Fall of the Catholic Church

The German religious tax applies to persons ( taxpayers) registered to their particular Church. Here in Ireland, we do not have any choice in how our taxes are collected or how they are spent only that they are collected. Anything that is given to the Church by the parishioners is voluntary.

Hmm.... dodged on two accounts.

1 - I didn't ask what German church tax was - I've lived in Germany for the last ten years, I know exactly what it is - I asked you how you feel about it if it was introdcued to Ireland? Would you happily pay it?

2 - I kind of expected a Russell's Teapot answer rather than an actual quote, which indicates you have no idea either.

None of that addresses what I posted.

But whatever floats your boat. You and everyone else is completely free to practice whatever religion you want. Just don't expect to have it funded by taxes or imposed on people (particularly children) by state services.

I don't think it's a terribly old refrain, frankly. It's only in the last 30 or so years their officials have actually been convicted and sent to jail for their pederasty. At least the Canadians have called what the RCC did to the indigenous children in Canada a 'crime against humanity,' perhaps there'll be legal repercussions from that. Unfortunately, the RCC is manipulating the Irish government into slow walking anything about the massacres of children in Tuam and Bessborough and, with the threat of exposure of their 'sale of babies to America' adoption business, has also blocked legislation regarding adoption. Yet another criminal behaviour that's not been prosecuted.

Saw this on the Funny side of religion board. Seems appropriate:

Catholics and Protestants' and Muslims etc, dont pay taxes in Ireland???

You might not believe this Igotadose, but I'm happy to hear that these bastards are getting their comeuppance, late and all in the day as it is. Because these self same bastards were for sure not Christians. Re Crusaders cartoon...have you seen the Muslim equivalent? Because they have lots of tales of what they did to the infidels, their men, women and children in the Holy Land. But thats for another thread.

"And no, I don't believe that death is the end. That would not make sense to me. We are all part of something bigger."

You know that this just makes you a Buddhist, and you're quite correct we will be resurrected..as an earthworm or a daisy.

Anyway I prefer Dave Allen's thoughts on Adam and Eve, enjoy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGASvVqzOa0

Shoog, so for you, unless there's a proven scientific explanation for it, it does not or cannot exist? ? Well for Christians, we believe in what Jesus taught, and a degree in religious theology or scientific research is not required. Was he Crucified? yes . Was he Buried? Yes. Did he rise again on the 3rd day? Yes. Will he come again? Yes. And thats it Shoog...its called Faith.

Off the cuff Shoog, have you ever experienced anything that you could not explain? Maybe felt shivers down your back or something similar???

Its all about forgiveness Road...that's what this life is all about. Forgiveness, Jesus said repent and your sins shall be forgiven. And so it is.

I was specifically refering to your lack of understanding of the history of your gospels. A vey shaky foundation to build a faith on lacking a basic knowledge of historical facts.

I am quite happy to accept that there are things science and myself do not know -- such acceptance is the foundation of my world view. I see not constructive in substituting belief for a lack of knowledge. Accept the limits of what can be known. Similarly there are many inexplicable things which we can experience which are currently beyond explanaton. God need not apply to fill the gaps of.my understanding.

So, does this mean the nuns and priests figure they have an ace up their sleeves on judgment day for the sins they would commit?

Convenient.

The general malaise for non believers is that they cannot conceive that this and other religions that were foisted on them dating back thousands of years can placate scientific thought and methodology.

Faith has been debated in the church since its inception because humans have always had a need to understand the universe. Some exercised this need to understand by wallowing in mysticism while others had a more rigorous, empirical way of apprehending nature. The debate around faith has been a primary source of anxiety for church leadership and was countered with arguments like the last judgment and heaven and hell to rein "bad faith" in.

Scientific methods and education have improved to the point where scientists, and a fair amount of the population will forego rapid conclusions on explaining something that sends shivers down their spine.

Every one of those Knights was a practicing Catholic like you, however. They weren't denied communion, unlike Nancy Pelosi who recently was denied such by the Bishop of San Francisco. Is this bishop a Christian? Were the priests who gave communion to the Templars, Christians?

Doesn't answer my question - would you be happy to it or not? And itd not a state tax - the state doesn't get the money! State taxes pay for state services, relgious tax pays for religious services.

Regular collections are voluntary, anyway.

I'm going to take this as a "no" as you've dodged it twice now, which begets the crux of the issue: you think you're entitled to something that you think someone else should pay for.

Case closed there.

you think you're entitled to something that you think someone else should pay for.

That’s not what’s happening though? Education is provided for out of public funds, everyone is entitled to it.

Taxpayers aren’t paying for any public services. Government decides in it’s budget how much will be spent, and where it will be spent, in the interests of the common good of Irish society.

The whole “I don’t want my taxes paying for your children’s education” argument, is just dumb.

I am all for separation of church and state. I think the sooner the better.

Let the state buy the buildings used for health and education at the market rate and provide the services that were given either freely or at a reduced rate.