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Ukrainian refugees in Ireland - Megathread

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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    All refugee organisations have access to an emergency medical card. That is f the refugees have come through proper channels, eg The Red Cross.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,977 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    You may be referring to group Medical cards (Homeless service's) or perhaps those in Direct provision (Fixed address) an emergency medical card is very different than a personalised MC issued to a named individual and without a GP stamp. Put simply issuing a MC in the circumstances laid out is utterly pointless when the reality of the immediate situation is, these refugees will likely get no access to GP services and more likely (Actually its happening) they'll end up in A&E departments. How a Hospital services card , letter couldn't have been considered is a mystery and besides, as I've said few if any of these magical MC have actually materialised.

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • Registered Users Posts: 40,010 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Have you link to these various reports? Only a few short posts ago the claim was made they were being handed out like sweets at reception centres, drivers licences too.

    Sending people into already crowded A&Es for a reoccurring script like an inhaler or something would be dangerously stupid.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,152 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    Plays well to the delicate and flag avatars on twitter(until the next cause comes into view), but bugger all practical real world solutions or actually debating points raised, just more emotive nonsense. The same nonsense that led to this plan without a plan.

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,010 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Giving them basic health care is a practical solution, ranting and raving about it based solely on the premise of rancid begrudgery would be more aptly attributed to the bould Helen.




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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,152 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    It's not "rancid begrudgery"(nice addition of rancid to the threadbare B word) to ask questions of our elected representatives suddenly opening up the country to tens of thousands of people with no medical/financial/background checks and no caps, dogs and cats in tow when we've never done this before*, opening up the full suite of social supports with no checks, prioritising them over hundreds of thousands of Irish people on waiting lists for health and housing, opening up the country's coffers to pay for it, with near zero plans to implement the practicalities even in the short term, never mind the long, in the middle of the worst housing crisis in the history of the state, a healthcare crisis going back decades and with near monthly rising costs and inflation after a once in a lifetime pandemic.



    *The Syrian war displaced double the number of people both internally and externally, resulting in the largest movement of refugees since WW2. And we brought in 3000 over ten years and they certainly weren't handed free medical cards, full social welfare, ability to work and driving licences at Dublin airport. I'm sure any actual refugees in DP centres must be looking at all this thinking and quite reasonably WTF.

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



  • Registered Users Posts: 41,062 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Theres no begrudgery.......They came with their cats and dogs in tow

    😅

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users Posts: 40,010 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    prioritising them over hundreds of thousands of Irish people on waiting lists for health and housing

    Jaysus thought this figment was dealt with, but in your time could you back up where Ukrainian refugees are been prioritised for health and housing waiting lists?



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,977 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    There's no links required, look back on the thread . Besides I'm not aware a link to common sense is possible, but as your trying again to be pedantic, I met a number of Ukranian refugees in a large Midlands hospital last week, all have been here over a month, NONE, I'll repeat, NONE had received MC. I asked the question of a nurse I know there (I attend a regular clinic), currently Refugees are being brought to already over flowing A&E departments (can't confirm if that's across the country) , whilst every effort is being made to see them, it extremely complicated.

    Separately, I also ask my own excellent GP recently would they be able to assist, her response was .

    Surgery is Full to capacity, existing patients finding it difficult to get face to face appointments.

    Very complicated process taking on any MC patient's (Not just Refugees)

    Further complications re pharmacy's

    Would love to assist but Surgery in an impossible situation.

    Sums it up really 🤔

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • Registered Users Posts: 29,328 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    theres some seriously fcuked up people on this thread, ranting and raving about folks coming from a war zone, and being treated with respect by gaining access to public services! fcuking hell!



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  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,152 Mod ✭✭✭✭Wibbs


    No, it's just another example of throwing out the rulebook overnight. You can be sure that at the exact same time other people's pets were in quarantine, or had gone through the process of pet passports because they were coming from mainland Europe.

    Tell that to other folks also coming from non European war zones in DP centres. Again, double the number of Syrians were displaced fleeing a warzone, one that the midget in the Kremlin also had a hand in. And we took in 3000 in a decade, all vetted, checked and no automatic access to public services going on. Where was your "respect" there? Short memories all around. Again, overnight the rulebook was thrown out.

    Rejoice in the awareness of feeling stupid, for that’s how you end up learning new things. If you’re not aware you’re stupid, you probably are.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,328 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    oh theres no question there has been, and will be major mistakes made, but some folks seriously need to get over themselves, our critical sectors, housing, health care etc, were long fcuked before these folks came here, we allowed them to get fcuked up, the problem is us, not them!



  • Registered Users Posts: 41,062 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    Going on about pets as a big issue.....

    The dept examined them; vaccinated them, microchipped them, put in place measures for quarantine.

    No sorry cant that "no begrudgery" seriously at all. It completely sounds you begrudge them bringing their pets over.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,977 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    They absolutely did not put any measures in place for Quarantine, in essence offered advice which people could adhere to or ignore. Pets did get vaccinated and chipped but the department only acted after the influx started, not at the start.

    How a Ukranian refugee or indeed any refugee could adhere to Quarantine rules for their pets given the nature of their accommodation situation is beyond me.

    So just to be abundantly clear, No Quarantine measures were or have been put in place by the department. Some might see this as trivial in the over all context of things, perhaps it is but yet another over sight in this governments handling of this farce.

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • Registered Users Posts: 7,784 ✭✭✭Fann Linn


    Well I can tell you that they are being issued in the centre were I was working in a rural county town. Postman arriving almost on a daily basis with them and then ones being redirected onwards were people have left this centre or from other places . In fact the two main items of post being delivered now to these residents are their MC plus their An Post bank accounts judging by the envelopes being dropped.



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,977 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    I've an an post current account and can assure you there is nothing on any any envelopes I receive signifying it's contents are from an post bank. I've also got a full MC due to a long term illness , how it's even remotely possible to be forwarding on a MC (If that is what's actually happening) is at a minimum, perplexing.

    As I've said , I'm open to correction but few if any of these Magical MC seem to have actually been processed or issued.

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




  • Registered Users Posts: 13,320 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    The Ukrainian refugee thing is going to be a complete calamity. Giving medical cards but no GPS available for them.

    The State will eventually admit there needs to be a cap once it's popular to say so.



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,328 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...or maybe we ll finally accept our health care system is completely fcuked, and urgently needs major reforms....



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,977 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    It is already a calamity but few want to admit it 🙄

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,320 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    If covid couldn't change that, then refugees aren't going to.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,784 ✭✭✭Fann Linn


    I don't have a An Post bank account but i am in the centre on the mornings the post is delivered. It's then left in an in tray for the residents to collect. From speaking to these people as the collect their post they open their post there or in the reception so you get to see what they have. The same with the MC.

    Plus these people aren't prisoners so they are free to come and go as they choose. We get requests from them to forward their post on and that could be to Dublin, Cork, Galway etc if they have left a forwarding address and for others it's just bundled together and returned to sender if no forwarding address is available.



  • Registered Users Posts: 687 ✭✭✭Subzero3


    My wife has a long term illness and it requires 100 euro a month medication, we are both working so she don't qualify for a medical card as her illness is not in the list or theres a worse cheaper medication she could use. Now how is it fair a Ukrianinan can Walt's in and get a medical card for free without paying or contributing a single cent to this state. No way, I am not buying it, leaving a warzone or not.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,849 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    Oh look. more virtue-signalling wailing of the "think of the children refugees" variety!

    All the feelz and good intentions in the world won't change the fact that we are a country that struggles to provide those services to people as it is, let alone to tens (hundreds?) of thousands more. We are a small island nation of the edge of Europe with a population less than most major cities and a steadily eroding tax base on top of that. There is only so much we can practically and sustainably do!

    There's nothing "fcuked up" in recognising that and expressing legitimate concerns as a result. What is "fcuked up" is the notion that we should and can continue to add to these problems without the resultant worsening of the provision of those services.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,675 ✭✭✭Allinall


    If you are both working an can afford the €100 per month, what is the problem?

    Are you fleeing a war zone as well?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


     ranting and raving 

    Your standard for ranting and raving is pretty damn low then. In fact, your own posts could easily be considered ranting and raving based on that same standard... but then I suspect you don't apply those standards to yourself.

    Again, though, a minor point (because I pointed this out earlier). Very few posters are complaining about the refugees themselves, and instead criticising the response of the government...

    Why do posters, like yourself, persist in seeking to misrepresent the context of those posting here?



  • Registered Users Posts: 29,328 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    ...so we should just accept is completely fcuked, pull up the tray bridges, and ta fcuk with everyone!

    virtue signaling, ffs! do people just want to keep making up all sorts of bollcoks, just to remain be ignorant nowadays!

    we struggle to provide ourselves with our needs cause of bullsh1t ideas and ideologies, yes we cannot do this alone, we urgently need the full support of all eu member states and its institutions, in order to do so, this hasnt happened yet, and it must, or we re probably all fcuked!



  • Registered Users Posts: 687 ✭✭✭Subzero3


    We have to pay 3k for private medical insurance so stop talking shxte about not wanting to pay 100.



  • Registered Users Posts: 636 ✭✭✭Absolute Zero


    Hopefully when the situation has stabilized the Ukranian refugees can begin to return home (once it is safe to do so). How can this government have any credibility to the refusing and taking away of medical cards from Irish people who genuinely need them anymore when they are handing them out en masse to people who may not even require it?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 26,977 ✭✭✭✭Dempo1


    We're your getting an analogy to prisoners is baffling, I'm referring to any MC holder having to have a fixed and verified address in normal circumstances.

    I find it quite astonishing your able to freely observe refugees open their mail .

    I'm also very Curious how these refugees are actually opening an post bank accounts. There was an absurd, join the bandwagon press release from someone in an post a month ago offering "Assistance" in opening accounts, it did not say "Open" bank accounts.

    Notwithstanding an post money is entirely separate from An Post, how rules can be circumvented with regards to opening any bank account seems extraordinary. An Post smart accounts are also not free and a month into this, there's zero mention on their website of any support, free banking or special allowance being offered to anyone opening an an post bank account.

    Is maith an scáthán súil charad.




This discussion has been closed.
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