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Softening house market?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    With .25% in july and .5% in September the market will cool.



  • Posts: 0 ✭✭✭ Reece Loose Shortchange


    It would make more sense to have higher rate first, inflation already out of control, and .25 or .5 percent of change no where near enough



  • Registered Users Posts: 47 MoneyPrinterGoBuurrrr


    Of course it does, that's why it won't happen.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    If inflation persists then more rate hikes . Anyone do the math on the likely mortgage rates for new and existing mortgage holders with 1 2 3 ecb base rate ? How repayment hikes will affect the amount that can be borrowed



  • Registered Users Posts: 721 ✭✭✭drogon.


    I was doing some rough calculations, say if you were borrowing 300k at 2% over 30 years. Your monthly payment will be about €1,106.14. If you bump up the interest rate to 2.25%, your monthly payment will be €1,143.24. So over the life of the mortgage it will cost you an additional 13K



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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    By sept ECB are thinking it will be .75% plus. Fed speculators are thinking an additional 1.75% . This of course will be the base rate. After that the banks make their % .



  • Registered Users Posts: 721 ✭✭✭drogon.


    My honest opinion is that it will only make a small difference and won't matter in the grand scheme of things.

    At the moment the rental market is so screwed up and unless that is fixed there won't be any impact to the housing market for buyers. Many are just buying cause it is cheaper to buy than to rent, if the bank will lend you some cash and you can find something within your budget that is.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,709 ✭✭✭Buddy Bubs


    I don't see the interest rate hikes affecting the market significantly. Renting here is such a no go and there is so much more demand than supply it won't have much of an affect.

    I don't have the figures to hand of how many serious bidders there are for each house in areas but I know its a high figure.

    A little effect maybe, but not enough that everyone on average incomes will have their pick of houses in their chosen location.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    Interest rates going up will make a big different . Wait and see will come back into the the thinking. Which in turn will drive down demand. Unemployment will rise with enought rate hikes. This in turn affects demand. Lots of talk about a recession. With harder to get credit.. the signs are there to be at least more cautious



  • Registered Users Posts: 721 ✭✭✭drogon.


    Borrowing money for a mortgage is one of the cheapest loans you will ever get in your life. Hence when you retire and get some lump sum money from the pension, they always advice you to use that money to upgrade the car or do up the house (if you plan to do so), rather than paying off your mortgage and getting another loan for a new car or house renovation.

    Your mention of recession and unemployment, this one is very hard in my opinion. I think cost of living is spiralling out of control, price of rent is crazy, everything is going up and the systems will eventually have to reset itself. But when this happens is anyones guess.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    if youre highly leveraged with a huge loan, sure, but the increase in monthlies for each 0.25 increase is not significant. For a 200k mortgage with 20 years left it’s like 100 euro per full percentage point. If you add fuel and food on top of, say, rises of 2 or 3%, then maybe yes you’ll have a huge pullback on spending. But at our average borrowing (the average new mortgage in 2020 was €230k, so overall mortgage average would be less than that) , the interest rate rise alone (based on the likely rate rise scenarios) are not going to be massively impactful IMO.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    I think the assumption that variable rates will rise exactly in line with ecb rates would be foolish to expect. We already know rates are at 2.5% plus with the base ecb rate at zero. Its going to be .75 in September. Inflation will only be stopped by bigger rate increases. The US are leading on this. My guess is this time next year you will be seeing 4 % mortgage rates or higher. What gives will be expected selling prices for first time buyers and this follows up the chain.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,504 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Food and fuel inflation may well have a bigger impact than mortgage rates ?

    People spend money on food and heating etc before house purchases or rent ,likely to be less money to spend so brakes could be pressed on bidding wars



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,239 ✭✭✭Pussyhands


    Inflation spiral has started, it's going to be hard to cool it softly.

    Everyone is playing catch up. I need a wage rise because everything has gone up, but then wage costs go up so prices need to go up and round and round it goes.

    Unions looking for big increases.

    It's similar to the 1980s in the UK, high energy prices caused the inflation rate to soar.

    It could well be that a 2 year recession with rising unemployment is much better result than long term inflation.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,616 ✭✭✭maninasia


    People are buying now because its the ONLY reliable way to find anywhere to live.

    Even IF you find a place to rent you have no security.



  • Registered Users Posts: 721 ✭✭✭drogon.


    Agreed, but might not be a wise decision always. Lately houses have been selling over 80K above the asking price. These are the same people that will complain about negative equality in 4-5 years and will want the gov to do something about it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster




  • Registered Users Posts: 6,003 ✭✭✭handlemaster


    Maninasia buying now, is the here and now. Like what we have seen before people were buying until they weren't. Its a centiment that takes hold after buyers question affordability and there is a trigger. Interst rate rises, job losses, jobs market uncertainty, tourism drops . Businesses see less demand and in turn affects suppliers... etc etc



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,568 ✭✭✭celtic_oz


    outright panic is Australia where house prices are bonkers, this should start 8 mins in




  • Registered Users Posts: 210 ✭✭Mr Hindley


    Whether it's inflation, or the expectation of higher interest rates, or just a general concern that we've passed the top of the market, there is some softening starting to happen out there now, rather than being a theoretical idea for the near future. I'd say it's starting at the edges of the market (e.g. apartments in SCD seem to have peaked and some are coming down now), but it breaks the narrative of 'people will buy anything for any price out of sheer desperation'. Affordability concerns are kicking in and causing some properties to stall and just sit there, even while the rental market is still in a dire state. To me the question is how much that will spread, which is the big unknown. Certainly, total supply is continuing to still tick upwards.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 949 ✭✭✭Ozark707


    With supply ticking upwards (in one particular search I have it is now 50% up) that will of course help to keep a lid on prices but until more drops start to make their way into the MSM it will be only at the edge as you say where these will be felt. My guess is that after June we won't see any real increase in supply (possibly even a reduction as places close) until September when potentially we might see another uptick in supply.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,128 ✭✭✭Padre_Pio


    Is there any way to see the amount for sale on Daft over time?

    It definitely seems like more houses are up now vs two months ago. Maybe people have hard rumours of the market peaking and they're rushing to take advantage?

    Could be time of year too, more houses up at start of summer.



  • Registered Users Posts: 210 ✭✭Mr Hindley


    I don't know if Daft gives any kind of historic figures, but I've been taking notes of the total property for sale, of all types, and here's a summary:

    Jul-21: ~15,500

    Sep-21: ~15,800

    Feb-22: ~13,300

    Apr-22: ~14,500

    May-22: ~15,250

    Now: ~16,300



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,812 ✭✭✭Patsy167


    Interesting to read about the Australian housing market here - "Australian Housing Expected To Drop By 15% According To Country's Largest Bank"





  • Registered Users Posts: 13,504 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx




  • Registered Users Posts: 4,616 ✭✭✭maninasia


    Because when the landlord wants to sell they can make an excuse such as doing uo the house or giving it to a relative and turf you out.


    Thats why.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,616 ✭✭✭maninasia


    People dont have a choice.


    Theres nowhere to rent almost.


    Its anout putting a roof over your head and not overpaying for rent



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,616 ✭✭✭maninasia


    many landlords selling out.

    my question is how many will be bought by the gov for social housing.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,501 ✭✭✭wassie


    Makes for a great headline.

    But the likes of the Sydney and Melbourne market experienced crazy growth last year circa 20%. A 15% drop is only pulling back prices to where they were roughly 12 month previous. Not exactly a crash.

    However prices there will be much more sensitive to rate increases as many borrowerers have LTIs of as much as 6-7 x incomes. With the vast majority in Ireland at 3.5x to a max of 4.5x, Irish borrowers are much less so.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,450 ✭✭✭fliball123


    People keep saying supply is ticking upwards and the truth is its not, there are more properties to buy but properties available to rent have dropped off a cliff in numbers its clear the increase in supply for sale are the small landlords running for the hills and who can blame them with the taxes and tenant issues in this country. Anyone looking on this thread should keep an eye on both properties to buy and rent as a whole for the amount of properties available.



This discussion has been closed.
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