Ukraine (Mod Note & Threadbanned Users in OP)

Podge_irl · 04-05-2022 10:36pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119016393#Comment_119016393

It is largely being carried out voluntarily but it is not complete. More to the point, mandating it via sanctions removes the chance of companies taking a chance when they think the public attention has waned somewhat. It is not a small deal.

amandstu · 04-05-2022 11:01pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119016819#Comment_119016819

It is just as much corruption when the corrupter(Putin et al) know full well they are peddling horseshit to a public much of which clearly has very poor levels of comprehension(not helped by the blinkering of the media)

In any country there is a duty of its leaders to be honest with the public and we can see this has not happened in Russia.

Complicity with ignorance I will call corruption

Trump is ignorant and malevolent in equal measure but he sure knows how to spread it around and I call him a corrupter too ( the stakes there are just as high)

McGiver · 06-05-2022 7:08pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119017413#Comment_119017413

I'm just saying that Trump is a one-off event. Whereas Putin is an Xth incarnation in a series of the same evil since the "Russian" Empire was created. Nothing changes in Russia.

amandstu · 06-05-2022 8:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119025018#Comment_119025018

I would like the reassurance that Trump is a one off event, but I think we are going off topic.

McGiver · 07-05-2022 2:33pm

Finland support of NATO membership at 65%, up from 25% one year ago. Parliamentary discussion ongoing and to generate a white paper with the aye/nay recommendation at the end of the next week.

Pekka Haavisto, the Finnish Prime Minister, in an interview:

FP: Hypothetically speaking, what are the pros of Finland joining?

PH: Well, I think, first of all, the additional security that NATO could bring. We have a very strong reserve of 280,000 soldiers, we have a conscription army, which is one of the strongest in Europe. We have just ordered the top-of-the-line F-35 jet fighters from the U.S. We have modernized our military equipment.

Our weakness is [dealing with] chemical weapons, nuclear weapons, nuclear threats; it is very difficult to address these kinds of threats, which are now on the table, by ourselves.

That's a proper strategic thinking of a leader of a country. They've 280k reservists and lot of gear yet they think they need more defence. Note, Ireland has 2k reservists and NO gear too speak of😎

Compare the Finnish attitude with "we don't need to have any defence, because we have no enemies so we simply want to cheapskate it" @Detritus70

If Ukraine thought in this way they'd be no Ukraine on the map now or it would be a puppet state. Thankfully there are no cheapskates or idealists in Ukraine and they were preparing for this war for 5+ years👍🏻

Podge_irl · 07-05-2022 2:35pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119027995#Comment_119027995

I wonder what the main difference between Finland/Ukraine and Ireland is 🤔

McGiver · 07-05-2022 2:40pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119028004#Comment_119028004

Russian military vessels conducting naval exercises in the Irish Sea 😎

Brussels Sprout · 07-05-2022 5:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119027995#Comment_119027995

I'm sure if Ireland also shared a border with Russia, rather than being on the opposite side of the continent from them, it would change things.

Austria haven't joined NATO either but they are surrounded by members (and Switzerland) so probably feel that they're safe too.

eire4 · 07-05-2022 11:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119028029#Comment_119028029

Or Russian cyber attacks on the HSE which will likely result in costs of over 100 million euro for us on top of the disruption and damage it caused in of itself.

AMKC · 08-05-2022 11:53am

I think it is only a matter of time be it months or years before this proxy war becomes a full blown World War. Russia have attacked European and American weapons being supplied to Ukraine and it is only a matter of time before one of there missiles cross the border into Poland or so other Nato state. I hope I am wrong and that Putin calls a Victory tomorrow on what they have taken namely the Dumbass and Lehanske regions then backtracks and leaves it at that but I am not optimistic that it is what will do.

Pete_Cavan · 08-05-2022 12:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119031337#Comment_119031337

Russia can't afford the war going on for years and they clearly do not have the ability to take on other countries. Putin can declare whatever he likes, the Ukrainians will keep fighting them with their endless supply of weapons and ammo.

Sam Russell · 08-05-2022 1:01pm

If Putin declares the 'Special Military Operation' a complete success - they have secured the two Independent Republics (and if you believe that, you will believe anything) and declare a ceasefire.

Of course, Ukraine cannot do the same - they are too heavily invested to let go now.

Dohnjoe · 08-05-2022 1:45pm

..

https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1523208732750262273

beggars_bush · 08-05-2022 8:19pm

Anyone expecting Russia to announce a full mobilisation tomorrow?

Nody · 08-05-2022 8:32pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119033460#Comment_119033460

If they do it would show them even more desperate than expected and would turn a lot of the public against the government quickly; hence I'd guess they will at most call a partial mobilization (it takes a long time to train up a new soldier from scratch) or more likely the current round of soldiers will not leave as planned. It's one thing to support the official line of "special operation" and a whole different kettle to go into general mobilization and official war status as you'd need to train up the recruits etc. The core problem lack of missiles, equipment etc. will not get better by throwing more raw recruits at it (they have shown that most critical parts are not Russian made but Western and hence can't re-stock or re-supply once they get used up). I can't really see them return to the ww2 style approach of first rank advance, second rank advance, third rank pick up the dropped weapons and advance either simply because the information would spread to quickly.

McGiver · 08-05-2022 9:11pm

Today's G7 statement clearly showing commitment for military, economic and humanitarian support of Ukraine, banning and phasing out of Russian energy imports and pushing further strong sanctions against Russia. Also, commitment to replace fossil fuels with renewables baked in. Very good overall.

Thank God the US and Biden for this leadership. If we left it to the current wishy washy EU leaders it would end up the same as the Crimean "sanctions" which just made Putin stronger and more resolute (by showing weakness to him).

Statement here:

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2022/05/08/g7-leaders-statement-2/

McGiver · 08-05-2022 9:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119031597#Comment_119031597

Three - Donetsk, Luhansk and Kherson.

McGiver · 08-05-2022 9:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119031400#Comment_119031400

Of course they can, they burn $900m on it per day but look at this...

1 rouble = 0.0145 USD

And this is just hydrocarbons and what Russian federal budget officially gets. The kleptocracy can and does steal a lot on top of it. And they steal from the entire economy (minerals, hydrocarbons, precious metals, government...).

Nody · 09-05-2022 9:42am

And there we go; no general mobilization and more chest beating about nazis and motherland with the West somehow trying to wipe out Russia by arming Ukrainians (because Ukraine was clearly plotting an attack on Russia or something...).

McGiver · 09-05-2022 9:45am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119035121#Comment_119035121

From a Channel 4 commentator, pun intended:

The rough guide to Putin’s speech: Degradation of western morality, NATO was about to attack us, Kyiv was going to get nuclear weapons, we’re fighting neo-Nazis, the Donbas is Russian, it’s a continuation of the Great Patriotic War. Here’s a military parade. That’s about it.

McGiver · 09-05-2022 10:59am

Pretty powerful Zelensky's speech, says it all.

(1) MFA of Ukraine 🇺🇦 on Twitter: "President of #Ukraine @ZelenskyyUa: “We won then. We will win now, too! And Khreshchatyk will see the parade of victory – the victory of Ukraine. Glory to Ukraine!” https://t.co/339L7s6Faz" / Twitter

Dohnjoe · 09-05-2022 11:51am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119035121#Comment_119035121

A new one: "NATO was planning to attack Russia, so we had to invade Ukraine"

But somehow NATO didn't use that invasion as golden opportunity to attack Russia. The Kremlin just doesn't put the effort into their propaganda like they used to.

Pussyhands · 09-05-2022 4:06pm

The eu need to grow a pair of balls and need to sanction Switzerland. What the Swiss are doing is harbouring the Russians money. But the eu won't sanction them because the rich Germans, Italians etc have their money over there too!

The Swiss are a disgrace. Shameful carry on.

Sam Russell · 09-05-2022 4:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037132#Comment_119037132

But so are the British Virgin Islands, plus plenty more UK Crown Dependencies.

Pussyhands · 09-05-2022 5:07pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037323#Comment_119037323

Switzerland are in Europe and a sizeable economy.

hotmail.com · 09-05-2022 5:28pm

Macron says it could take decades for Ukraine to join the EU.

Larbre34 · 09-05-2022 5:31pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037531#Comment_119037531

Of course it could. The milestones that are conditions to entry are onerous. I don't think there was ever any naivety about that.

Its unfortunate that the Treaties don't require perpetual compliance with those standards or else we'd be kicking Hungary out on its ar5e about now.

Pussyhands · 09-05-2022 5:35pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037531#Comment_119037531

He's right.

Membership of the eu is not just something for countries to benefit from. It also needs to ensure the eu itself is not harmed by it. With freedom of movement in the eu, the Ukraine economy has to be strong enough to keep Ukrainians there rather than the whole youth and future of their country emigrating.

And that's only one aspect.

People supporting their immediate admission into the eu are clueless.

They probably don't even know theres many countries with applications to the eu who have been going on for almost 20 years. Macedonia applied in 2004 and still aren't accepted.

Dohnjoe · 09-05-2022 5:54pm

The Ukrainian application to the EU is not "typical". They are fighting totalitarianism for Europe, if they had capitulated, we'd all be dealing with a hyper aggressive Putin up against the borders of Poland, whilst directly threatening Moldova and Georgia next (at least). Ukraine's resistance has done more to unite Europe than anything in decades. I wouldn't be surprised to see them fast-tracked entry.

Podge_irl · 09-05-2022 6:21pm

Sanction Switzerland 🙄

Presumably they should sanction China and India while they are at it.

Ukraine (Mod Note & Threadbanned Users in OP)

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