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Ukraine (Mod Note & Threadbanned Users in OP)

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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,445 ✭✭✭McGiver


    Very likely. Mr Biden et al will have a talk with Erdoğan if needed. Turkey can't really block anything. Finland and Sweden add significant manpower, and gear and strategic value to NATO (from defensive point of view obviously).

    Erdoğan is going to run in "elections" in a year so I'm pretty sure it's all about that. Plus he's in real danger of revolt or being overthrown (yes, he's sort of a mini-Putin) because of failed stupid monetary policy experiments causing inflation to rise to 70%! When high inflation kicked in, instead of increasing the interest rates the Turkish central Bank cut them leading to the 70%. It's as smart as using petrol to put out a fire instead of water...



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,239 ✭✭✭Pussyhands




  • Registered Users Posts: 4,886 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    You're playing semantic games around the term "negotiation" there but we're mostly agreeing (apart from how harshly you view French/German etc. policy [esp. past policy] on Russia/Putin). Maybe you just expected a lot more from the large EU members like Germany than me?

    I find it hard to monster them the way it seems very popular to do in the discussions here, on this site. Noone else, no other leaders in Europe/US etc., seem to come in for as much ire. No one mentions Obama's naive and failed "reset" policy with Russia for example.

    Ireland, that I know most about obviously, could do more. Again, you mention this (as I did on "Russia" thread in CA forum) people get angry + give out all kinds of reasons why x or y "can't be done". It even has a bad energy policy too (or maybe no real policy and let the market handle it), that leaves us reliant on others who don't wish us well currently and could end in disaster. Warning lights are flashing, but I think so long as power still comes out of the socket and the gas comes out when you turn a knob few care, and the govt. shows little urgency. As with the Germans, take the easier path till the evil day finally comes/the **** hits the fan whatever metaphor you prefer.

    I agree Putin hasn't been negotiating honestly at all, he may begin that if/when he sees no other options. That point doesn't seem to have been reached yet. I don't see how talking to the man signals weakness (there's lots of other things the EU and various European countries, incl. Ireland, have done or not done as regards Russia that signal that more clearly to me). The sanctions, such as they are, will stay and hopefully be extended, the weapons and support will continue to go to Ukraine. Nothing changes there, and don't think Macron can or will sell out Ukraine by phoning up Putin now and again (or accepting his calls/listening to his rants).



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,036 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    Depends on how many of Turkey's demands are met, they are quite out there:

    • NATO should classify not only the Kurdistan Workers’ Party (PKK) but also the Syrian Defense Forces (SDF) and the Fetullah Terrorist Organization (FETO) in the alliance’s list of threats.
    • The United States should then extradite Pennsylvania-based dissident cleric Fethullah Gülen to Turkey.
    • All NATO members, including Sweden and Finland, must cease any activity by the PKK, SDF, or FETO on their territories.
    • The United States and other NATO bodies must lift all sanctions related to Turkey’s purchase of the S-400, including sanctions upon the Turkish Defense Industry Directorate.
    • Turkey would not only receive the new F-16s and upgrade kits for its existing fleet, but Turkey will also be able to rejoin the F-35 program from which it was expelled after activating the Russian S-400s.
    • Lastly, the United States would cease preventing Turkey from exporting military products containing Western components.

    Emphasis mine. NATO doesnt want anyone to be mixing Russian AA with their flagship F35 for fear the results might be unfavourable.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,930 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe



    Russia has suggested it may cut off Ukraine from Europe’s largest nuclear plant unless Kyiv pays Moscow for electricity, AFP reports.

    The Zaporizhzhia nuclear power station in southeastern Ukraine was captured by Russian troops after they invaded the country on 24 February.

    Russia’s deputy prime minister, Marat Khusnullin, was quoted by Russian news agencies as saying:

    If the energy system of Ukraine is ready to receive and pay, then (the plant) will work for Ukraine. If not, then ( the plant) will work for Russia.

    Khusnullin’s remarks came after Russian officials indicated that Moscow intends to remain in territories it has occupied in southern Ukraine, such as the Kherson region and large parts of Zaporizhzhia.

    Khusnullin said there was “no doubt” the Zaporizhzhia plant will remain operational, adding:

    We have a lot of experience of working with nuclear power plants, we have companies in Russia that have this experience.

    Ukraine’s nuclear agency, Energoatom, said today that the Zaporizhzhia plant continued to feed the national power grid.

    A spokesperson for Energoatom said Russians “do not have the technical capacity to supply energy from the Zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant to Russia or Crimea”.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,519 ✭✭✭Asdfgh2020


    That’s something to be really proud of isn’t it…..😡😡



  • Posts: 5,917 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    IMO what ever about the PKK, the arms embargo is what is really the issue.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,445 ✭✭✭McGiver


    The Ottomans are trying to intimidate. They could end up out of NATO 😉 Or as a seriously diminshed member.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,445 ✭✭✭McGiver


    The mafia strikes back...

    So that's Bulgaria, Poland and Finland so far. Thankfully, the Finns are smart and gas presents only 5% of their energy mix. They've been reducing it long term.

    Russia to halt gas flows to Finland on Saturday | Reuters

    In other news, the rouble is the strongest vs USD since 2018, which looks good but is bad for country that has 95% of its economy dependent on exports of raw materials denominated in dollars/euros.

    Ruble Hits 5-Year High as Gas Buyers Bend to Putin’s Will (yahoo.com)

    Unfortunately, it looks like some big customers (Germany and Italy) agreed to pay in roubles...who would have thought. This is a weakness and direct support of the Russian war effort, the gas exports into EU are worth about as much per day as what Russian invasion costs per day. 75% of it is Germany+Italy.

    Thankfully, the Russian default is very close, US Treasury licence expires 25 May which will prevent Russia making next payments.

    Russian debt default odds jump to 90% while Yellen confirms a report the US will likely block bond payments (yahoo.com)

    Russia makes early debt payment dash in bid to swerve default (msn.com)



  • Registered Users Posts: 116 ✭✭Charrychar


    In all honesty though we can’t blame Putin for all of this, Ukraine has been a failed state since its independence controlled by nazis and Western puppets.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,166 ✭✭✭saabsaab




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,583 ✭✭✭Field east


    So what if that is the case. It did not invadeRussia. Why did / does RU mind its own business . Ukr has no nuclear warheads . rU has loads. Is Ru not one of the biggest countries. In the world with wast riches in oil, gas, grain , fertiliser, etc. what business had Putin invading another country that was leaving it alone. Please answer without using the Nazi/ western puppet smokescreen if you can. PS what about the other failed states and while you are at it what is your definition of a failed state or is it a word you just

    lucked from someone’s speech?



  • Registered Users Posts: 925 ✭✭✭ilkhanid




  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,342 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Man, this thread had got so quiet I almost missed the sparring with Bad Take Merchants trying to put Ukraine's existential crisis on the shoulders of Ukrainians. Poor, misunderstood Putin. He just had to invade a sovereign country, just had to you understand? The patronising attitude that somehow Ukrainians are chumps and pawns.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,675 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Why feed the Bots?



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,342 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Cos if they are a bot, then we should make it clear to their master that the bullshít doesn't hold sway, or even generate pause for thought. If they're a real person holding deep to this idea of "The West" as the ultimate bogeyman, then again, we should call it out for the nonsense it is.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,583 ✭✭✭Field east


    If only to keep the thread alive I have to say the following to bring some balance to a very one sided debate.

    Because Mr Putin is so victimised; being constantly put down ,; few , if anyone, believes that he ‘ tells it as it is’ - unbelievable ; being accused of poisoning RU living overseas- has he not enough to be doing at home; imprisoning RU that break the law in RU - as happens throughout the world - so what’s wrong with RU doing the same ; having a genuine interest in All Russian speakers throughout the world and looking after their welfare where and at all possible,; accused of telling lies, half truths and not keeping to agreements IT IS ONLY RIGHT THAT RESPECT IS SHOWN TO ALL HIS SUPPORTERS until they emerge from the tunnel they find themselves in !



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,904 ✭✭✭✭josip


    So do you think England should invade NZ, Aus, the US and our good selves to protect the speakers of their language?

    And by invade I mean destroy all our infrastructure and kill, torture and rape our men, women and children?

    Have you got kids FieldEast?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,994 ✭✭✭ambro25




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,583 ✭✭✭Field east


    No , England should not be allowed. Do’nt ask me why. BUt if you have Putins mob no , give him a ring ant I am 100% sure that he would have a very logical and acceptable answer for you. He has an incredible capacity to double think, obstrucate, twist, deflect, etc,etc,etc,. He will probably prove to you that the British are Nazi supporters - via its monarchy’s links to German aristrocy and therefor it’s a failed state and should be levelled. So your question of England invading any English speaking country does not arise. Swallow all that!!!!!!!!



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  • Registered Users Posts: 17,930 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    This is just complete garbage. This is 100% on Putin. Endless meddling in Ukrainian politics, poisoning politicians, annexing their territory, operating a bald-faced Russian operation to seize the East of the country, right up to a full-scale Wehrmacht style invasion on multiple axes. Besides butchering the people and cynically destroying their infrastructure, they are literally stealing their harvest and selling it abroad, forcing them to use the occupiers currency, issuing foreign birth certificates, ripping down war memorials, dismantling and destroying their cultural identity piece by piece. This isn't just empire building by Putin, he is systematically trying to erase the Ukrainian identity. They are burning Ukrainian books, there are filtration camps.. we've seen all this before.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,342 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    Not sure if this is meant to be sarcasm, which is against the charter anyway, but I have no idea what point you're trying to make here. It's well and good calling it "one sided debate", but that tends to be what happens when one country invades another without justification.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,930 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,994 ✭✭✭ambro25


    Russia’s Counsellor to the United Nations in Geneva has resigned.




  • Registered Users Posts: 8,239 ✭✭✭Pussyhands


    Russia has said they may be open to a prisoner swap if they get Victor Medvedchuk back. He's a Putin ally and partially one of the reasons Putin invaded.

    Zelenskyy put him under house arrest, cut his politicial party out of the public. This is where Putin gets his "nazi" thing from as Zelensky essentially blocked a pro Russia politician from having any influence. It's the same thing Putin does himself.

    One thing from watching a documentary on Putin is that over the years he ends up getting what he wants. He's very smart and along with China, they've likely infiltrated the globe so much that the EU and the US are in trouble no matter what they do. They'll not be able take down China/Russia without taking down themselves.

    With this monkeypox thing, who the hell knows anymore where it's coming from. Bioweapons could well be in play.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,689 ✭✭✭Economics101


    Either: (i) The Russians are now scraping the bottom of the barrel for bots, or (ii) some deranged Trot in his attic thinks he has something to say, or (iii) someone is trying to provoke people just for the hell of it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,583 ✭✭✭Field east


    Yes, it was meant to be but I did not realise dat it was against boards charter . Tks for heads up



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,904 ✭✭✭✭josip


    He wanted Ukraine and not even the Russian shills believe he's getting that now.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,555 ✭✭✭amandstu


    Respect to the man.Russia is and will be an honourable nation.It has been betrayed by a section of its population though and will have an excruciating time finding its true values when the dust settles



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,994 ✭✭✭ambro25


    The monkey pox is coming from the Democratic Republic of Congo, wherein it has always existed but started making a comeback in anger (as smallpox vaxx rates fell off a cliff), into the UK and Europe most recently via a massive (300k) gay pride event in Spain or the Balearics.

    No Ukrainian biolabs or GRU/FSB types involved, you can put the tinfoil hat back down and leave the monkey pox off this thread.



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