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Russia - threadbanned users in OP

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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,746 ✭✭✭zv2


    Yes, I thought it was decided. I guess if they are talking about it there is a strong chance.

    “Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.” — Voltaire



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,047 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Unfortunately I have seen several historians and commentators suggest this is a distinct possibility in the face of a likely failure to achieve the desired results and the prospect of an actual defeat. I seriously believe that Biden should take a leaf out of Putin's book and say that while the US will said it would not directly confront Russian forces, the use of WMD's would change that and the US would have to consider that Russia had become a direct threat.

    Bidens current nonsense of giving Putin carte blanche to do whatever he likes is so stupid it's the one thing that has made me think he's not fit for the position.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,878 ✭✭✭ArtyM


    I'd imagine that the attack on, and sinking of the warship - thereby removing its air defence capabilities was a precursor of increased air based attacks by Ukraine.

    With advanced drones (ones without Cannon cameras and held together by superglue) being able to accurately target Russian forces and further weaken their air defences, those Russians could be in for a World of hurt.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,034 ✭✭✭Amprodude


    With advanced drones (ones without Cannon cameras and held together by superglue) being able to accurately target Russian forces and further weaken their air defences, those Russians could be in for a World of hurt.


    let's all hope that happens to Russia.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,525 ✭✭✭Curious_Case


    I agree with all that

    The smart kid is thrashing the street thug, according to Queensbury rules

    Unless the smart kid's friend has a length of 2" x 4" handy, the street thug is highly likely to pull out his knife



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  • Registered Users Posts: 205 ✭✭Drexel_3


    Thanks for that. Been looking at a few channels and it's a bit of a mess. Might stick to my usual sources!



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,146 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    Unless Ukraine gets tanks, aircraft and artillery from the West and lots of them(which brings in a lot more geopolitical issues) to equal up the forces involved and goes from "defence" to "attack" it will be extremely difficult for Ukraine to take back much of the Russian gains in the east. With Russian forces fairly entrenched in those eastern areas and consolidating by the day right on their border the advantage shifts the other way. The Russians would be defending, the Ukrainians attacking. As Russia found out, even with seemingly overwheming numbers attacking is a lot more difficult. If Ukraine take back Crimea I'll buy a hat and eat it. If and it's a huge if they did take back Crimea they would face similar issues you outlined as far as Russia faces in Donbas only IMHO much worse. Since 2014 Russia has bolstered her presence in Crimea. How many pro Ukrainian Nationalists do you think remain in Crimea? It's essentially Russia at this stage and resistance would be massive.

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,746 ✭✭✭zv2


    The bombing of Mariupol may be an attempt to get a victory for May 9th.

    “Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.” — Voltaire



  • Registered Users Posts: 515 ✭✭✭TheTruth89


    Maybe they would have to take a leaf out of Russia s book and liberate all Russian civilians. Or flat out deport em.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,746 ✭✭✭zv2


    Crimea is essentially Russian anyhow. It was given to the Ukrainians by Khrushchev in 1954. Why Did Russia Give Away Crimea Sixty Years Ago? | Wilson Center

    “Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities.” — Voltaire



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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,146 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    Because of the position his invaded country finds itself in Zelensky has one major practical need; more weapons from his Western supporters. Yes he's talked about Western sanctions and help and support for Ukrainian refugees, but he talks far more about weapons and military moves like no fly zones. His pronouncments about possible Russian actions like the use of chemical weapons and nuclear weapons are to that end, to get more Western military involvement. There was much talk recently of Russian having used chemical weapons in Mariupol, Zelensky pointed to it as a escalation knowing NATO/Biden and others had said this would be the escalation needed for more action, but then the story died on the vine for lack of any corroboration and Zelensky hasn't mentioned it since.

    Could putin launch a tactical nuke? It's certainly possible, but he well knows that even the smallest tactical nuclear weapon isn't far off the yield of the Hiroshima bomb and is tactical only in name. It would also be undeniable to the world and his own subjects. Enough of whom of the older Russian generation and his biggest support base remember the fright of Chernobyl. He also knows that setting off a nuke would remove any existing hesitancy on the part of the West in shutting off all his oil and gas revenues and shutting down all of the financial markets(the existing Swift sanctions only cover around 50% of them). The billlions still being paid by Germany et al to Russia would stop almost instantly. And that's before the considerations around a true East/West escalation and potential extinction event. Cannon fodder are one thing, but the ruling class of Russia won't worry about then and their sons being killed and maimed on foreign soil for putin's empire building, but them and their sons and daughters and whole families would burn in a nuclear exchange.

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,159 ✭✭✭saabsaab


    According to reports the Moskva had at least 2 nuclear weapons on board. In an interesting aside it also had a relic of the 'true cross' of Jesus? Were these still on board at the time of sinking?



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,382 ✭✭✭sjb25




  • Registered Users Posts: 40,006 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Quite apt.

    Mariupol — the “City of Mary”

    Maybe a joint son / mother effort.



  • Registered Users Posts: 545 ✭✭✭Crocodile Booze


    Yep, the Nuclear scenario is a case of not being able to be a little-bit-pregnant. It changes everything, forever. Therfore, any current powerful "friends" of Russia would absolutely not support it, or have anything to gain.

    Although the prospect is terrifying, I believe thankfully it's unlikely to happen.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,923 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe



    First he uses a version of the Russian propaganda line ("the US will fight Russia to the last Ukrainian") and then his solution is to appease Putin's wishes in the name of "reality". This war has really exposed some people's world views for what they really are.






  • Registered Users Posts: 13,893 ✭✭✭✭josip


    They don't need to take back Crimea, all they need to take is Nova Kakhovka where the Crimea Canal joins the Dnieper. That will curtail any development of the peninsula. I don't understand why the Kherson Bridge design didn't include a big f off water pipe from the Krasnodar side. The Russians do know how to pipe stuff in fairness to them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,097 ✭✭✭threeball


    Noam loves bleating away about had bad the Americans are and how the Russians have a point all from the security of his cushy job in Arizona. Maybe he should fcuk off the Russia or China and see if they'll publish his long winded muck.





  • I saw this video couple days ago but explains how things could play out in the second phase of the war




  • Registered Users Posts: 35,967 ✭✭✭✭BorneTobyWilde


    Russians have flattened cities, raped and killed thousands, and they're the ones getting the hump because some piece of floating metal sank. What a shower of self obsessed pricks



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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,714 ✭✭✭✭briany


    It is possible to agree with a person on some things and deeply disagree with them on others. Chomsky taking this stance shouldn't necessarily invalidate every single thing he's ever said in the eyes of anyone in particular. I think you have to assess each thing individually.

    Anyway, Crimea being off the table is realistically true and maybe something could be worked out with the Donbas. The thing that Chomsky seems to be missing or downplaying is that Russia isn't for listening at the moment, and if you offered a deal in the Donbas, Russia (or Putin, more specifically) would take it as a sign that more can be taken; that Ukraine is weak and getting weaker. It's also ignoring that weaker sides in a conflict can get to a favourable negotiated peace after a period of protracted conflict, for such reasons as the conflict becoming politically and financially damaging to the larger side. We saw this with the USA in Vietnam and we saw it with the USSR in Afghanistan, for example. In both cases, the invaders had enough raw firepower to leave each country as a lifeless desert if they so chose to deploy it, but they did not deploy it, probably because doing so comes with a lot of potential global ramifications. And referring to the hurricane analogy, the Ukrainians built shelters, got supplied and are weathering the storm.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,647 ✭✭✭✭Muahahaha


    *The US military spending can be similarly WTF. The old joke about the 15 dollar switch that became a 100 dollar switch in an F-16, though far more people get a slice of the pie and at least the switch will be US made. Which kinda sums up America. Or did. Nowadays the switch might be Chinese...

    The price gouging by military contractors to the US military is even worse than charging $100 for a $15 switch. Have a look a the below video, it shows AOC in a Senate committee grilling a CEO from a military contractor who was selling the military clutch discs for $1,443 each. She established that the clutch disc was just 3 inches in size and each one cost them $32 to manufacture. The contract was for 149 of these 3 inch clutch discs so the total amount paid by the US taxpayer was $215,007 while the cost price to manufacture them was just $4,768, representing a gross profit of 4,436% for the military contractor.

    In other words there is more profit in supplying the US military with parts and equipment than there is in drilling for oil and thats known as black gold for a good reason. Al the military contractors within in the military industrial complex know that the annual US military budget is $700bn a year and as private companies its their task to get that $700bn into their shareholders pockets with as much profit as possible. When you see the vast profits that are on offer the idea that the US & UK will only send weapons to prolong the war rather than finish it decisively is less about conspiracy theory and more about an economic reality.




  • Registered Users Posts: 1,702 ✭✭✭firemansam4


    I don't think Ukraine getting Crimea back is realistic at all, and ide say the Ukrainian side well know this, but as pointed out above they are not going to admit that point yet.

    Their is a long way to go on peace negotiations and Russia will need to be given a far more bloody nose than has been inflicted on them so far to bring any serious negotiations out of them.

    IMO The main crux is going to be the Donbass region and I think its going to be a mess what ever gets agreed, if agreement does happen.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,518 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    'Agreement' won't really solve anything. Most analysts think we are into a major new Cold War and standoff with the regime and it remaining a pariah state with all sanctions still in place. The only way this ends is with Putin's death or removal.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,923 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Used to be a fan and have read his books, but tired of defending him over the years, ultimately he's a far-left broken clock stuck in 2003 far from reality, just an articulate one. Reading an interview from 2 days ago, it's obvious he trusts the Putin administration more than the Ukrainian one. He's just a calmer version of George Galloway.





  • Depends, alot of that might be tough talk to deter Putin from continuing with the war. I imagine if the war ends soon a bunch of those sanctions would be dropped because their hurting both sides.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,290 ✭✭✭Raoul Duke III


    Why would we assume that 'Putin's death or removal' suddenly fixes everything? The most likely successor would also come from inside the power vertical and be of a similar mindset.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,518 ✭✭✭✭Strazdas


    I can't see the sanctions being lifted. It has nearly been forgotten that sanctions were still in place over Crimea when he invaded Ukraine (nobody recognises Crimea or the so called Donetsk People's Republic as being part of Russia) and now he has ratcheted things up a hundred fold from where we were in February.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Because everyone around Putin is a yes man for expediency. If they took over they MAY be less psychopathic.



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