Gardai conspire to ignore thousands of reported crimes
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Your "case study" was for money that went missing in 2021. You know evidence is meant to be relevant to the cases you are talking about??
It has nothing to do with the money that disappeared in Malahide in 2013, totalling €77k or Balbriggan, totalling €7k in 2013.
Neither amount was ever recovered, no prosecutions were ever forthcoming.
So the cases you quoted had nothing whatsoever to do with your "case study". Evidence, ha!!
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ya know what , your logic or lack there of isnt worth trying to figure out.
999 calls dealt with by civilian staff are the gardai fault and is some who linked to money that went missing but was later found.
but the fact that it was found has nothing to do with the fact that it went missing .
sorry chap i haven't the training to be dealing with you
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No you seem to be lacking in basic logic. Maybe that's the training you missed.
Money that went missing in 2013, and was never recovered, HAS NOTHING TO DO with money that went missing in 2021 and was recovered.
Same as a murder that happened in Cork in 2013 and was never solved, would HAVE NOTHING TO DO with a murder in Dublin in 2021 that was solved.
Separate cases, separate outcomes.
I don't think I can dumb it down any more, it's literally at it's base level now. The money that went missing in 2021 and was investigated and found, is not the same money as went missing in 2013 and was never recovered.
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just to help clarify your thinking here do you thin that the same person was involved in this 999 calls issue as is re sponsible for the money going missing , is that why you brought it up ? are they now suspect in these two murders ?
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My own fault for engaging. Typical cop.
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You're talking out of your hole, while trying to downplay the seriousness of what is an extremely serious matter. You're deflecting and trying to mitigate any negative reactions by posting links to CAB seizures and other crap that has no bearing on the matter being discussed. You know absolutely nothing about the content of the calls which were ignored. Nothing. And instead of acting like any normal sane person would, you immediately circle the wagons and start throwing out bluster about how great the Gardaí are. You make claims that these incidents are isolated and not very indicative of the real truth, yet you provide links to isolated nuisance callers, claiming this is part of the reason for these cancelled calls. The blue wall of silence is alive and well, it seems.
I mean, your most recent gotcha is "that evidence wasn't stolen, duh, it was just lost for a few months" as if that isn't horrifying on its own and indicative of the laissez-faire attitude anyone who has EVER dealt with the Guards before is familiar with. Imagine you were convicted of a crime because they left your exonerating evidence in the wrong poxy room. Or worse, it was thrown out due to to the fact you couldn't prove it hadn't been tampered with. And, still, the matter of the missing thousands in evidence money hangs over the discussion while you ignore it completely.
Where's all the missing oney? That money was found.......what you talking about Willis? No, not that money......this money, and this money, and this money...... ..........[radio static]............
Our national police force are a joke. Work-shy, lazy, belligerent, authoritarian, bullies who would get the sh1t kicked out of them on a regular basis if they weren't hiding behind a badge and uniform. Any decent police service worth their salt would have a conniption if they were to accompany our boys in blue for a day.
The irony is that you are calling someone a 'detective' for not being able to figure out that the 'stolen money' wasn't stolen. Turns out, you yourself are mistaken and are talking about some other pile of 'stolen money', which is another example that proves their incompetence. Instead of having the good grace of admitting your error, you doubled down and started dishing out insults and getting obtuse. Again, actions that are all-to-familiar with anyone who has to deal with your colleagues on the regular.
For the record, ACAB is spelled with all capital letters, though your aversion to correct spelling and syntax is quite telling. Looks like you won't be making detective yourself anytime soon, Columbo.
Proposition:
If even one of those calls turns out to have been a genuine, valid call that should have been dealt with, wasn't, and caused harm to someone......then everything you've posted in this thread to defend the ignoring of those calls can be dismissed. Just one. Same goes for your pal on page 1 talking about ringing the guards about homework. If that turns out to be the case, will you come back here and apologise for defending the indefensible?
Because I don't think you will. Have you ever not responded to a call because you felt it wasn't worth your time?
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having a bad day are ya ?
want to talk about stuff that has no bearing on the thread ?
some one post saying that the gardai stole money out of a station , but they didnt , and it annoys you to see that ? ffs . google the pems system ,
your angered by people with more information that you who try to inform you of facts , lot easier to be offended and outraged.
try to look through the noise and bolster and anger , its gone from thousands to a few all of a sudden ,
you want a perfect police force , you want to pay for it ? resource it with numbers equipment , the call dispatch system used is from the 70s ffs,
if your looking for a target for your anger kid look else where columbo.
acab reflects the mentality of the loud and ignorant who love to shout before they know what its about
the lower case reflects my level of respect for those so afflicted.
as for your proposition ? i wouldn't tell you how to do your job because I don't know how or what effects it has on you, but you feel free to make your silly comments about other people
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having a bad day are ya ?
I'm not actually, I'm in great mood thanks.
want to talk about stuff that has no bearing on the thread ?
No, thanks, that's why my entire post was about Gardaí corruption and laziness
some one post saying that the gardai stole money out of a station , but they didnt , and it annoys you to see that ? ffs . google the pems system ,
Incorrect. Someone posted about missing money from almost a decade ago and you posted a link to an un-sourced garda spiel about missing money last year. They are not the same cases. It is not the same money. It's not even the same stations, in all likelihood. The missing money from 2013 is still missing. The fact that you cannot get your head around this, despite having it explained to you multiple times at this stage speaks volumes.
your angered by people with more information that you who try to inform you of facts , lot easier to be offended and outraged.
- I'm not angry at all. You're the one who started lashing out and dishing out insults. Projection much?
- You don't have more information than me or anyone else on this matter. If you have, you certainly haven't demonstrated it. Do you know who does have more knowledge about this current scandal? The whistleblowers who reported it. Funny how you're not giving those guys, your fellow coppers, the benefit of the doubt when they have more info than you do. Funny that.
- Your relative ease at being outraged and offended would lend credence to the last part of your sentence alright
try to look through the noise and bolster and anger , its gone from thousands to a few all of a sudden
I've no idea what this sentence means. Please keep your anger and outrage in check and try to rephrase it in plain English, please
if your looking for a target for your anger kid look else where columbo. you want a perfect police force , you want to pay for it ? resource it with numbers equipment , the call dispatch system used is from the 70s ffs,
Never said that's what I wanted. At the very least, I'd expect to have a call answered and followed up on. Instead, we have insiders, with more knowledge than anyone else, telling us that this is not the case..........and they're being slaughtered and their character assassinated by members of the force because of the Us vs Them attitude.
acab reflects the mentality of the loud and ignorant who love to shout before they know what its about
And yet, you're completely ignorant of the current scandal while also being very loud about how it's all a load of rubbish before you know what it's about? Hypocrisy much?
the lower case reflects my level of respect for those so afflicted.
Your last post had 210+ words in it, over 1000+ letters, and not one capital letter. Not a single one. A distinct lack of punctuation also. This is usually the sign of someone who didn't do well in school. Ironically, everyone I've ever known who went on to become a Guard also didn't do well in school. Funny that. Coincidence much?
as for your proposition ? i wouldn't tell you how to do your job because I don't know how or what effects it has on you, but you feel free to make your silly comments about other people
I'm not telling you how to do your job. I'm asking you if you'll be decent enough to come back if/when you've been proven wrong, and admit that you were wrong. That you cannot understand this simple paragraph is unsurprising.
Like I said, not exactly the A class in school.
Your refusal to answer a basic question on your job is indicative of the bluster and Omerta associated with AGS also. I hope none of your loved ones ever have to call the emergency number only to be fobbed off by some lazy, power-mad, ignorant prick who was bullied in secondary school and is taking it all out on the rest of us.
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I wan inviting you i was pointing out that is exactly what is going on here in spite onf the delussions of some posters
unsourced garda speel is the gsco report on the matter ,but ya you bothered to read that ?
of course im restricted in what i post here . in fact i cant speak to journalist public representative of member of the judiciary with out sanction on threat of prosecution .
did you see the posts from the fella who claimed to have worked as a call taker , was exposed as a bluffer in about five mins flat
if you feel insulted report it , im really not that invested in you emotions .
I have a National cert and a degree in separate areas , the majority of people i know have at least a diploma. i know more than one with masters and one girl working on her third masters. as long as my se of lower case annoys some people i ll keep at it :-)
your sneery insinuations about "not doing well in school " only expose your already obvious attitude
you need to read the thread , but ill walk you through it again , Call comes into mostly civilian call taker who enters it into CAD system ( the one from the 70s) and assigned a unique number that cant be altered of removed , then its sent to dispatcher who is usually a Garda ,but some times not, local resource is dispatched by them to the location and assigned to a specific person .Once the first record is made by the call taker , it has to be dealt with. it doesn't go away ever.
its already gone from thousands of reported crimes to 114 , and well below 100 now ,
but ya im sure you know more about this coz you read the comments section in the journal.
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That was my 2nd thought after they assumed my gender
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Gets called out on the fact that he's mixing up separate cases, has it explained to him in simple terms, multiple times, and STILL won't acknowledge that he got it wrong.
Takes a special kind of person, I suppose. The fact remains, the guts of 100 grand went missing from two separate Garda stations and are still unaccounted for. You can bleat on about your GSOC report from last year all you want, that money from 2013 is still unaccounted for. Stolen, by members of the Gardaí. Or by someone else, though I'm not sure which is preferable.......you're either untrustworthy or incompetent.
"But but but but......It's only 100 cases that were ignored", like that makes it okay
Once the first record is made by the call taker , it has to be dealt with. it doesn't go away ever.
And yet, the entire premise of this thread is in direct contravention of that statement. How do you square those words with "an ongoing examination of the circumstances, response and challenges presented by the invalid and unwarranted closure of CAD incidents"?
but ya im sure you know more about this coz you read the comments section in the journal
The difference between me and you, Einstein, is I'm not PRETENDING to know more about this......you are.
I never said that every case was wrongfully or rightfully closed........you seem to think they were all frivolous incidents.
I never claimed to know all about the secret goings on behind the scenes.......you did.
I'm not the one who is pretending to only use lower case letters to get under peoples' skin.......you are, for some bizarre reason. Spoiler alert: it doesn't get under anyone's skin, it just makes you look like you're uneducated.
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the fact that you didn't bother or were incapable of following a link and reading it is my fault ?
" I hope none of your loved ones ever have to call the emergency number only to be fobbed off by some lazy, power-mad, ignorant prick who was bullied in secondary school and is taking it all out on the rest of us".
ya sounds like you are a fair minded and well though out kinda person , did you lose a girlfriend to a lad in uniform or something ?
but then you dont have any idea who took missing money from 10 years ago or i it actually showed up lost like the one I informed you about then or if some one was made answerable ? a garda? civilian staff ? contracts working in the station . OPW.
the premise of he tread as i explained to you is thousands of calls , but thats not true its less than 100 , still under review an likely to fall significantly, so 203. calls down to 23000 then less than 100 . do you reckon you could work out the % ? not good enough for the perfection you require in your policing i suppose
Expert investigating cancelled 999 calls not able to examine recordings (irishtimes.com)
After being walked through the system you know nothing about do you understand it better now , its nice to educate people some times, might help them think before they type . I wouldn't could it as an achievement to know more about it that you though Einstein.
now if all you can manage is try insinuate sneer and try to put words in my mouth your not worth bothering about.
do you need that in capital letters ? or will the small letters do ya kid ?
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I couldn't help but notice this quote
doesn't appear in the post you quoted:
Are you putting words in someone's mouth in order to make these attacks?
Nevermind I see it was an earlier post, carry on I guess.
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talk about a pointless post
when you grow up do you want to be a mod or something ?
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Well this is going well.
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The real funny thing is gardai getting scorpy that the public don't hold them in high esteem based on their interactions with gardai 🤣
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Another meandering, incoherent mess of a post. I'll try to muddle through it.
No idea what you're talking about in your first sentence. The fact remains, you tried to explain away the missing money from 2013 by linking to a GSOC report about missing money from recent years. There is still no explanation for where the money that went missing in 2013 ended up.
but then you dont have any idea who took missing money from 10 years ago or i it actually showed up lost like the one I informed you about then or if some one was made answerable ? a garda? civilian staff ? contracts working in the station . OPW.
There are two options here: A) a serving member of the gardaí stole it, or B) someone else got access to the evidence which was under Garda control, and stole it.
So, it was either a corrupt copper or an incompetent one who is at fault. Try and deflect all you want, but those are the facts. The fact you think that someone from the OPW getting access to and stealing evidence relating to court cases somehow exonerates AGS, is laughably ridiculous. If that money had somehow been recovered, it would have been publicised somewhere and you'd have thrown it back in our faces. You haven't, so we're gonna have to go with the obvious until you can prove otherwise.
That link you provided doesn't back up the figures in your post. There were 203,000 cancelled calls in the period being examined. Of them, the serious ones being looked at numbered around 23,300+.
Where are you pulling this "less than 100" figure from?
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A more recent article, from this week, puts the number at 22,000+
An examination of 999 call data showed the problem was widespread across the country, with 22,595 calls made to the emergency services between 2019 and 2020 cancelled without explanation. Two gardai involved in cancelling calls have been suspended pending investigations into the matter.
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A former garda detective has been jailed for four years for sexual assaults on his younger sister in the 1970s.
The 62-year-old man, who cannot be named to protect the victim's anonymity, was aged 19 to 20 years old in the summer and autumn of 1979 when he repeatedly indecently assaulted the girl at the family home.
She was aged 15 at the time.
The now retired garda pleaded guilty to five counts of indecent assault and five counts of unlawful carnal knowledge of his sister on unknown dates between May to October 1979.
A garda witness told Eoin Lawlor BL, prosecuting, that the offences took place in the girl's bedroom and in a shed on a farm.
Now there has been a complaint made to GSOC saying that when the sexual abuse initially came to the attention of Gardai that they did nothing about it. Time will tell but it would certainly explain why there was an eight year gap between the Garda detective admitting that he sexually abused his own sister and him actually being charged with the crime.
This of course comes off the back of Drew Harris admitting last month a Garda did next to nothing in another sexual abuse case that was referred to them by Greater Manchester Police
A Garda who received a "comprehensive report" from a UK police force about a child sexual abuser in the State did "very little" to investigate the offender, meaning he remained a risk to other children, the Garda Siochana Ombudsman Commission (Gsoc) has found.
Very ironic that the same organisation that tried to smear Maurice McCabe as a paedophile has now been found to have done next to nothing when they had a comprehensive report of sexual abuse from another police force on an actual paedophile. You couldnt make it up.
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Organisation as a whole - everyone in the force was involved, or just a few of the 14000?
Amount of time it took was quite long, but sexual assault cases, especially historical ones, can take longer. I see no attempt or anything of trying to hide it. It would have to be treated slightly differently because he was a serving Garda at the time of admitting, so that may have been part of it (extra policies and checks). But I've heard of cases taking longer. At least it's finally done and sorted and the paedo is getting a year in jail (a bit short imo, but I'm no Judge). Will wait for the GSOC report as to the delay reasons.
The second one is literally about 1 member not actioning something in proper time, which has been dealt with. But no, the entire organisation is to blame there...
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On the first case what took 8 years, how can you even try to justify that? The Garda detective admitted in an interview in 2012 that he had sexually abused his sister yet it took a full 8 years to actually charge him in 2020. He should have been charged straight away once he admitted the crime. How many other children might he have abused during that 8 years?
In the second case maybe you think that a Garda allowing a known paedophile his continued freedom to carry on sexually abusing more children is acceptable but I can assure you that the general public does not.
You're trying to defend the indefensible now, you are literally excusing Garda incompetence that allows paedos time and freedom to sexually abuse even more children. These people are dangerous and need to be taken off the streets. But as we can see from the links in one case a Garda detective was the paedo and it took 8 years to charge him and in the other case Manchester Police gave the Gardai a detailed report on a paedo living here and nothing was done about it. This is not acceptable behaviour for any police force but sure carry on your defending of them allowing paedos out on the loose.
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Is anyone suprised at this? It's been obvious for a long time that the Gardai don't do ethics or standards
But its just a few bad eggs no doubt 😂
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Hell of a lot of bad eggs coming out of there alright.
If it was a real chicken farm health and safety would have shut it down long ago.
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It should be renamed An Garda Salmonella
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Who said I'm justifying it? Do you have inside knowledge on how investigations work, the length of time it takes in some cases? Yes, it was very long, but neither of us were involved in the investigation so neither of us knows why. I believe that's being investigated right now by GSOC? What more do you want? Everyone to just go "Ah yeah, every single Garda is a paedo"? And the fact that you said he should have been charged straight away after admitting goes to show how little you know about the investigative procedure.
You seem to have missed the point of my post, which was clearly referenced in the very first sentence: Organisation as a whole - everyone in the force was involved, or just a few of the 14000?
The replies were to show that it wasn't the whole organisation, as you implied, in both cases. At no point did I defend the length of time it took, nor did I even discuss the second one other than referencing it was a single member which has been dealt with. You're putting words in my mouth saying I'm trying to defend something when I'm clearly not. I'm discussing it from my point of view, with my experience, that's it. I will defend AGS as a whole because I don't hold the opinion that they're all corrupt. But that doesn't suit your anti-Garda agenda so you pick and choose what other people say and wrap your opinion around it.
If you don't like my replies, put me on ignore. Simples.
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There was an article on The Sunday Times today from John Mooney again, this looks absolutely shocking, this is much more than calls cancelled because its related to kids not doing there homework, which was the played down comments very early in this thread.
I've added the link to the article below, I've also added some extracts from the article, not sure if I can post the full article.
We have very senior gardai saying last year no one was harmed to now saying (in the May Policing Authority Meeting) there was an "element of harm"...
Cancelled 999 calls ‘involved rape and assault’
Claims by senior gardai that no one came to harm as a result of the cancellation of 999 calls have been disputed by security sources who say that some of the emergency calls related to rapes, domestic violence and assaults on women and children.
A small number of calls made in Dublin related to alleged rapes while others were made by people as they were being attacked. Among them was a female Traveller from Meath who sought help after she had been subjected to a violent assault in which she was bitten on the face and kicked in the stomach. She told gardai she was about to be attacked again but got no response.
Another 999 caller from Galway reported that youths were trying to set an intellectually disabled boy’s hair on fire. There are many other similar incidents, according to garda sources.
The Policing Authority has received contradictory accounts during its public meetings with garda management about the issue, first highlighted by The Sunday Times. The authority has been told on at least two occasions that no one came to extreme harm as a result of the cancellation of thousands of 999 calls between 2019 and 2020.
Garda Headquarters initially denied the issue existed before acknowledging that a scoping exercise was under way. The force later acknowledged that an examination of 999 call data showed the problem was widespread across the country, with 22,595 calls made to the emergency services cancelled without explanation.
The controversy is the subject of a number of protected disclosures by gardai of various ranks who allege attempts were made by their superiors to conceal the issue when it was first discovered on October 8, 2020.
So far 55 internal disciplinary files have been opened into gardai who terminated calls made by members of the public. Some officers cancelled thousands of calls, with one terminating more than 10,000. The outcome of these internal investigations is unknown.
The first article dated 06th Dec 2020
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You seem to have missed the point of my post, which was clearly referenced in the very first sentence: Organisation as a whole - everyone in the force was involved, or just a few of the 14000?
The replies were to show that it wasn't the whole organisation, as you implied, in both cases.
ah jaysis its like groundhog day with you. I asked you six weeks ago to find any quote on the thread that says all Gardai are corrupt as you keep claiming and you werem't able to do it. I havent claimed that in any of my posts becasue I dont believe it myself and Im not in the habit of posting things I dont believe. . As I said back then your imagination is running wild and you're seeing things that are simply not there and you had your opportunity to prove your point and you couldnt do it becasue nobody including me has claimed what you keep saying again and again and again.
As for the Garda paedophile walking the streets for 8 years after he sexually abused his sister and after he admitted his guilt well if you think leaving a paedophile free in society to sexually abuse more children is acceptable behaviour from AGS then I can assure you that the general public do not. Saying " Yes, it was very long, but neither of us were involved in the investigation so neither of us knows why" doesnt cut the mustard becasue there is no excuses for that whatsoever. If someone admits their guilt to Gardai it is a slam dunk to convict them but that didnt happen. Instead it is now alleged they dragged their feet becasue they didnt want to prosecute one of their own. But go on then tell me Im wrong becasue you once worked for AGS and know it all, why dont you outline how a man admiring his guilt to sexual abuse can possibly go 8 years after theT admission without being convicted. The GSOC investigation is into the Gardai btw, not the DPP or anyone else involved in criminal justice, just the Gardai. So whats your explanation for that given you claim this superior knowledge from having worked in AGS.
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Thats absolutely shocking stuff. Imagine someone getting beaten up and they call 999 and their call is ignored, its unbelievable. A child with intellectual disabilities getting his hair set on fire and Gardai didnt respond to the 999 call, same with victims of rapes, domestic violence and sexual assaults And then one Garda getting terminating over 10,000 999 calls, I think on top of everything it is getting clear now that aside from the scale of Garda incompetence there was also a cover up going on in the background to try to hide all of this.
And to think we were told on post #2 of this thread by a poster who is a Garda that "there is nothing to see here", thats some laugh now. I note that they've since deleted their account, quelle surprise
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