Why are so many people trying to get into the UK?

hoodie6029 · 06-05-2022 8:56am #1

Maybe I'm missing what is written between the lines on the Channel crossings and migrant crisis in the UK. I guess that some of the people crossing in boats are trying to reach family or a community already in the UK.

Outside of those reasons what I don't get get is why they want to get into the UK?

Is it harder to be deported from there? Easier to work illegally because they don't have National Identity cards like some other European countries? The NHS?

Why do they not settle in France or any other country with a good standard of living?

I'm not a xenophobe, I welcome anyone anyone who wants to travel to a new country and particularly people who have been forced to leave for war or climate change or whatever other terrible situation.

I'm just genuinely at a loss to understand why so many people are risking sailing to the UK.

timmyntc · 06-05-2022 8:59am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058244674/why-are-so-many-people-trying-to-get-into-the-uk

Good welfare. And relatively high minimum wage (ignoring cost of living).

Its all about remittances, sending money back to Africa.

Manach · 06-05-2022 9:04am

Because, (paraphrasing from "Douglas Murray's "Strange Death of Europe") first that the welfare system takes care of migrants when they arrive which means a much higher standard of living than their home countries and second there is a very good chance that the migrants will be granted leave to stay due to the lax/liberal migration policies.

Wanderer78 · 06-05-2022 9:06am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119022391#Comment_119022391

are you for real???? have you ever actually spoken to folks in these type of situations, i.e. on welfare and on min wage, and how the hell do you actually ignore the cost of living?

id say theres a better chance these folks are coming from hell holes, whos countries have been heavily indebted by western nations, including the uk itself, and have been torn to pieces by the same countries for their natural resources, just maybe!

whisky_galore · 06-05-2022 9:07am

Ability to speak English, thanks to the UK's historic colonial adventures, existing communities and relatives living in uk.

Donald Trump · 06-05-2022 9:17am

Civil liberties in the UK (and Ireland) mean you aren't required to carry identification. Perhaps that is also a factor?

London would be like NY though too I'd imagine in the sense of being a magnet for money and opportunities

Donald Trump · 06-05-2022 9:20am

Maybe it's the food and culture?

Curried chips before heading out for an ould hooligan brawl against lads who decided to wear different colour soccerball jerseys

06-05-2022 9:21am

Its easier to work undocumented in the uk,than most other countries

Many small to middle sized businesses still pay in cash there....its not for the fortune people will earn,nor the 50 pound a week dole🤣

boombang · 06-05-2022 9:23am

I have the impression that while the standard of living might not be high in the UK you might have a better chance of employment because of the liberal labour market there. Lots of the migrants I see in France and Italy are stuck working in blackmarket jobs not in the regular economy.

timmyntc · 06-05-2022 9:28am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119022417#Comment_119022417

yawn, the old west bad east good type argument.

Most migrants live as frugally as possible, often in squats or heavily overcrowded accommodation to save money. Same in this country. And remittances are a very real and important factor, look at how much money leaves the UK every year in remittances, its astronomical.

1% of Nigerian GDP is remittances from the UK, about 2.9 billion pounds per annum. Total remittances from the UK are closer to 7.7billion, though thats only the recorded. World bank suggests the true figure is closer to 23billion per year.

Fandymo · 06-05-2022 9:55am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119022409#Comment_119022409

Excellent book by the way!!

06-05-2022 10:18am

Joining existing family/communities, familiar language, general lax enforcement of immigration or labour laws.

The UK talks a lot about tough laws but then doesn't put the various supporting elements in place to enforce them like ID requirements or inspections.

I'm sure someone will find the numbers but most do stay in continental Europe, people crossing the channel are just very visible.

06-05-2022 11:35am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119022417#Comment_119022417

God forbid that these nations be judged for how they got their independence, or what they did after independence. Nah.. let's not consider the massacre of the educated, or the embracing of communist ideologies, the genocides, or the massive amounts of corruption, or even the reintroduction of slavery. Nah.. it's all the fault of western nations who drained the nation 50-70 years ago. Everything that has ever happened to them, once they regained control over their own fates, is the fault of western nations. Completely and utterly.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058244674/why-are-so-many-people-trying-to-get-into-the-uk

OP, Perception is king. The UK has a reputation, and while many of us might be clued into recent events, many in Africa won't be. They'll be going by the reputation that they grew up with. They'll have been told by others, already in the UK or with a vested interest in sending people there, that the UK is the best destination for them. And they'll go because their own countries are shitholes. Unstable shitholes where governments change regularly through violence, the police are corrupt beyond belief, disease is rampant, as is human trafficking, along with drug abuse, and incredibly brutal violence being commonplace.

Donald Trump · 06-05-2022 12:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119022522#Comment_119022522

There was a stat a few years ago that if you divided the remittances from Ireland to Nigeria by the entire number of Nigerian men, women and children living here, it was something mad like 30k each was being remitted.

Now how they calculate that stat, I don;t know. It is one of those that appears unbelievable but was actually based off official figures. I don't know whether the number was being inflated by remittances transiting through on their way from somewhere else. It wasn't broken down

Edit: This link gives the remittances from Ireland to Nigeria in 2017 as being $473m

https://www.pewresearch.org/global/interactives/remittance-flows-by-country/

And wikipedia says 17,642 Nigerians living in Ireland in 2011

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigerians_in_Ireland

473m / 17642 gives $26,811 so not quite the $30k I remembered above

Yurt2 · 06-05-2022 12:23pm

You can't fart sideways in most of continental Europe without national identification. Renting, accessing all sorts of services is much more difficult - even down to buying an intercity bus or train ticket.

Much easier to dissapear into the grey economy in the UK (and Ireland for that matter) than in the rest of the EU.

06-05-2022 12:39pm

The United Kingdom has submitted to Islam(unofficially)

paul71 · 06-05-2022 12:59pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058244674/why-are-so-many-people-trying-to-get-into-the-uk

The answer to the question is very simple and it is this. The "fact" implied in the question is simply untrue.

The UK likes to pretend it is awash with Asylum applications and illegal immigration but it is not. The perception is a false one created to serve a particular political agenda. Asylum applications in the UK are 3 times lower than the average for the EU in the period from 2015 to 2021, or 77 per 100,000 population vs 210 per 100,000 in the EU.

France is 3 times higher than The UK, Germany is 5 times higher. A more correct question would be why do so many people try to stay in the EU and avoid moving onto the UK.

growleaves · 06-05-2022 1:02pm

Britain has been a wealthy country for centuries. Irish people are often trying to get there as well.

Dante · 06-05-2022 1:11pm

There are a lot more "off-books" jobs for migrants.

corner of hells · 07-05-2022 7:58pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119022467#Comment_119022467

If you are from outside the EU living legally in Ireland , I think you have to carry your GNIB,IRB card with you all the time.

Donald Trump · 07-05-2022 8:07pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119029678#Comment_119029678

Yes but the point is that there is no obligation for you or I to carry ID here or in the UK. If an illegal is stopped, they can just say they are a citizen - i.e. they don't need to produce the document. And they also don't need to produce it for routine tasks like a continental person would do automatically.

SCOOP 64 · 07-05-2022 8:08pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119023575#Comment_119023575

Can see the the people living in the UK being happy enough about that.

corner of hells · 07-05-2022 8:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119029722#Comment_119029722

Yep , however I think if Gardai suspect you are illegal, they can ask about GNIB.

Dufflecoat Fanny · 07-05-2022 8:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119023317#Comment_119023317

If they can afford to send that much cash abroad every year why are so many Nigerians here given rent allowance

Donald Trump · 07-05-2022 8:34pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119029806#Comment_119029806

I didn't produce the figures. Nor am I interpreting them. I'm just stating them as I remember hearing them before and thinking they sounded a bit mad.

Bayonet · 07-05-2022 8:35pm

Because it's one of the best countries in the world.

Dufflecoat Fanny · 07-05-2022 8:56pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119029874#Comment_119029874

https://www.ucd.ie/geary/static/publications/workingpapers/gearywp201816.pdf

According to this around 40% of Nigerians are unemployed in 2018 and $539 million(dollars) was sent to Nigeria. That figure was given to us by the World Bank but CSO figures say it was only 17 million which seems far more realistic. Link to these figures underneath. World bank is off its head.

https://www.thejournal.ie/noel-grealish-money-sent-from-ireland-to-nigeria-4889805-Nov2019/

Donald Trump · 07-05-2022 9:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119030012#Comment_119030012

Well the World Bank Figures are 500 million and The journal.ie figures are 17 million. That's all we can say that we know.

The World Bank may not have access to the wealth of statistical data, or the same number of economists on its payoll as the journal (even if the number does seem mad high)

hoodie6029 · 08-05-2022 7:54pm

Some interesting points there, thanks,

ID cards must be a big factor, I remember Blair backing down bringing them in over civil liberties concerns now.

Perception is probably the biggest thing for me too, we're not getting the Continental news so we don't know what the migrant situation is like in Italy etc.

What I don't get is why The Guardian and others don't point out that the figures aren't high and move the narrative on from them attacking the Home Office policies and anti-immigrant politicians? Maybe there is just more column inches (or modern equivalent) in that?

09-05-2022 12:33am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119033611#Comment_119033611

Perception is probably the biggest thing for me too, we're not getting the Continental news so we don't know what the migrant situation is like in Italy etc.

Everything has become overshadowed by Ukraine. It's really that simple. Most English people (as they have investments in Italy/France) know that the refugee issues have not disappeared, but the media have a rather.. disgusting glee in reporting everything they can over Ukraine.

You should take a look at the range of investments by English people in Italy over the last decade, with it becoming a more attractive point of interest than Spain or the islands. They'd be very aware of all the shite going on there.

What I don't get is why The Guardian and others don't point out that the figures aren't high and move the narrative on from them attacking the Home Office policies and anti-immigrant politicians? Maybe there is just more column inches (or modern equivalent) in that?

Look at both Ireland and the UK in terms of NGOs. There's a massive industry involved, all supported by the State, but with private contributions too. The NGO's rely on these issues being front and centre and they're not going to allow truth get in he way. The media have shown themselves very susceptible to donations towards articles that present a particular worldview.

The days of honest reporting by the media are long gone.

riclad · 09-05-2022 12:59am

Because even working in a low paid job in the UK is way better than working where they come from , you could ask the question why do Mexicans risk their lives to go to the USA? No one goes from a rich country to a poor 3rd world country. It only go's one way. UK is no longer in the EU, they don't have to pay welfare to EU immigrants, that's the whole point of brexit.

quokula · 09-05-2022 3:35pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119023575#Comment_119023575

I was going to reply with the stats but seems you've already done it, yet people seem to still be continuing to discuss why a thing that isn't happening is happening.

shesty · 10-05-2022 2:54pm

I honestly don't know.Have often wondered too.

At best I can guess maybe the language - there might be more people with some English, than say German, French, Italian (although yes, I know those languages are spoken in some countries that migrants come from).

I'd guess the welfare system and the ID cards are a huge part of it.And maybe just an idea that has been shared around for years, that UK is a good place to go?

I can't really understand it either.

paul71 · 10-05-2022 2:57pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119041698#Comment_119041698

Strange explanation and choices. Rate of asylum application is 5 times higher in Germany, 3 Times higher in France and 3 times higher in Italy.

shesty · 10-05-2022 3:01pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119041714#Comment_119041714

Sure.As I said, I don't know.Best I can come up with as possible reasons.

hoodie6029 · 13-05-2022 8:32am

A quote from the Blair Institute in The Guardian today:

'As an example of the kind of radical policy he would like to see, Blair suggests tackling concerns about illegal immigration by introducing biometric ID as a precondition for accessing work and public services.'

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2022/may/13/tony-blair-tells-keir-starmer-to-drop-woke-politics-and-focus-on-economy-labour

riclad · 23-05-2022 4:00am

Because theres jobs avaidable there, alot of people speak English. But people are trying to get visa, s for Germany, Italy, France etc the whole reason for brexit was to limit the no of EU immigrants going to the UK.

Jim2007 · 23-05-2022 6:27am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119100549#Comment_119100549

Yep third world immigrants let’s them feel superior and the empire still exist…..versus white educated Europeans with legal rights and a willingness to demand them….

hayse · 23-05-2022 6:33am

Once they get on uk soil it’s a quick hop on a boat to out lovely isles. Cead mile failte

23-05-2022 4:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058244674/why-are-so-many-people-trying-to-get-into-the-uk

As many others have said, the primary reason is that the UK is considered a soft-touch financially - and illegal migrants want to capitalise on the benefits that the country brings with it.

The same reason why many migrants are moving to Sweden and Germany.

It just so happens, by pure coincidence of course, that these three countries have the most favourable benefits systems in Europe.

Note, also, how most migrants illegally crossing the channel are young males.

Contrast that with Ukrainian refugees, who are almost all women and children fleeing the conflict.

In other words, we're not dealing with genuine refugees. Rather, this is an illegal migrant wave of economic migrants.

For them, crossing the channel is worth the risk of the benefits gained by accessing the UK.

23-05-2022 4:43pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119100638#Comment_119100638

there seems to be only one person with a superiority complex around here and they certainly don't seem to be British.

ancapailldorcha · 23-05-2022 4:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119055586#Comment_119055586

An authoritarian warmonger like Blair might be better off keeping his grubby opinions to himself.

Quitelife · 23-05-2022 4:49pm

Migrants would be a lot better off in Ireland than the UK, welfare here is twice the UK and you can get benefits for unlimited children. You need never do a days work - its quite common in certain Irish Communities

23-05-2022 5:05pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119103663#Comment_119103663

it's a tad further from France though.

Maybe one day we'll see cheap rubber dinghies setting off from the Welsh coast.

23-05-2022 7:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119103663#Comment_119103663

Far harder to get here, thankfully.

The UK is expecting a whopping 100,000 economic migrants to cross the channel this year.

That said, if 100,000 migrants were to somehow make their way here through dinghies, I've no doubt our government would welcome them all with open arms, thereby facilitating the scumbag smugglers who put these migrant's lives at risk.

SuperBowserWorld · 23-05-2022 7:19pm

Everyone thinks it's like Downton Abbey.

Or Paddington 2.

But not Trainspotting.

sam t smith · 23-05-2022 7:24pm

Must be disheartening for the French to see that these lads are risking their lives to get out of France.

23-05-2022 7:28pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119104229#Comment_119104229

Not really.

The French don't want them either.

If anything, them leaving France serves to clean up the issue and transfer the problem to the UK.

A win-win.

sam t smith · 23-05-2022 7:29pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119104251#Comment_119104251

Shows that they consider France to be a shithole.

23-05-2022 7:33pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119104254#Comment_119104254

France is hostile toward economic migrants.

The UK isn't - the elites at least - and has a better benefits system to milk.

Of course the migrants would want to leave France.

It's got nothing to do with what migrants consider to be a "shithole". After all, they also migrate to Sweden, which isn't exactly the pearl of European culture.

enricoh · 23-05-2022 7:52pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119104204#Comment_119104204

Down in a neighbour's yard a while ago n he had a couple of foreign lads working away. I asked him where'd he get them from - Afghanis from the local direct provision centre. Said the boys had seen the sights in Europe then took the dinghy to the UK. Even had the British coastguard rescuing them on their phones.

Dunno how true it is but he said the Brits weren't keeping them n the best bet was to head over to paddy, which they did. He said it's a complete joke but only for them he was getting nothing done!

Why are so many people trying to get into the UK?

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