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Advice for Starting IT Career

24

Comments

  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,443 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    The reason you are not earning sufficient in marketing is self evident. Surely you know enough about marketing to truly understand the link you posted from an advertising perspective.... or perhaps not.

    Bottom line... no one is going to pay much for your introduction to programming and when you go abroad the interest will be even less.



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    I came out of college and the only work I could find (2014) was in cold calling sales. I then managed to get a job in customer service in a call centre. Finally in 2017 I got a job in a large media agency. I worked at that for 3 years and in January 2020 got a job as regional marketing manager for a Dublin hotel chain on 40,000. After 6 months of covid I was let go (last one in first one out), turned out the previous guy in the role had lost his new job and went back on less money with the experience of having built relationships with all the stakeholders. Since then I worked for 1 year selling electricity from the front room for minimum wage while doing courses on digital marketing online. In September I got a job in the advertising team with meta (facebook), but I feel the pay is very low and shameful.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,614 ✭✭✭WrenBoy


    I think you are depressed JB and are just looking at the situation you are in as very glass half empty.

    I would encourage you to take Sleepy's advice and maybe look at some part time courses to do while you are working and see if anything takes your interest, and if they don't work out or suit you've lost nothing.

    Emigrating is a big step and I wouldn't do it because you feel ashamed because there is nothing to be ashamed of. Times are tough all over at the minute and earning 30k isn't bad at all. Would you consider moving out of Dublin before you leave the country entirely ? Maybe something worth exploring ?

    If you are set on emigrating I wish the the best of luck.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,771 ✭✭✭jebuz


    If you really want to be rich, find a vocation that really lights up your brain. Your career demands a significant amount of your time so why spend it doing something you don't like. You might end up with a nice house, but you'll also just end up unhappy and unfulfilled. Don't compare yourself to others and don't worry about what other people think. We all end up on different meandering paths and ultimately we end up in the same place. Stop tormenting yourself with home ownership, it'll happen when the time is right and if somebody criticises you or makes you feel lesser for renting that then they shouldn't really be in your life. Going into a profession you have no interest in just for financial reasons is not a very good idea. Best of luck to you.

    Jesus, I just posted in AH.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 293 ✭✭pjdarcy


    Are you just picking coding for the money OP or do you have a genuine interest in computers/maths/problem solving?

    EDIT: ignore that question. I can see you've answered it above.



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    I am depressed. Im on pretty strong dose of Lexapro for it (15mg). I am depressed because my life has not at all ended up how I expected it to be. I expected at 30 to have a ok ish car like a polo, own my own apartment somewhere like Saggart. That was it. And I cannot get those things. Not much, not glamour just normal. I would literally do anything to own a box room in Dundalk so I could be an owner. So I can make it. I work hard but Im finding it difficult to keep motivated in work because Im so far from making it and even my managers are renting.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,508 ✭✭✭Manion


    The company the chap works for pays bonuses in the form of shares via a scheme that allows them to be awarded tax free. His total direct compensation is likely to be a fair bit more than that. Also salaries in Limerick will not reach the same levels as Dublin even for comparatively similar roles.

    You cant just make decisions on a whim and in ignorance. Will you even be able to move to Canada? They apply a points based system for work visas.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,108 ✭✭✭CGI_Livia_Soprano
    Holding tyrants to the fire


    Every single IT dork I have had the dubious pleasure of working with have been earning a fortune while saving mountains of cash. This is in lieu of buying deodorant or replacing their Metallica St Anger 2004 tour t shirts. At least the exorbitant salaries explains the necessity for wallet chains.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    I already have a 2 year working holiday visa ready for Canada



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,108 ✭✭✭CGI_Livia_Soprano
    Holding tyrants to the fire


    To the original poster: your problem is you wallow in self pity too much. You need to be more confident, houses like a guy with confidence.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,614 ✭✭✭WrenBoy


    Many people feel this way at some point or another about some aspect of their life.

    Not to downplay how you are feeling but I would suggest you reach out to talk to a professional who can guide you through how you are feeling at the minute.

    From the little I have read you are not some failure, you seem to be someone who has a good work ethic but you feel let down by circumstances at the minute. Again, I would suggest you reach out to talk to a professional who can guide you through how you are feeling at the minute.



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    Therapy wont buy me a house or change Irish culture around home ownership



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,269 ✭✭✭✭Sleepy


    Yep, you've been unlucky in your timing leaving college. You mentioned being on anti-depressants in a previous post so I think WrenBoy is right: you're viewing the world through the lens of your depression.

    An alternate take on your situation: despite entering the workforce in a recession you've managed to stay gainfully employed in the workforce through both it and a global pandemic gaining experience and upskilling in the area of your qualification. You're currently working for one of the biggest companies on the planet and while the pay is less than you'd like, you're not only gaining more relevant experience there, you also now have a prestige role on your CV for your next career move.

    Bad luck has left you starting the "race" of life behind the start line but you've got yourself into it now. Stick with Meta for a couple of years, grab any opportunity for advancement or additional training that they'll pay for you can and you'll be in a far better position in another year or two. Life isn't easy, there are very few quick wins unless you're born with a silver spoon in your mouth. Give yourself a break, take pride in your accomplishments to date and keep plugging away at it. You'll get the property you so want so badly eventually. You're comparing your life to those of people who had different starts in the workforce and luckier timing. There are sweet **** all 30 year old single people that own their own home in the Dublin area. Most of my own friends and peers who bought in or around the capital did so in their mid to late thirties tbh. Work hard, save what you can and try to enjoy life.



  • Registered Users Posts: 162 ✭✭Whatdoesitmatter


    Lets be honest. You really are just looking for row



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  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    Im not, Im looking to find out how I can get on the property ladder soon as to fit Irish cultural norms



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,528 ✭✭✭✭retalivity


    Has this clown taken his show on the road to AH now?

    OP, no point starting an IT career now, as it will not get you enough in 2 years to buy a detached 4-bed in Foxrock to appease/impress your parents/friends/girlfriend/neighbours/dog walker/babysitter/counsellor etc.

    Should have dumped the arts degree or maybe tried starting college when you were 11, but here we are.



  • Registered Users Posts: 971 ✭✭✭bob mcbob


    If you have no interest in programming then don't even consider it but you do have skills that may be applicable in the IT industry, Have you considered IT recruitment, after dealing with recruiters a lot, their knowledge of IT is low. I had a look on indeed and here is a junior starting role 35-42K.

    Junior IT Recruiter – Start Your Career Today!

    - job post

    Archer Recruitment

    Dublin, County Dublin

    €35,000 - €42,000 a month -  Full-time



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,922 ✭✭✭✭Dial Hard


    The Irish cultural norms that exist only in your head? I've been renting for almost a decade since my marriage ended and I have literally never once been "shamed" for it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 162 ✭✭Whatdoesitmatter


    No. You want to have a debate, argument, fight about the house crisis and this "backstory" as a way to start it



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,275 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    No, but there are a lot of scam ones. I said I thought it was a scam when she told me she was doing it. But, as I said, she ended up about a year later on over 100k (in her second role....not sure how much her first was ... I think it might have only been 70 or 80k) but that 100k was for living as a "digital nomad" in various countries. Not trying to rent a place in NY or SF.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,275 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    OP, if you want to work in IT, be prepared for the concept of running to stay still, in relation to having to learn new things constantly



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    This thread has made clear I will not have a home in the next 3 years working in IT. It will be like my current industry, renting so I am no longer considering it



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,798 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    If you have no interest in tech you are better off doing something else.

    Perhaps consider a move down the country.



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    I cant afford the cities I would like to live in, and I wouldnt like to live rural. Id rather emigrate hence Canada



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,798 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    Where are you looking at in Canada? Have heard most cities are on par with our own in relation to housing etc



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,798 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    There are very few career's that you will own your home within three years from finishing your tiertry education, especially in a city.



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    Id be away from Ireland so I wouldnt feel pressure and shame for renting, the issue is not that I cannot afford rent, its that renting is looked down on and renters second class citizens in this country. Only failures rent


    I finished my education in 2015, I had been told that IT was the area to make decent wages in, but if I cannot buy a home within 3 years I will be 33 and still renting without having begun my life and facing that life never starting





  • I know a couple of experienced and capable people in IT who aren’t home or car owners, and struggling as much as anyone to make ends meet. It’s just that these times it seems to be increasingly necessary to have good IT skills to do an awful lot of jobs. I’m very fortunate to be a retired public servant on pension, and learning a lot of programming and stuff for keep me mentally challenged and abreast of developments in the area. I love to have an understanding about how everything works. It’s very entertaining to see where AI is going. Starting with a basic knowledge of programming & operating systems is good for lots of work scenarios as well as for your satisfaction, and then exploring cybersecurity and A1/machine learning. With likes of Putin around there’s ever increasing demand for cybersecurity people and AI is going to be an enormous field. To dip your toe in now is knowledge never wasted.

    As for affording your own little place, if you were prepared to do up an old wrecked cottage that’s going for a song (relatively speaking) you could potentially work remotely and afford to buy. The vulture fund people aren’t buying such places. There is always hope of achieving your dreams, and in the meantime broadening your knowledge for the future.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    I don't want to live in a rural area, I am open to living somewhere like Navan or Naas with transport links to Dublin but not rural.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,680 ✭✭✭notAMember


    You were earning 40k up to very recently, that's not bad, and you know it is achievable. Keep focusing on your current career and climbing that ladder. Meta is a huge company and you can certainly cross train in there and look for internal opportunities for growth. Flitting around from one thing to the next makes you look flightly.

    IT professionals who make big bucks are clever clever people with a talent for it and who work their arses off. It takes dedication and commitment. Sarah from up the road with the new shiny IT job from a boot camp is probably not some dumbass who won the salary lottery, but a very sharp well-organised mathematical minded human being who produces clear well commented, good quality code that solves a business problem.

    Lad, chill, find a girlfriend or boyfriend, enjoy your youth. Have fun and the two of you can have dogs or babies or house plants and pool your salaries to buy something in a few years.



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92



    Also worth noting the banks wont give out mortgages on wrecked property. Only cash buyers can avail of them



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    Youth? Im 30, "youth" and carefree ended at 22 when I graduated. My siblings had their own home at my age.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,680 ✭✭✭notAMember


    Who gives a crap what your siblings have or don't have, or had or didn't have. One of my siblings is dead, I guess I have it better than them? A notch in my favour by your standards. Another of my siblings a mortgage and another rents. Some have children, some don't. So what? We all have very different lives. I enjoy my life, they enjoy theirs. That's all that matters.



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    But property is the measure of becoming an adult in Ireland. You get a good leaving cert, go to a good college, get a job, buy a house, and live while accumulating property appreciation and at 40 or so move to the area you actually want to spend life in on the dividend. The you start a pension. Thats how life works in this country, miss a step, miss out on normal and become an outsider like me



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,680 ✭✭✭notAMember


    Seriously, it's not the lack of a house that's made you an outsider...



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    It is, I have a great social life, a wide circle of friends, I actually quite enjoy my job etc. But its being poor and propertless that renders that meaningless. Had I not went to UCD I would accept the poverty of renting



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    And the media constantly speaks about how renting is unacceptable. Thats what the housing crisis is



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,508 ✭✭✭Manion


    Can you link to 1 Irish media article pushing that renting is unacceptable or shameful?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,680 ✭✭✭notAMember


    You are what you read, is as true as you are what you eat. My social media feeds are mostly the sports I'm interested in, and my hobbies. I read newspapers in print, and therefore don't get my particular obsession served to me over and over again, written in slightly different words, because print media doesn't have an algorithm feeding my insecurities


    Beegee's had it in a song way back...

    "And now it's alright, it's okay

    And you may look the other way

    We can try to understand

    The New York Times' effect on man"


    Change what you read and how you consume media.



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    The comments section on the journal.ie, the concept of the rent trap, the entire housing crisis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,275 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    I told you already OP on your other threads -> #onlyfans. Selling photos and videos of yourself in the nip to ould fellas. You'll need to move quick though if you are already 30. Time is of the essence.


    If you want to earn even more you can even allow them to bum you for a fee. That would actualy not be too dissimilar to qualifying and working as a DBA like the other poster. It would be a little more gentle - especially if the ould fellas will use lube. DBA's usually don't get that comfort



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,320 ✭✭✭phonypony


    The 'measure of becoming an adult' in any society is maturity, not owning a house in Dublin city, but not Mullingar because, god forbid, it's too far from Dublin (Canada is totally fine though!?!).

    You are quite literally the only poster in your numerous threads on this same topic to insist that you must conform to the mythical ideal you described above. The only person making you an outsider is you.

    What happened to your plan to get a HGV licence? You could really go places with a HGV licence.



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    Reported for homophobia.

    You clearly look down on people who are not on big tech salaries



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,275 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump



    I'm supporting your right to let oul' fellas bum you. Your gender is not specified. Bumming is an equal opportunity pastime.


    And no, I never look down on people because of their salary. That would not be in my nature at all. Now if they went to UCD, that might be a different matter



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,508 ✭✭✭Manion


    Social media is not the same as Irish Media or even Irish society. You reading that the rent trap and the housing crisis as being shameful for ordinary people as opposed to the government displays your own bias. Tbh I think your the one with the chip on your shoulder regarding renting.



  • Registered Users Posts: 105 ✭✭johnboy92


    I never knew anyone to rent when I was a child. I never grew up around anyone renting. Buying a house was just what you did when you starting working. Renting was for me what students did and bedsits and studios where for junkies. Now Im living to the standard of those junkies. Its abnormal to rent we all grew up owner occupied



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,115 ✭✭✭eggy81


    If your really serious go out to intel and work as an electrical “go” on the new fab there. Try get on the night shift which will get you north of 1k per week take home and save like fook for the year or 2 it takes to get your house and go back to your normal career afterwards. Go is general operative. No qualifications necessary at the moment.



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭ Myah Late Rink


    30+ years in IT here, I was going to weigh in with advice until I read the bit about no interest in IT.

    Cart before horse.

    Find out what you like to do, then figure out how to get the career you want doing it. The salary and house will hopefully follow. That's if you're not on the wind, cos it sounds like you are tbh.



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