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Virtue signalling gobdaw Michael Higgins puts his foot in it again

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  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I dont even politically disagree with him?

    The fact yous cant abide people pointing out his hyprocrisy and need to strawman positions in an attempt to turn discussion personal is something that reflects poorly upon you



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Agh yes,yet again reach for personal attacks.......i have no bother with anyone having an opion on housing,but i do feel its hypocritical his speaking on it,given it was good enough for him to take advantage of it,when suited him


    Its not a sports team,its ok to critise politians you otherwise agree with,when they are being hypocritical.....i dont understand the issue here,if he deosnt like critism of this carryon here,maybe he should not have done it?



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2




  • Registered Users Posts: 19,407 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    This particular poster seems to revel in the personal attacks rather than dealing with the actual debate. They even went so far as checking out my comments on another thread and of course unleashed another barrage of personal abuse. Which I guess is a compliment- they were THAT interested in what I have to say!

    What’s laughable is they try portray themselves as some kind of pseudo intellect whereas their debating style and manner has the opposite effect.



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    How so?


    If your good enough to throw out labels,least can be expected for adult discussion is justify your position here?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    You were observed in engaging in climate change denial and you rightly got roasted.

    Didn't actually remember that until this post helpfully reminded me of it, but it obviously still rankles with you.

    'Pseudo-intellect'? I'm not the smartest bear to ever emerge from the woods, but I actually engage my brain unlike yourself.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    But shur don't you reserve the right to own a house and have an opinion on housing yourself?

    You do love throwing around the word hypocrite (which I actually find to be the word that the lowest-quality posters on boards love using, because they can't articulate their difficult feelings) - fair is fair. You're engaging in the big H yourself.



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I dont understand it,the position put forward is entirely reasonable and yet im being asked to disbelieve obvious logic.



  • Registered Users Posts: 364 ✭✭NiceFella


    @[Deleted User]

    "if its on back of someone elses suffering......if i was that desperate for money,id deal coke"

    Hysterical analysis above like Alot of comments in this thread. Here you are comparing the president giving more than fair due notice to students as comparable to dealing coke. You are saying that dealing come is less shameful than what the president did by selling a house. Mother of Christ!!!!!



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    People aren't allowed own houses and have opinions at the same time in Blaazland apparently.



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  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Except of course,whether i own a house or not is immaterial (and unanswered) ,im not putting anyone out to avail of tax relief while being critical of the greed driven housing crisis


    It was greed,nothing else was main driver for the sale of this house,its greed in general,around housing has us in this mess.....to bemoan greed causing a crisis,while happy to do it for yourself is hypocritical.....noone said he isnt allowed an opioion on housing,just in light ot facts here,his position is hypocritical



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Except i didnt,it would be easist (and only viable optionn) for me to make money on back of others misery,if i was that way inclined,would be to deal coke



    He can give what ever due notice he wants,he put people out in a housing crisis to take advantage of a tax break.....to then critise the housing crisis while happy to profit off it,is hypocritical



  • Posts: 6,192 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Ah yes,a stawman position,that i never said,nor hold,😴😴



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Ah but it is your position Blazziepops.

    The big H is written all over your posts. What happens when those liberally accusing others of hypocrisy engage in hypocrisy themselves? You get wormholes of stupidity like this thread.

    MDH did nothing wrong in his private affairs and in his capacity of Presdient with those comments. He didn't even engage in the big H.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]



    Problem is that your offerings are so lacking in substance that there's not much else for me to get my teeth into. Post something intelligent (yes, I appreciate that that would be a real challenge for you) and I'd be delighted to respond in kind. But I'm not holding my breath.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    One of your posts opened with calling the President "a toxic little turd".

    You have no place in this thread or any standing to speak about intelligent or substantive contributions.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Then Week in Politics have a piece busting some urban myths about what the President can and can't say or do.

    Spoiler: As per the observations on this thread, there is no constitutional or legal grounds for the government to control the utterances of the President (except in the discreet case of addressing the Oireachtas) and the diary of the President.

    Examples given of Mary McAleese and Mary Robinson meeting the Dalai Lama and Gerry Adams respectively flying in the face of the cabinet stamping their feet and attempting browbeat the President of the day.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,857 ✭✭✭growleaves


    I believe you.

    But now that MDH has established a tradition of long-running political commentary, future Presidents can run with it as well.

    Would you be happy with a right-leaning President criticising social welfare recipients and the charity industry in defiance of a centre/left Cabinet?



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Didn't start with MDH as the week in politics.

    I don't believe the Irish public would ever elect such an individual as you describe to the office of President, but a President cannot be constrained from speaking in the way a lot of posters think.

    It's a moveable feast, but to think that MDH strayed into impeachment territory with what he said is balderdash. It wouldn't get started and would be the collapse of the government of the day if it even was toyed with.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,857 ✭✭✭growleaves


    You haven't answered my question but no matter.

    Yes technically he hasn't gone outside his defined role according to the letter of the law.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,545 ✭✭✭Topgear on Dave


    Michael D has done very, very well from the housing policies of this country.

    So he can excuse me from listening to his pronouncements from his pulpit now he has his money made.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    To get specific about it. It doesn't matter what I think, even though I think dole bashers are generally dunderheads.

    But let's run with your hypothesis. If the people elected someone who went off on mad ones regularly regarding government policy regarding dole , there are a number of barriers to successful impeachment.

    1. Let's say the government is sufficiently enraged at the comments (and this goes for MDH as well).

    First they need a two-thirds of either house of the Oireachtas to successfully move an impeachment (extremely unlikely in MDH's case, who knows with your hypothesis)

    2. The second barrier is a point of law. The Oireachtas can only remove a President for "a stated misbehaviour"

    "A stated misbehaviour" is not defined in law, and we don't have precedent (although we came close on a couple of occasions with moves against judges, but it was never tested as they retired). It's commonly understood to be an illegal act, and in an impeachment process, it would almost certainly pass to the Supreme Court on a challenge and the SC would have to define what this means.

    Would you get a majority in the Supreme Court to say MDH's (or indeed your hypothetical dole bashing Prez) comments consist of "a stated misbehaviour" even if barrier 1 was hurdled? Constitutional scholars when running this hypothesis usually land on the likelyhood that the President would have to have prima facie commited an illegal act for the SC to do something as extraordinary as remove a president.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    Did RTE's "The Week In Politics" cover the hypocrisy of Higgins commenting about property speculation? Is it worth watching the repeat?

    Regards...jmcc



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Thet usually concern themselves with matters of greater importance other than obsessing about a perfectly legal transaction.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,407 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    As with all these pampered left wing public elites- rules for thee and not me.

    Of course he is entitled to spend the vast sums he’s drawn down from the public purse over the years as he sees fit. In this case his property portfolio m. What he isn’t entitled to do is lecture the rest of us and elected government about something he’s a willing personal participant and beneficiary from.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    If he's "not entitled" to do it, where are the articles of impeachment? And indeed where's the swell of public opinion besides the armpit of malcontents on the internet demanding it?

    Here's a legal fact you need to reconcile yourself with, there is precisely zero in the constitutional or legal order restraining MDH from speaking in the manner in which he did.

    He was in fact, was perfectly entitled to utter what he did.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    RTE played a major part in getting Higgins elected in 2011 with that unverified tweet on the Frontline programme. It was highly damaging for RTE and the Frontline programme was cancelled. It would be amazing if RTE even mentioned Higgins in anything other than a favourable light. The impeachment thing seems to be introduced as a deflection. It doesn't work.

    By the time of the next RedC poll later next week, the news cycle will have moved on. Luckily for FFG, the toxic combination of Varadkar's rant and Higgins' comments might not have as much an impact on polling as they would have had if the RedC poll was carried out this week.

    Regards...jmcc



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Now there's a conspiracy theory even David Icke would be shy to hang his tinfoil hat on.

    RTE are apparently telling porkies about the reality of our constitutional and legal order because...God... you'll have to fill in the blanks for me on this...



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    What may be upsetting FFG more is that Higgins has, with his comments, become a useful idiot for the opposition. He was the FF/FG/Labour candidate in 2018 when FF and FG decided against running their own candidates in order to save money for the upcoming elections. Even with that FF/FG support less than 25% of the electorate voted for him and less than 50% of the electorate even bothered to vote. I doubt that FF and FG will make the same mistake in the next presidential election.

    Regards...jmcc



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭jmcc


    The impeachment thing is just a deflection from the fact that Higgins was a landlord and benefited from that tax break just as others did. It is the hypocrisy of Higgins' comments that rankle. His supporters don't want to want to focus on that because it would make him look bad so, instead, they focus on the strawman argument of impeachment.

    What happened in the 2011 presidential election made the news though it was, surprisingly, the Sunday Independent that got the scoop and drove reporting on the story.

    From the RTE website:

    From the Indepdent:

    From the Irish Times:

    it was a major event at the time but you may have missed it. Arguably, it was that unverified tweet that influenced the outcome of the election.

    Regards...jmcc

    Post edited by jmcc on


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