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How does push button start work so well with just 1 attempt?

  • 02-04-2022 1:13am
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 83,517 ✭✭✭✭
    M


    Tried Googling this but couldn't get an answer, I've driven a few cars with push button start, all petrols so far, what I have noticed is never once is there any kind of hesitation or need to repress or keep pressed to start the car, it seems to give the car a bigger boost than if you were starting using a key. This is the same on cold mornings, after a long drive, after a period of non use etc. I've driven relatively new cars with key start and sometimes you will need to give it a longish turnover in order for the engine to start.

    Anyone know how does it work so well or have I just been lucky so far?



Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,917 ✭✭✭✭Toyotafanboi


    I think it's psychological vs a key because with a start button you dont have to hold it while the engine cranks, you just press and release and the car fires up, not like with a key where you turn it to start position and hold it there for the duration of the cranking before releasing.


    In reality the cranking time is no different, just the time you have to commit to it is much lesser with a push button.


    That being said, a little known thing (i think) is that you dont have to hold the key to crank in most modern cars anyway. If you just flick the key to start position and let go immediately the engine will keep cranking and start up by itself.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,507 ✭✭✭cml387


    Nearly all cars start immediately regardless of push button or key.

    I remember my 2004 Megane with push button would be very reluctant to start if I had previously moved the car a short distance (e.g. to let Mrs CML out). I guess it confused the ECU.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,887 ✭✭✭zg3409


    Newer cars prepare before you actually start car. Many cars when drivers door is opened they will start the heater coils for the diesel, prime the fuel pump and build up pressure in fuel rails etc.

    Many cars when you hit start will delay a bit, display "starting" on display but not actually crank until engine is primed and ready. With newer ECUs etc they can adjust the mix and disable headlights, all to help starting. Often the A/C will delay for 5 or 10 seconds too.


    If you are comparing like for like on same year car with and without button start then it's probably physiological.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,012 ✭✭✭route66


    From my own experience, push buttons are "intelligent" and keys are not. Generally a push button will do whatever is necessary to get things going, whereas a key is - or is percieved to be - manual.

    One of my first experiences of owning a "push button" was a 2004 Toyota Verso. Driving it in traffic when it was brand new, I stalled it at the lights. I pressed the button and waited. And waited. It wouldn't start! I tried the old trick of trying the button again and using the starter motor to move me to the side of the road. No use - the "intelligence" immediately cut the power to the starter motor when it figured out what I was doing. So I pushed it instead - yes, a brand-new Toyota being pushed to the side of the road. Got a few funny looks as well. I waited a minute or two and tried it again. This time it fired up as if nothing was wrong and continued to do so for the remaining 10 years we owned the car.

    In this case, the "intelligence" of a starter button wasn't intelligent enough.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,478 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    In that case there is a clutch switch on the Verso so it will not start or restart unless the clutch is pressed. Otherwise it just cycles through off/acc/on positions when you press the button.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,012 ✭✭✭route66


    This was different: I dipped the clutch with the car in first gear, pressed the starter button and *then* slowly released the clutch hoping it would get me to the side of the road like a less intelligent car would. It was at this point the "intelligence" decided that it wouldn't allow me ...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 73,478 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    Of course. It was doing what it was designed to do (prevent the car from being started accidentally or in a way that would damage the car)

    Cars with regular keys do that too now.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,012 ✭✭✭route66



    I know, but I'm just making the point that sometimes half-baked intelligence is considerably worse than no intelligence at all. I knew what I was doing, I wanted the car to do what I wanted it to do - to move safely to the side of the road without having to get out of the car on a busy urban road with 2 kids in the back and push it across 2 lanes - and some half-baked intelligence wouldn't allow me. Sometimes humans know better. Well, some of the time ...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,603 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    Definitely true. The occasions I've sat and waited in the car for a few mins before starting resulted in the start-up procedure taking much longer. It's was quite a clever idea to initiate the startup on driver door opening tbh.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,815 ✭✭✭creedp


    Wait till full autonomous driving arrives. Wont be able to do a quick 'Uy' when the need/desire strikes!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,012 ✭✭✭route66


    Very true, and from what I've seen and read about to date, I'm not looking forward to the day.

    I wouldn't consider myself to be a luddite, but some of the autonomy today is dangerous/annoying - Tesla's sometimes do scary things when driving autononomously. Even some "ordinary" cars with adaptive cruise control and/or lane departure systems can lock on the brakes for no reason on an open road. Going back a few years, I was shocked when told by the proud owner of a Passat TDI in the late 90s that the engine wouldn't rev if the brakes were applied. This - in the days before VWs brought out the DSG gearbox - meant an end to heal-and-toe downchanges which could either be done for fun or to save the clutch.

    On some new cars, various "nanny" modes are enabled by default requiring a pre-flight process to disable them before you set off. Every time. If new cars are really that clever (and they're not), then a cheap fingerprint reader borrowed from a €100 smartphone could be used to allow the owner to digitally authorise the default startup to disable these.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 267 ✭✭Codpeas


    Last bit you said is exactly what my car does - flick the key and then the car takes care of doing whatever is needed - and it's 14yrs old! (Audi A6)



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