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Football ranking table

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  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    Prediction model output for the first 3 games of the 2022 SFC.......I had hoped to update the previous format to something much sexier but didn't have time, so ye will have to do with what ye know. The model output does not, however, include the New York-Sligo game, because New York and my code didn't agree due to New York being 2 words and all other counties being only 1 word.....anyone that did a bit of coding will understand.....

    • Sligo to win by 3 (which isn't much in the general scheme of things - New York into the semi-final? Sligo have done pretty well this year, but if they aren't concentrated, then a shock is on the cards)
    • Fermanagh seem to either a) draw b) lose by 5 points or more or c) win by 5 points or more. 1982 since they have beaten Tyrone in the SFC, unlikely to change this weekend. Tyrone by 12 is the model output.
    • Apart from a severe hammering by Sligo in Sligo, London went through the league performing between 4 and 14 points better than expected. And one of those games was a win against Leitrim in a neutral venue. Another Connacht shock on the cards? The prediction model is more conservative - Leitrim by 6

    The "new and improved" boards did not want to take the PDF from the model output that I wanted to upload......are we restricted only to image files??

    Post edited by laoisman11 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,614 ✭✭✭Blackjack


    Is that Leitrim by 6 or London by 6 in that game?



  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    Leitrim by 6, sorry. I’ve corrected the previous post. Thanks 🙏



  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    I have figured out how to load a PDF - it is not in the file attachment button, but in the image attachment button 🙄


    So a few days too late, here is the full prediction model output for the Fermanagh-Tyrone and the London-Leitrim games.




  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    Updated ranking table after this first weekend's round of games.....

    • No rating points exchanged in the Fermanagh-Tyrone game which is normal given the difference between the teams
    • Slight gains for Leitrim and Sligo following close wins over London and New York, respectively
    • Before anyone asks why Sligo gained 1.3 and New York lost 1.4 rating points, it's a rounding error!





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  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    Attached is the prediction model output for this weekend's round of games:

    • Cavan's form has been abysmal since their Ulster final win all the way back in 2020.......in saying that, their "form" is judged by what the prediction model thinks they should be doing, which is in turn based on their elevated position in the ranking table
    • Mayo have a recent advantage over Galway, and this is predicted to continue
    • We have to go back to the battle of Aughrim in 1986 for Wicklow's last win over Laois
    • Louth's form over the last 7 games has been extremely constant - winning all games by 2-5 points more than expected
    • Offaly look well set for victory against a Wexford side that has been on the slide
    • Armagh's league form looks better than Donegal, but they haven't beaten them since 2010. Home advantage tips it for Donegal


    tl;dr

    • Cavan by 3.3
    • Mayo by 4.8
    • Laois by 1.3
    • Louth by 9.2
    • Offaly by 5.3
    • Donegal by 1.2




  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    Update of the ranking table after this weekend's round of shocks....

    • Offaly were the biggest losers in terms of rating points, but Laois, Armagh and Mayo were not far behind
    • Donegal jump into the top 3 for the first time since Nov 2020
    • Laois win the overall award though - their worst ever ranking ever 😪
    • Cavan justified their rating difference over Antrim, and no rating points were exchanged in the Louth-Carlow game




  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    Prediction model output attached for this weekend's games.

    • Sligo have mixed form against Roscommon, but Roscommon seem to be on a bit of a run and should easily get over the line
    • Both Westmeath and Longford mixed the good with the bad during the league, and Longford appear to have a slight edge over their neighbours, which may make this one a bit tighter than expected
    • There is a certain novelty in seeing that Dublin have under-performed in 13 of their last 20 games; even if Wexford over-performed against Offaly, this gap will be too large to bridge
    • Difficult to find any stand-out trend in Clare or Limerick's recent performances; playing in a higher league division will surely stand to Clare
    • Despite a draw in this year's league, Tipp have a vastly superior rating point score compared to Waterford
    • With only 2 wins in their last 13 games, Down are on a severely bad run of form; Monaghan will likely add to their woe
    • Contrary to Down above, Derry have only lost 2 games in the last 2 years but a first victory over Tyrone since 2006 might be too much of a stretch
    • Louth's consistent performances are a joy to look at (from a data point of view!); it's been 8 years since they met in the championship, so there isn't much to go on there
    • Apart from the Cork game, Meath's league campaign was disappointing; they haven't lost to Wicklow since 1957 and that's highly unlikely to change (in the recent form graph between the teams, Meath's last result over Wicklow doesn't show up - because it was literally off the charts!)

    tl;dr

    • Roscommon by 9.7
    • Westmeath by 4.5
    • Dublin by 13.3
    • Clare by 5.7
    • Tipperary by 8.1
    • Monaghan by 8.1
    • Tyrone by 5.1
    • Kildare by 6.5
    • Meath by 10.1




  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    Update of the ranking table following this weekend's games:

    • Not surprisingly, the Tyrone-Derry game provided a major shock to the ratings! Only on 9 previous occasions have 9 rating points being exchanged in a game. This only happens in the SFC, when the rating difference between the teams is greater than 15 rating points (3 rating points are added for home advantage) and the underdog wins by more than 5 points. Interestingly, Derry gained 8.9 rating points for their 2006 win over Tyrone! Derry are now 2nd in the the rankings, a position that they have not held since June 2008
    • Limerick leapfrogged Down and Tipperary (an omen?) to move into 18th after their draw with Clare
    • There was a minor gain for Westmeath following their bonus-point win over Longford
    • No rating points were exchanged in the remaining games




  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    Prediction model output for this weekend's 3 games attached.............

    • With the notable exceptions of 2019 and 2020, the margin of Kerry's last 4 championship victories over Cork has been 5, 11, 17 and 22 points. Cork's recent form has been pretty poor, and that was against Div 2 teams.
    • Cavan have underperformed in 13 of their last 15 games, but they were coming from an (artificially?) high position following their Ulster title win in 2020. Donegal to surely make amends for that loss.
    • There is a huge gulf in the ratings between Galway and Leitrim; this, allied with Leitrim's average enough form against Div 4 sides surely points to a big win for the Tribesmen

    tl;dr

    • Kerry by 8.5
    • Donegal by 5.3
    • Galway by 15.3


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  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    I'm not posting any updates after this weekend's 3 games as there were absolutely no changes to the ranking table. The winning teams all had 15 rating points more than the teams they beat.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,264 ✭✭✭tanko


    If Derry lose to Monaghan how many points will they lose and if they win how many will they gain?



  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    Prediction model output attached for this weekend's 4 provincial semi-finals:

    • Tipperary have severely under-performed in their 4 previous meetings with Limerick but Tipp's recent form does appear a little more consistent. Home advantage seems to swing it for the prediction model.
    • Where do Derry go after their spectacular win over the All-Ireland champions? Surprisingly, these sides haven't met in the championship since 2009 (when Derry twice overcame Monaghan). Given the large difference in rating points, the model is plumbing for Derry
    • Kildare's form appears to be quite erratic whereas Westmeath appear more steady - however, Kildare have been playing at a much higher level than Westmeath recently. It's hard to understand how the teams have not met more than 7 times in the championship
    • The Dubs are back, so they say. Whether they are or not, it is very difficult to see Meath getting near them in light of their current form - they have only exceeded expectations in 2 of their 8 games this year and one of those was marginal against Wicklow. Meath have beaten Dublin in 1 of their 13 previous championship encounters - lucky 14 doesn't have a good ring to it.

    tl;dr

    • Tipperary by 1.3
    • Derry by 2.8
    • Kildare by 6.2
    • Dublin by 6.0


    Post edited by laoisman11 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    If Derry lose by 5 points or less, they would lose 4.2 rating points; if they lose by more than 5 points, they would lose 6.2 rating points.

    And if they win by 5 points or more, then Derry would gain 2.8 rating points, whereas a narrow win would see them gain 1.9 rating points.



  • Registered Users Posts: 223 ✭✭Jippo


    I don't post nor even log in to this website anymore but I regularly check this thread. Laoisman11 thank you so much for keeping this going. It is appreciated here at least.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 11,414 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hammer Archer


    Not surprisingly, the Tyrone-Derry game provided a major shock to the ratings! Only on 9 previous occasions have 9 rating points being exchanged in a game.

    Out of interest, what were some examples of this happening previously?



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,715 ✭✭✭✭callaway92




  • Registered Users Posts: 14,715 ✭✭✭✭callaway92


    Wow - Looks like Tipp were ranked well on Laoisman's rankings going into it



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,724 ✭✭✭Charles Babbage


    I would suggest Armagh v Monaghan in 2003 must have been up there, also AI champions in the first round of the Ulster championship.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    RT = rating score of each team before each game, without taking home advantage into account. The largest difference (or the greatest outsider win ever, if you prefer) was Cavan's win over Down in '62.............anyone got any stories on that one?



  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    It would have been, if Monaghan had managed to win by more than 5 points! This game was one of 35 where the winning team came into the game at least 15 rating points lower than the team they ended up beating, but won by 5 points or less. The largest difference was 31.25 rating points when Sligo beat Roscommon in 1981. Second highest was Waterford's win over Kerry in 1958 and in third place, Longford's famous win over Mayo in 2010. Monaghan's 2003 win was 4th!



  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    • Derry cement their position in 2nd spot following a fine win over Monaghan
    • Limerick move to 15th, their highest since June 2013
    • There were minor gains for Kildare and Dublin as they make their way to a Leinster final showdown




  • Registered Users Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    Enjoyed doing a catch up.

    Keep up the good work



  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    Prediction model output attached for this weekend's 2 inaugural Tailteann Cup games.........

    • A 2nd ever meeting between Wicklow and Waterford in the championship. Both teams' form have been relatively consistent over the last number of games, but their form is based on where they are in the table. With almost 16 rating points between them, a big Wicklow win looks likely
    • The surprise win over Offaly in the first round of the Leinster SFC is almost the only positive point on Wexford's copybook in 2022 (even if they did achieve narrow wins over London and Waterford in the league). Offaly were tipped to win that initial fixture by more than 5 points; even if the model is now more cautious, victory should be theirs the second time around.

    tl;dr

    • Wicklow by 8.1
    • Offaly by 0.9


  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    • Offaly regained some of what they lost in the Leinster SFC with a narrow win over Wexford
    • No rating points were exchanged in the Wicklow-Waterford game




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,675 ✭✭✭dr.kenneth noisewater


    Anyone know what happened the hurling ranking thread that used to be on here? Cant find it but would be interested in how its looking



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    The lad who was doing it left boards and no one else.ciudk take it on iirc



  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11



    I don't have time this week to do a full write-up, so you are going to have to interpret the previous form of teams yereselves.





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  • Registered Users Posts: 986 ✭✭✭laoisman11


    • The biggest winner following last weekend's round of games was Carlow. They gained 4.5 rating points for their win over Tipp, and consign Tipp to 28th place, where they have not been since 2012 (Carlow's win also drops Laois into 30th, their lowest ever ranking!)
    • Both Leitrim and Fermanagh gained more than 3 rating points, taken from their wins over Antrim and Longford, respectively
    • Derry, Dublin and Offaly all picked up more than 2 rating points; Derry have now amassed almost 20 rating points in this season alone, moving them up 11 places in the rankings




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