we still resist their implementation.. taxation alone wont solve this, we also need to embrace rising public debt, or we re probably fcuked!



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,073 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    So what is your answer to the risks identified by the CRU. The same as the Green Party, cross our fingers and hope for the best ?

    The electric link is a two way street, but again you have not taken the time to think it through. If the U.K. should decide to cut off the Moffat pipelines then we would not be able to generate enough electricity for our own needs so why do you seem to believe the U.K. would then make up the shortfall by supplying us through and electricity link ?

    We do not have our own LNG terminal at present, but there is nothing preventing us building our own, other than the Green Party proposal to ban LNG, and that proposal imo is looking less and less likely to be passed into law.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,073 ✭✭✭✭charlie14




  • Registered Users Posts: 928 ✭✭✭Jakey Rolling


    Smartgrid Dashboard showing renewables have contributed just 12% to electricity generation this past fine week - the balance made up by 75% fossil fuels and 4.5% net import. Next to no wind generation on 4 out of 7 days.

    Really need to sort out storage/conversion of all these renewables before we cut back further on the fossil fuels - a good dose of solar would help smooth things out for the daylight hours I guess.

    100412.2526@compuserve.com



  • Registered Users Posts: 858 ✭✭✭jolivmmx


    I do not know why the Greens are so opposed to Nuclear. It seems the obvious solution. There is no way that solar, hydro and wind are going to satiate our energy requirements as a country



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,242 ✭✭✭brokenangel


    That just proves ireland has not invested in renewable

    When the sun is baking the country and we have no electricity been generated



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,242 ✭✭✭brokenangel


    I suggest you read the thread.

    Also I think we can all get past the “ Ireland will build an LNG” just to cover up for you not understanding a 3rd party would own it



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,073 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    I would suggest that you actually read what the chairperson of a state regulatory agency of Eamon Ryan`s Ministry for the Environment, Climate and Communications said in relation to energy security but I doubt it would make much difference. The last time someone suggested you do that you came back with you believing she had identified one of the dangers to energy security being a ship sinking and rupturing a LNG pipeline. She did not. She was referring to a Moffat pipeline and you still haven`t corrected that.

    Where are you getting this crazy idea that if the state built a LNG terminal that a 3rd party would own it ?

    Do you somehow believe, or is it a Green Party policy, that if the state builds any infrastructure then it just hands it over to someone ?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,073 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    It would take a hell of a lot of solar panels to make up the remaining 88%. Especially when you consider they add nothing during nighttime and we have Winters with long nights and weak daytime sunshine.



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