Off the shelf budget gaming system

54and56 · 07-06-2022 7:08pm #1

Hi all,

I got a lot of help here 5-6 years ago to spec a gaming rig for my son which we ordered the component for from Germany, built together and he got tons of use out of. He's now 21, has flown the nest and taken the PC with him which continues to serve him well albeit I think he upgraded both the processor and graphics card about 18 months ago.

My 16 year old daughter is now looking for a gaming PC but she's neither a serious gamer or into tech the way my son was so isn't interested in building her own rig.

I'm therefore looking for recommendations for a fairly entry level off the shelf Windows based machine including monitor, keyboard and mouse that will easily handle the likes of Fortnite and Minecraft and maybe a bit more but that's about it as this is likely to be something which will get a lot of use for a few months then fade away to intermittent use as something else becomes the new hobby or interest.

I don't have a fixed budget, I can be fairly flexible and understand the difference between cheap and value for money but do want to keep the spend it on the lower end of the scale if possible.

Any suggestions?

Jon Doe · 07-06-2022 8:34pm

I got this quote at PCSpecialist:

Case

PCS 3601 CASE

Processor (CPU)

AMD Ryzen 5 5600G Six Core CPU with Radeon™ Graphics (3.9GHz-4.4GHz/19MB CACHE/AM4)

Motherboard

GIGABYTE B550 AORUS ELITE AX V2: DDR4, USB 3.2, Wi-Fi - ARGB Ready

Memory (RAM)

16GB Corsair VENGEANCE DDR4 3200MHz (2 x 8GB)

Graphics Card

INTEGRATED GRAPHICS ACCELERATOR (GPU)

1st M.2 SSD Drive

500GB SAMSUNG 970 EVO PLUS M.2, PCIe NVMe (up to 3500MB/R, 3200MB/W)

Power Supply

CORSAIR 450W CV SERIES™ CV-450 POWER SUPPLY

Power Cable

1 x 1.5 Metre UK Power Cable (Kettle Lead)

Processor Cooling

STANDARD AMD CPU COOLER

Thermal Paste

STANDARD THERMAL PASTE FOR SUFFICIENT COOLING

Sound Card

ONBOARD 6 CHANNEL (5.1) HIGH DEF AUDIO (AS STANDARD)

Network Card

10/100/1000 GIGABIT LAN PORT

USB/Thunderbolt Options

MIN. 2 x USB 3.0 & 2 x USB 2.0 PORTS @ BACK PANEL + MIN. 2 FRONT PORTS

Operating System

Windows 11 Home 64 Bit - inc. Single Licence [KK3-00027]

Operating System Language

United Kingdom - English Language

Windows Recovery Media

Windows 10/11 Multi-Language Recovery Image - Unlimited Downloads from Online Account

Office Software

FREE 30 Day Trial of Microsoft 365® (Operating System Required)

Anti-Virus

NO ANTI-VIRUS SOFTWARE

Browser

Microsoft® Edge

Monitor

ASUS VP229HE 21.5"

Keyboard & Mouse

LOGITECH® MK270 WIRELESS KEYBOARD & MOUSE COMBO

Warranty

3 Year Standard Warranty (1 Month Collect & Return, 1 Year Parts, 3 Year Labour)

Delivery

2 - 3 DAY DELIVERY TO REPUBLIC OF IRELAND

Build Time

Standard Build - Approximately 4 to 7 working days

Price: €1,016.00 including VAT and Delivery

Unique URL to re-configure: https://www.pcspecialist.ie/saved-configurations/amd-am4-gen3-pc/cYHG3Hma6D/

If you build the machine yourself, you can get it for substantially less money...

54and56 · 07-06-2022 9:03pm

Thanks John, appreciate you spec'ing that. I didn't realise a .ie site like that existed.

My two comments on the build are:-

Would an integrated GPU have enough grunt to run modern games?
The PC won't have ethernet access so will be running of a fast WiFi Mesh network fed with 400mb fibre. I'd therefore have to add a wireless card to the build but that's no biggie.

Jon Doe · 07-06-2022 11:35pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119171362#Comment_119171362

Yes it should be enough for games @1080~720 at mid-quality settings, depending on the games. You can read more about it here:

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/amd-ryzen-5-5600g-review

If your daughter ever "grows out" of the IGP you can buy an add-on card, plug it to the motherboard, switch the monitor cable to the add-on card and you should be good to go on the games department.

But really, if you have a techie in the family you should demand a favor out of him and have him build the machine for his sister. You might end up saving a few hundred €s. On the other hand if you buy the whole machine at the same store you get a 2 year warranty on the machine, not the parts. Your choice. Here's the same machine as a bunch of parts bought all over the place (even Amazon... 😖):

https://de.pcpartpicker.com/list/Zd4LyK

Those parts would cost you 610€. Just one last detail: the board I picked has integrated WIFI:

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/B550-AORUS-ELITE-AX-V2-rev-10

so no need to add any WIFI expansion cards or UBS dongles...

K.O.Kiki · 08-06-2022 12:43am

https://www.currys.ie/ieen/gaming/pc-gaming/gaming-pcs/pcspecialist-vortex-gr-gaming-pc-intel-core-i3-gtx-1650-1-tb-hdd-256-gb-ssd-10220970-pdt.html

https://www.currys.ie/ieen/computing/pc-monitors/pc-monitors/lg-24mp400-full-hd-23-8-ips-led-monitor-black-10227762-pdt.html

https://www.currys.ie/ieen/gaming/gaming-accessories/gaming-mice/razer-orochi-v2-lightweight-wireless-optical-gaming-mouse-10227456-pdt.html

https://www.currys.ie/ieen/gaming/gaming-accessories/gaming-keyboards/adx-firefight-core-gaming-keyboard-10192052-pdt.html

1'073eur

Older CPU & less RAM but a much better graphics card (about twice as fast) than 5600G.

Cheapo 24" monitor. Very good mouse. Cheap keyboard.

All from Curry's.

If you want a more future-proofed computer though, consider this Lenovo Legion T5 for 1'149 which would have a graphics card 300% faster than the above.

Homelander · 08-06-2022 2:31pm

That first PC Specialist PC is really poor for the money. The 5600G is good for an integrated graphics option but make no mistake, it's low-end and for a €1k machine it makes no sense at all.

Check out the Lenovo.ie website. At the moment you can get an i5-11400F, 16GB Ram, GTX1660 Super with 500GB NVME drive for €900. That would run any game on the market at full HD high settings and great longevity for a kid.

If you want to save money, there's this. i5-11400F, 8GB Ram, 512GB NVME drive, GTX1650 Super for €690. Great value too, might need a RAM upgrade but otherwise it's also solid for any of the latest games at good settings.

Even the €690 Lenovo runs rings around the PC Specialist machine in terms of performance, would be twice as fast in games. Lenovo machines also come with integrated Wifi and Bluetooth.

54and56 · 08-06-2022 2:51pm

Thanks very much for the steer's guys, some great suggestions there. I'll do some homework.

shootermacg · 08-06-2022 3:06pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119174237#Comment_119174237

How does that have 380W power adapter?

08-06-2022 3:15pm

I have an Alienware alpha that I'm looking to offload for small money if any use

very neat small physical footprint and although old at this point would run fortnite and minecraft well

It ran all AAA games at 720 p or 900p or 1080p depending on the game until the PS5 gen cross-platform games started coming out

e.g. I played Control (2019) on it ok.

it's a Nvidia 750ti equivalent gpu and can be overclocked with 1 click on a saved profile on free msi afterburner easily to get another 10% to 15% out of it (no risk to the hardware on the settings)

looks like this (using pic from adverts but not my model)

shootermacg · 08-06-2022 3:17pm

A top tier nvidia graphics card will draw 400W on it's own, and that figure may actually increase with the 4-series. So if you want a simple solution that is future proofed and 2K/4K display, I'd have to recommend at least a 750W power supply. The specified systems don't have much head room with regards power, and you don't really want to have to rewire a new PSU, or buy a card that ends up underpowered.

Just pointing out something to be weary of.

Jon Doe · 08-06-2022 3:31pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119174501#Comment_119174501

From the OP: "that will easily handle the likes of Fortnite and Minecraft and maybe a bit more but that's about it as this is likely to be something which will get a lot of use for a few months then fade away"

The 450W PSU should be enough to support a 150W GPU if the need arises.

K.O.Kiki · 08-06-2022 4:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119174562#Comment_119174562

1000+ euro for a 5600G build is very bad value.

Jon Doe · 08-06-2022 4:34pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119174791#Comment_119174791

I know, that's why I suggested the OP should ask his son to build the machine for his sister @610€. But that is the price to pay for a pre-bulit machine that has the latest technologies, doesn't compromise on storage, memory and can easily have it's graphics expanded with minimal waste - just drop in a dedicated GPU and switch off the integrated graphics - if/when necessary.

PS1: @54and56 I just noticed that my PCBuilder URL included a monitor without a price! Sorry, here's the revised URL

https://de.pcpartpicker.com/list/7yDLyK

still 270€ cheaper than my original PC Specialist machine. That's enough to get a nice dGPU at a later date

https://geizhals.eu/?cat=gra16_512&asuch=&bpmin=250&bpmax=300

PS2: ask your daughter if she would find this kind of graphics quality/performance acceptable:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xG-AVC2WtJ4

deceit · 08-06-2022 7:24pm

If I remember correctly pcspecialists is a mickey mouse operation with terrible service and should be avoided last time I was around here. For a prebuild you would be much better served with something from lenovo/curries etc or see do one of the german stores provide prebuilds.

Homelander · 08-06-2022 8:29pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119174864#Comment_119174864

With all due respect though this is completely false - it's absolutely not the price you pay for a pre-built. I've already posted pre-builds from Lenovo that are way better value and offer infinitely better graphics performance.

There is no point trying to continue recommending the 5600G at that price point. Why would anyone pay a thousand euro for that level of poor performance when you can get a prebuilt for hundreds less that runs the game at 1080p at a much higher and more stable framerate.

The 5600G is something you buy when you want a good base processor but absolutely cannot afford a GPU so have to get by with the iGPU for a time until you can afford one. That would fly on a 500 euro budget, it absolute does not on a 1k budget.

The pre-build Lenovo I posted above for 680 would run Fortnite 3x better than that 5600G machine can, as well as any other game. The only upgrade it'd need would be to replace the 2x4gb for 2x8gb but even that can be put off for a long time as Fortnite, Minecraft, and the like are all perfectly fine with 8gb.

Jon Doe · 08-06-2022 9:53pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119175542#Comment_119175542

That I do not know - to be honest I've never bought a pre-built machine. Germany is a really far place to buy a pre-built machine - it kind of defeats the whole point of post-purchase support in Ireland... as for Lenovo and Curries, I don't like them - by default I consider them too expensive, but that may an effect of me comparing the cost of my custom builds vs the cost of their pre-built machines...

deceit · 08-06-2022 10:05pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119176424#Comment_119176424

All pc specialists the company is doing is buying the parts on your behalf building it and putting a huge markup on it. You would still have to wait for support and any issues I've seen on here their support was dreadful. I would pick pretty much anyone in Ireland over them. Which is why if you need local I'd even recommend currys which is not a great option either.

Jon Doe · 08-06-2022 10:20pm

With all due respect though this is completely false - it's absolutely not the price you pay for a pre-built.

OK. Give the OP a link to a pre built Windows machine with a good CPU, 16 GB of RAM, 500GB of SSD storage, Wifi and that can handle Fortnite/Minecraft at 720/1080 and costs 835€ or less. I say 16 GB of RAM, 500GB of SSD storage because that's the minimum I would buy for myself...

There is no point trying to continue recommending the 5600G at that price point. Why would anyone pay a thousand euro for that level of poor performance when you can get a prebuilt for hundreds less that runs the game at 1080p at a much higher and more stable framerate.

To avoid sacrificing memory or CPU. That's what you did right? Either get the 1 year old CPU or cut the memory to 8GB.

The 5600G is something you buy when you want a good base processor but absolutely cannot afford a GPU so have to get by with the iGPU for a time until you can afford one. That would fly on a 500 euro budget, it absolute does not on a 1k budget.

That's the general idea. The OP doesn't know if the daughter will still be interested in the machine a few months from now. If she is, slip in a RTX 3050 or a GTX 1660 Ti and he's good to go.

The pre-build Lenovo I posted above for 680 would run Fortnite 3x better than that 5600G machine can, as well as any other game. The only upgrade it'd need would be to replace the 2x4gb for 2x8gb but even that can be put off for a long time as Fortnite, Minecraft, and the like are all perfectly fine with 8gb.

That I do not know, but I'm willing to believe you. I would not however buy a gaming PC with 8GB in this day and age. Especially with Windows 10/11... :P

Homelander · 08-06-2022 10:58pm

OK are you deliberately trolling at this stage or what is going on? They were linked earlier and referenced several times since.

Option A. i5-11400F, 16GB, 500GB, GTX1660 Super, Wifi/BT, Win11. 900 euro.

Option B. i5-11400F, 8GB, 500GB, GTX1650 Super, Wifi/BT, Win11. 680 euro.

Even the cheaper machine will offer 300% better gaming performance than that 5600G build. 8GB ram is plenty for Fortnite and Minecraft but if and when they want to upgrade the second machine, it's a zero effort 60 euro upgrade.

I don't understand why you're continuing to push this completely over-priced and terrible value for money PC Specialist machine with these groundless arguments. There's no argument to be made. It's just terrible value no matter what angle you come from.

And also the 11400F is absolutely not a sacrifice. It's identical to the 5600G in performance.

Jon Doe · 08-06-2022 11:38pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119176776#Comment_119176776

OK are you deliberately trolling at this stage or what is going on? They were linked earlier and referenced several times since.

LOL, no I'm just giving you my opinion. And I already mentioned them. Option A I might buy for myself if it weren't for the 1 year CPU. Nevertheless it is a good deal the OP may want to consider - for 65€ extra euros you get a GTX1660 Super. Option B has 8GB of RAM and that that is just not an option as far as I'm concerned.

it's a zero effort 60 euro upgrade.

For you. For someone who's asking for an off the shelf machine that may not be the case.

I don't understand why you're continuing to push this completely over-priced and terrible value for money PC Specialist machine with these groundless arguments.

Because it's my opinion. I am entitled to it you know? And you're free to disagree from it. And it's not groundless. The IGP is unacceptable to you. It may be very well acceptable to a 16 year old girl. Who, two years from now, may go to college at which point she may need a beefier GPU - for a course that requires CAD for example - and she'll be able to put one into her desktop without the need to waste a discrete GPU... These are my arguments. Time may prove them wrong, but they're not groundless. They're just arguments with which you do not agree.

It's just terrible value no matter what angle you come from.

This bit I don't get. The build you listed is 65€ more expensive but somehow that's better value because it runs Fortnight at 180fps instead of my build's 90fps?...

Homelander · 09-06-2022 8:26am

Because you're making ridiculous false equivalences and posting absolute rubbish as facts.

You're making out the 11400F is some out-dated CPU when that's complete nonsense. It came out a few months before the 5600G and is identical in performance. It's still considered an excellent budget CPU and it will last for the best part of a decade.

And again, you're making all these ridiculous false comparisons. "Your" build cannot run Fortnite at 90fps unless you run at 720p low settings and even then it has frequent frame drops.

The Lenovo build even for 680 euro would run it at 1080p ultra settings at stable 90fps+ all the time. The 900 euro build would run it even faster again, as well as other AAA titles if she moves on. That machine, for a 16 year old, would not need upgrading for many, many years at least.

You keep saying "But sure maybe she's fine with the worse performance" but whey an earth would they pay the same money for 300% worse performance?

Also "They can add in a discrete card later" - again yes, but why wouldn't they just buy the Lenovo which has the exact same specs and already has a powerful discrete card in both options.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion but don't expect to be not called out on it when that opinion directly impacts on other people who rely on advice here and pushes them towards awful purchases.

Notwithstanding that anyone who says they would prefer a 5600G + APU over a 11400F + GTX1660 Super because "11400 is few months older" is honestly a bit clueless at best.

I know PC hardware, I have worked with it my entire life. There's a reason I don't advise people on buying cars, houses, TV's or whatever else, because I'm not very knowledgeable about those things and my opinion wouldn't be constructive.

The 5600G makes sense in a low-budget build when you can only afford everything but the GPU - as in, a 500 euro PC. It, once again, makes zero sense in a budget where you can afford an alternative, full, well-kitted out machine which is the actual issue here. It's just plain bad advice, and you keep pushing it despite everyone pointing this out.

I normally wouldn't care but it does annoy me when people come here reliant on this advice, if no-one else had posted the person could have bought that awful PC from PC Specialist trusting your advice.

Jon Doe · 09-06-2022 10:33am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119177379#Comment_119177379

You're making out the 11400F is some out-dated CPU when that's complete nonsense.

I never made any claims as to its performance. I mentioned it's old because it's listed as "Superseded by the Core i5-12400F":

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i5-11400F-vs-AMD-Ryzen-5-5600G/4111vsm1553183

Your" build cannot run Fortnite at 90fps unless you run at 720p low settings and even then it has frequent frame drops.

True. It runs at an average of 90fps @720 and 60fps @1080, if the video above is to be trusted.

That machine, for a 16 year old, would not need upgrading for many, many years at least.

That's your assumption. You don't know what the girl will do with the machine. If she gets into STEM the first thing she'll complain about is the 8GB...

You keep saying "But sure maybe she's fine with the worse performance" but whey an earth would they pay the same money for 300% worse performance?

Because gaming may not be as important to them as it is to you?... Still, if gaming it very important and you're willing to compromise on memory the 690€ machine would do fine.

Also "They can add in a discrete card later" - again yes, but why wouldn't they just buy the Lenovo which has the exact same specs and already has a powerful discrete card in both options.

I already mentioned the 900€ machine would be a good deal. I wouldn't buy it due to the 1 year old CPU; the OP may not have such "problems". :)

Everyone is entitled to an opinion but don't expect to be not called out on it when that opinion directly impacts on other people who rely on advice here and pushes them towards awful purchases.

I don't mind getting called out. The reason I didn't list that machine is because I didn't go to Lenovo. I went to an .ie system integrator, and ruled out the 1650 option on account of being too expensive for a budget machine. I didn't look any further because I knew that KOKiki would know about a deal that would beat anything I might come up with... xD

Notwithstanding that anyone who says they would prefer a 5600G + APU over a 11400F + GTX1660 Super because "11400 is few months older" is honestly a bit clueless at best.

Perhaps. Or perhaps it's just a reflection of my bias against Intel and NVidia... I do rely on the fact that I'm not alone in this forum. There's plenty of people that can suggest alternatives to whatever I might come up with.

I normally wouldn't care but it does annoy me when people come here reliant on this advice, if no-one else had posted the person could have bought that awful PC from PC Specialist trusting your advice.

True. But you see, I knew that someone else would post alternative configurations...

ericfartman · 09-06-2022 1:48pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119176424#Comment_119176424

Shows what you know, lenovo is probably the best value you can get now with regards pre-built gaming PC's.

How on earth were you trying to push an integrated GPU on people as a gaming PC?

Jon Doe · 17-06-2022 12:52am

Shows what you know,

I certainly don't know everything. There are people in this forum that know much more that I do – I just don't have the time to keep track of the market *that* closely. I even have the feeling that certain people in this forum have forgotten more about PC hardware then I will ever know!... 😆

However there's one thing that I do know, about you. You have two main concerns: find the very best gaming machine that you can find at the very lowest price. That's it. As long as you know what's the CPU & GPU you're happy. It's a simple criterion and it works for you. But it doesn't necessarily work for everyone. I, for example, require a bit more of information. How old is the hardware in the machine? What chipset does it have? How good is the motherboard? The SSD, is it SATA or NVMe? It seems the majority of all 2242 M.2's on the market are SATA... Would you buy such a part for yourself?

lenovo is probably the best value you can get now with regards pre-built gaming PC's.

That doesn't surprise me. That's what happens when you keep your workforce under the whip. And here we differ again. Unlike you, when I buy something, I don't see it as 'spending money'. I regard it as 'voting with my wallet'. I prefer to throw my money at companies with a better reputation

based of countries that don't routinely threaten other countries with nuclear weapons

and have a healthier approach to worker safety.

If you 'vote' for China then I suppose that you support all of the above and more.

On the other hand, I 'voted' for an European PC integrator. Is it a bit more expensive? Yes. Does it allow me to *pick* exactly the parts I want? Yes. Does it allow me to ensure the source of my hardware is from democratic countries? Yes, it does.

How on earth were you trying to push an integrated GPU on people as a gaming PC?

I'm not trying to push anything. I don't sell PC hardware. I gave a list of parts that *I* would buy to build a *modern* PC that can play Fortnite and Minecraft reasonably well *and* if in 6 to 12 months the daughter is still interested, she can buy a 3060 perhaps at the same price that she might buy a 1660S today.

Here's something else that I do know for a fact: I know that I'm no longer of conscriptable age. Not so sure about everyone else in this forum.

But then again, all this is just my point of view. And I've been known to be wrong in the past.

Off the shelf budget gaming system

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