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"Green" policies are destroying this country

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  • Registered Users Posts: 29,305 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    this is very true, we clearly need to become more energy independent, and wind ultimately seems be our natural resource



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,049 ✭✭✭Mecanudo


    Well its certainly not helping. However the current crisis started well before February 24th 2022

    From October 2021

    Why Europe's energy prices are soaring and could get much worse

    A series of market, geographic and political factors have coalesced into a perfect storm that shows no signs of abetting as the continent enters the autumn season, temperatures gradually decrease and heating becomes indispensable.

    Analysts are already warning the crisis, which is exacerbated by a mixture of temporary and structural problems, will be prolonged and the worst may yet to come

    Except as we've now been discussing for weeks - wind generation is a not reliable form of energy generation and that despite the majority of Ireland Renewable energy presently coming from wind generation.

    And to cater for that we need a safe, secure and reliable alternative source of energy generation. Presently that means gas as per EU directives and agreements - and that's LNG and/or our own natural gas. Just waiting for the greens to get their collective fingers out so we can do that



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,377 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    This may not strictly be for this thread but does anyone know how much diesel reserves we keep in Ireland?

    Having a listen to the David McWilliams podcast and there’s a lot of uncomfortable truths.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,305 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    yea covid has completely knotted up global supply chains, including global energy markets

    yup, this could get very very scary very very quickly!



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,076 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Why go such a circular route though ?

    The E.U. marginal pricing policy has gone a long way to creating energy firms profits that the E.U. is now encourage individual countries to do just that, but really it`s just Patricia taking money of Paul, giving it to Peter and then Patricia taking it back off Peter to give it back to Paul. Economically it make sense to just take Patricia out of the equation rather than her running around in a circle.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,377 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Agreed

    The economy runs on diesel.

    If we run out we are snookered a lot quicker than the effects of climate change! (I fully appreciate climate change is real and will have a terrible effect, but running out of diesel will get here quicker)



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,305 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    scaling up is key, but yes, this takes time, and we re in great danger right now, we need to expand our wind and other fossil fuel alternatives right now, scaling up wind will take a matter of years

    yup, this is now scary stuff!



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,076 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Third time now in a row that you have included a post from another poster in a reply to me, where that other post has nothing to do with my post you are supposedly replying to. What`s that all about ?

    I have already mentioned to you that you have been making thinly veiled allegations here for quite some time now of posters being re-regs and/or of having numerous accounts. Is this just another of the same from you being directed specifically at me ?

    Btw. your reply to my post is just another of your evasion attempts. What you termed as a "seemingly a successful Tidal project in Northern Ireland" in your scramble to push tidal as some sort of substitute for LNG was scrapped 6 years ago.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,049 ✭✭✭Mecanudo


    Except for just one little thing and something we've now been discussing for weeks - wind is a not reliable form of energy generation and that despite the fact that thec majority of Irelands Renewable energy presently comes from wind generation.

    And to cater for issue that we need a safe, secure and reliable alternative source of energy generation. Presently that means gas as per EU directives and agreements - and that's LNG and/or our own natural gas. Just waiting for the greens to get their collective fingers out so we can do that



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,305 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    probably because our energy systems are designed for fossil fuels, and its been the cheaper energy supply, more energy dense, and trading is known to reduce conflicts....

    it would make sense that fossil fuel industries would do everything in their power to slow down, ideally prevent alternatives from being developed, until fossil fuel exhaustion, as by doing so would maximize their returns, and maintain their dominance, power and control

    again, scaling up of wind would mean more energy independence, as its clearly obvious now, energy dependence is going to continue to become more problematic, and potentially more dangerous, if we truly run out of energy, we re fcuked, do you really want to be more dependent on other countries for this critical need? wind is our natural resource, other countries such as germany still have major fossil fuel resources, we dont!



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  • Registered Users Posts: 29,305 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    again, yes, alternatives such as wind take time to setup, but we need alternatives right now, so alternative fossil fuels are required until we achieve sustainable wind resources....



  • Registered Users Posts: 964 ✭✭✭riveratom


    The whole green agenda is just another way for the globalists of the world to exert control and to make the poor and middle class struggle even more. They were asking the question "should SUVs be banned" on the radio earlier! The World Economic Forum have said they are proud to be "penetrating the cabinets" of the world, so their agenda can infiltrate governments and government policy.

    Climate change - changed from "global warming" of course - sounds like something reasonable to feel threatened by. Therefore, it's a great vehicle for introducing restrictions, limitations and for rethinking how we do things - all in the name of the "greater good". They don't want people driving cars, using fossil fuels or even owning their own homes. The head of PayPal (a WEF partner, just like zillions of other companies) in Ireland actually said some years back that property ownership is not sustainable.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,076 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    As another poster has said wind is undependable and when it`s not there then increasing the number of wind turbines is not going to change that. We are going to need another alternative to both wind and solar or a major leap in storage technology of renewable eneegy when it is excess to our needs before we are anywhere close to not having to rely on fossil fuels.How the Irish Greens party fails to understand this is beyond understanding.

    They are opposed to nuclear, (well the are unless somebody else is doing the donkey work for them to avail of it), they have banned exploration, are determined to ignore Barryroe, and they are attempting to ban LNG.They are just living in a make believe world that somehow we are going to make the leap from where we are with unreliable renewables to a world where renewables are 100% reliable and secure as an energy source with no credible explanation as to how we do that.

    I



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    We keep a 90 day reserve and have done since the 70's oil crisis



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,305 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ....so the wind generation companies and their advisors that have been investigating this around ireland, some of which have decided to setup shop here, are wrong, yea?



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,377 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Of diesel or actual oil?

    reassuring if it is 90 days of diesel.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,305 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...its extremely important that us of boards must inform these businesses of their flawed research and investigations, that they are risking their share holders money in these ventures!

    tis hardly anything to do with supply chain and energy market disruptions! oh and again, we re actually still heavily reliant on fossil fuels for energy!



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,076 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    I would never confuse what a company does for their benefit and the benefit of their shareholders, with it being driven with the benefit of it`s customers their primary aim.

    Especially when you see the E.U. now urging individual countries to impose windfall taxes on the profits of energy firms. Profits that the E.U. itself has been largely responsible for from its marginal pricing model.



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,408 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    It definitely would make a dent. The rough cost of electrolysing is about $1000 per MW, or A billion per GW

    A trillion would pay for a thousand GW of green Hydrogen electrolysis capacity (and this doesn't take account for economies of scale)

    A thousand GW would certainly make a dent in the EU energy requirements given that the EU peak energy demand is roughly 4000gw, 1000 GW hydrogen generation capacity would be a big step in supporting the renewable energy industry, and moving away from any dependence on fossil fuels.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,098 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    Why do people here keep saying install more wind turbines to solve our electrical needs.

    Ffs the tech has been around since what the 18th century.

    If it was that simple we would have done this a 100 years ago.

    Its not the all its claimed to be.

    Yes harness as much renewables as we can but any dumbass can see the flaws in that logic.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 29,305 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    who wants to contact these companies to inform them of their poor decisions!



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,408 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    You really don't understand what you're talking about

    The 'Marginal pricing' refers to the wholescale price of electricity in real time. Lets say it's a sunny and windy day, and we have installed the right amount of solar and wind to generate all the electricity we need and all of the gas plants are turned off. The price of gas has zero influence on the cost of electricity in this scenario.

    Its only when there is a need for fossil fuel backup, that the wholesale price considers the cost of that gas.

    As more renewable capacity along with load balancing and compensators from batteries coming on stream, we'll need gas less and less often to cover peaks, or when there there is a prolonged deficit in renewable generation

    So if we need gas 50% of the time in 2020, but only 10% of the time in 2030, then even if gas prices are 5 times more expensive, our bills will stay the same.

    If on the other hand we invest in more gas facilities, and fail to invest in renewables, we will be paying 5 times more than we are now in our electricity bills.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,098 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    Were not talking about companies profiting from the wind when it blows. Were talking about a consistent supply of energy for the general public



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,305 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    call me mental, but maybe these companies and advisors have already thought of all of this, maybe!



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,408 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Fossil fuels have achieved great things, but now they're toxic to our environment and we need to get rid of them.

    It would have been a lot easier if the Fossil fuel industry hadn't spent decades deliberately distorting the science and lobbying to not do anything to combat climate change, so excuse me if I don't see these people as the good guys



  • Registered Users Posts: 22,408 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    We face an energy crisis because for decades we knew about climate change, and did next to nothing, and now we're faced with a rapid change that requires drastic action

    Your solution to the gas price crisis is to burn more coal. I propose we quit dragging our heels, take some of the pain now instead of constantly dodging it and lumping it onto the next generation



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,377 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    It’s a great idea apart from the fact wind is intermittent at the same time solar generation would be low, for example parts of winter 2021.

    As has already been pointed out multiple times Ireland doesn’t have other sources of renewable generation such as wave, tidal or hydro. (With hydro we have some generation but not enough to cover the shortfall on a non windy day in winter).

    This is why gas is needed until /if we get green hydrogen sorted.

    Problem with this is, we are dependant on foreign gas to keep the lights on post 2025 at the same as having undeveloped gas fields in our sea area.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,242 ✭✭✭brokenangel


    I wasn't scrambling for anything. I was just posting some info on tidal in a thread. You didn't read the article and now trying to link it to LNG which I never did



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,305 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    very little if any pain is actually required, just open the taps on investments towards renewables, job done, im expecting announcements to be made soon from eu institutions to do so!



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  • Registered Users Posts: 22,408 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    The difference between climate change and an acute energy crisis, is that climate change is essentially permanent and gets worse and worse over time

    There have been energy crisis before, Fuel stations have run dry, factories have closed, people rationed fuel, it was bad, people genuinely suffered, but it passed and we moved on and it became a footnote in most people's life story. Climate change is very different, it's incipid, it festers because something else is always a higher priority in the moment, until it gets to a point when we decide we really must start dealing with it, and find out it's too late and we've lost everything



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