Food security

Our biggest problem would be access to and the price of fuel as farming is dependent on heavy machinery.

Don’t we import most or a lot of fuel from the Norwegians if my memory is correct? It’s strictly a business alliance as Norway are not in the eu..

Finally, Thank you, - I was waiting for someone to start this thread for over 2 weeks now.

So I think you're comparing apples and oranges.

Yes, we are one of the most food secure countries on the planet in that we produce enough to feed 11 times our population.

However yes, we import more calories because of two things.

1, a lot of what we export is raw protein ie meat and dairy, whilst we import almost ALL our sugar and most of our carbs.

2, We import a lot of animal feed which I'd make a guess is included in those figures.

We have more than enough food to feed our population but many may not like the diet so much.

Fortunately for those of us with a long genetic lineage here, our ancestors survived on potatoes and buttermilk for a couple of hundred years before that went pear shaped, and if you go back even further, we have the highest level of lactose tolerance, - yes tolerance, in the world amongst our population because from about 4500 to 1500 years ago we were all living on sour milk, cows blood, butter, and beef, - according to contemporary accounts and recent archaeology.

We've always been the 'cow people' of Western Europe.

Be grand... chill. ;-)

Only skimmed that article, I would have thought that we could feed ourselves if we dramatically changed what we eat (reduce consumption of food that isn't/can't be produced here ) and farmed more intensively. Then again the three fs would be big factors for the latter.

Re: fertiliser, how much of the nutrients from our organic fertiliser (slurry) end up leeching into steams and rivers. Also, the weather and the issues getting machinery onto land affect application of fertiliser

Our high rating for food security may be based on what we could potentially do and based on various assumptions rather than what we actually do. As can be seen with the recent situation where someone had the genius idea of "let's plant crops", it's not a trivial matter to make changes.

Saw a great line from a Ukrainian farmer.

That they are the first front but the 2nd one will be in North Africa.

It's the impact on food prices doubling that we worry about, no one here will starve though diet maybe become less exciting and varied.

Have seen estimates that we will drop a billion litres of milk this year, hard to gauge the drop in beef as it will be softened by dairy cows going to the factory, which will affect both milk and beef for years to come.

Inputs for agriculture have left all reason or relativity to price behind.

Every one I know in Agriculture is cutting yield this year, no choice.

50% of global export wheat is West of the Urals, from export ban, little sowing and short of fertilizer and spray at best. Yields Will be significantly down down in a way we haven't seen globally since WW2.

Urea at its cheapest is quickly approaching 4 times average of previous years, that's going to be a problem in Asia where nitrogen is thrown out on fields at rates and abandon that are truly shocking.

The idea of Putin using a small nuke in Kiev is way behind the impact he'll have globally, even if he does it, the food crisis is an existential threat to Europe.

Nor is there any political urgency to tackle it.

How big will the food drop be is the only question.

Pine needles, fill a cup with needles, gently bruise em, put Luke warm water in, drink after 30 minutes.

The vitamin c of 6 oranges

Very interesting. Tks.

I was watching a presentation by Peter Zeihan (skip to 17 mins in) when this image about calorie imports caught my attention. Ireland in red, huh??

Looking further: Can Ireland feed itself? Options for greater food security in a climate changed world

"Climate change" ain't an issue here, the document frames that incorrectly but the numbers raise a major question about Irish agricultural output and food processing here in Ireland. Much of our food relies on long supply chains.

Why don't you plant veg in your own back garden? It will cost you more than you can buy it for, but why not do it? It will also cost you a chunk later on to revert it back to grass, but ignore that.

Once you have that done, why don't you dig up your front garden and plant veg in it too? You can sell it to other people at the same price they can get it in Aldi (i.e. at a loss)

Your conclusion is not correct. The fact that a lot of what people eat here is imported does not mean that we do not produce enough food.

People's eating habits have changed along with increased prosperity and availability of choice. We produce more than we can eat, but people want other things which do not grow here.

It just means you might have to cut back on the rice and pasta and start buying spuds again.

No, you missed the point. You cannot produce vegetables in your back garden cheaper than you can get them from Aldi.

Likewise, most farmers cannot produce vegetables cheaper than Aldi or Tesco will pay for them. Farmers who grow veg are nowadays specialist, effectively industrial, operations. There are some that produce small scale for niche premium markets like organic, but in the main it's "go big or go home". The margins for the farmer are way too small. The farmers has no power in those dynamics. The retailers have huge power and make the profit.

Why should a farmer produce at a loss any more than you would produce at a loss for your neighbour? In your case, it wouldn't even be your livelihood so you could theoretically do it.

Example here:

If an acute shortage were to arise, and begin to affect farming to a great degree, then supplies would be diverted from non-essential industries as food production would take priority. That aside, there's an abundance of smaller, more compact farming business' throughout the country. Ireland wont go hungry again in a hurry.

It would have to be a very significant food shortage for the current hostile environment for agriculture and food production to change.

Personally, as a farmer, I think it would take hundreds of millions starving to even slightly move the dial.

That's your choice. If the public spend decades driving down the price of food, don't be surprised when there is nobody left to produce it.

There are no rules on buying land. You can buy some yourself and grow veg on it if you want. Come back to us in a few years to let us know how you are getting on.

I agree, and you'll notice I did use the words "acute" and "great degree".

I empathise with your situation. I have a relative who farms and he says it's the worst it's been in his 40 years.

Agriculture in Europe is in existential trouble.

The public have no choice in the pricing of food, its the buyers (aldi, Musgrave etc) that dictate the price, the bigger the buyer the bigger the buying power, those who can buy produce cheapest get the customers, as long as we (farmers) think the public has any say in what they spend on groceries we're immediately on an us versus them footing, why would you think joe public have any power to decide what they pay, the blame lies with massive buyers who in turn guarantee a certain price to farmers who have to break their backs working twice as hard to make marginally more because that's what they've been told by farm advisors with the last 3 decades, blaming the public for the low cost of produce is simplistic and stupid

I'd imagine with the type of attitude that blames the public for the low prices farmers get you buy the most expensive beef/lamb/hoggett ration you can get from your supplier as you don't want to be seen leading by bad example, you surely don't bother getting quotes when building a shed or getting work done around the farm as you pay top price for everything to be sure you're getting top quality, do you price around for fertiliser or just tell them send out the dearest as you know the producers will benefit from the extra few bob, and no doubt yourself or the wife have never set foot in aldi or tesco and drive to your nearest city to buy from the best artisan organic food retailers, no? Didn't think so

I'm merely trying to explain to you why your "idea" is unworkable (I could use more descriptive words but I won't). Most farmers are consumers of fruit and veg the same as anyone else, rather than producers. That is a result of public policy and it's not going to change anytime soon.

Ireland produces more than enough food to feed itself.