Ongoing religious scandals

Hotblack Desiato · 08-09-2021 5:16pm

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/redress-for-abuse-in-religious-institutions-falls-short-of-2009-commitments-1.4667783

Two transfers under the 2009 offers remain outstanding. Both are currently in use by intended beneficiaries. The combined value of 13 of the 16 properties transferred under this round is €4.515 million, while the other three valuations are in progress.

It means the total contribution received to date from the 18 religious congregations under the 2009 voluntary offer by them is approximately €116.24 million, or less than a third of what they proposed in 2009.

Meanwhile, redress paid out to people who had been in the residential institutions for children investigated by the Ryan Commission, has come to €1.165 billion, a spokesman for the department has said.

The figure applies as of December last and includes €971 million in awards with associated applicant legal costs of €194 million. The average award to 15,579 people who had been in the reformatories, industrial schools and orphanages as children was €62,250.

The the overall legal cost of the commission of investigation was €46 million, made up of €15 million in legal costs and third-party costs of €31 million.

It brings to €1.211 billion the total cost of investigating and redress arising from abuses in the residential institutions for children run by the 18 religious congregations.

Igotadose · 08-09-2021 7:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117864453#Comment_117864453

Thanks for the link; that article desperately needs a table or something, because it's confusing to figure out what was agreed to be paid, by whom, to whom, and how much. IMO it could've been written much better than it was. It's not even clear what the exact shortfall is, or issues (and dates) by when it is to be determined.

Overall, though, I get the message that the religious institutions are way behind agreements reached in 2009, and I'm sure there's no penalties (like interest) to them for delaying. It's the game they play.

Hotblack Desiato · 08-09-2021 7:36pm

Bear in mind, too, that's only what they agreed to pay...

Niska · 04-10-2021 9:34am

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-58781265

France this time - a commission finds thousands of paedophiles active in French Catholic Church since 1950. Giving the pattern of the Church the worldover (and not just in Ireland), I don't think this comes as a surprise to anyone.

robindch · 05-10-2021 12:23pm

The full report of around 2,500 pages has just been issued and indicates that between 1950 and 2020, that 2,900-3,200 clerical abusers abused some 216,000 children, the majority of which were boys. The report also found that when you add abuse by lay members of the church - teachers at RCC-controlled schools etc - the number of victims could rise to 330,000. The report also notes that the percentage of clerical abusers in France was considerably less than in other countries.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-58801183

https://www.thelocal.fr/20211005/french-catholic-church-inquiry-finds-216000-sex-abuse-victims-from-1950/

"The commission also had access to police files as well as Church archives, citing only two cases of refusals by Church institutions to turn over requested documents. Overall, it found that 2.5 percent of French clergy since 1950 had sexually abused minors, a ratio below the 4.4 to 7 percent uncovered by similar inquiries in other countries."

When the world's gaze turns elsewhere, and the site comes back up again, the full report is likely to be available here:

https://www.ciase.fr/

Hotblack Desiato · 05-10-2021 5:48pm

https://www.rte.ie/news/world/2021/1005/1250763-australia-church-abuse/

The Australian pastor and founder of a global Pentecostal megachurch has pleaded not guilty to concealing his father's alleged child sexual abuse.

Hillsong Church pastor Brian Houston, a prominent Australian religious figure with ties to the country's conservative prime minister, is accused of failing to report the abuse of a young boy after learning of the claims in 1999.

His father, Frank, who died in 2004, has been accused of sexually abusing a seven-year-old boy while a preacher at the Assemblies of God church in the 1970s.

If we'd prosecute for that here, would there be a bishop left?

Odhinn · 08-11-2021 5:06pm

Warning - Nobody choke on the coffee reading this.

"French Catholic bishops agreed Monday to sell part of the Church's extensive real estate holdings to compensate the thousands of victims of child sex abuse at the hands of clergy.

Church officials have been under growing pressure to indemnify victims after a landmark inquiry confirmed extensive sexual abuse of minors by priests dating from the 1950s to 2020.

An independent commission will be set up to evaluate the claims, "and we are going to provide the means to accomplish this mission... of individual indemnities for the victims", said Eric de Moulins-Beaufort, head of the Bishops' Conference of France (CEF).

His comments came at the close of days of meetings by the conference's 120 members on how to respond to the devastating inquiry into the "massive phenomenon" of child sexual assault that was often covered by a "veil of secrecy".

The inquiry had urged the Church to pay victims with its own assets, instead of asking parishioners to donate funds to compensate for crimes committed by the clergy."

https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20211108-french-catholic-church-says-will-use-own-assets-to-compensate-sex-abuse-victims?fbclid=IwAR2v1GzZyAWlTTuNhW0j2PNHEgSkjbzzwFWAIMN0g-zuWZBuVQ0QHgHFylA&ref=fb_i

robindch · 08-11-2021 9:19pm

Do the French have a property price register, as Ireland does?

If so, somebody's going to have loads of fun in decades to come tracing the disposal of French church property at strangely low rates, only to see the same properties sold at market rates some years later.

Remember - you read it here first!

Hotblack Desiato · 08-11-2021 9:22pm

Couldn't they just have got the French government to make taxpayers unconstitutionally pay 90% of it?

Odhinn · 08-11-2021 9:49pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118138306#Comment_118138306

It's almost like the mad bastards in government take the notion of a secular republic seriously.

Bannasidhe · 25-01-2022 1:18pm

https://www.dw.com/en/ex-pope-benedict-xvi-admits-false-statement-during-abuse-probe-testimony/a-60535297?maca=en-Twitter-sharing

Oops....

Odhinn · 13-02-2022 5:58pm

MULTAN, Pakistan -- An enraged mob stoned to death a middle-aged man for allegedly desecrating the Quran in a remote village in eastern Pakistan, police said Sunday.

The custodian of a local mosque said he saw the man burning the Muslim holy book inside the mosque Saturday evening and told others before informing police, according to police spokesman Chaudhry Imran. The violence took place in a village in the district of Khanewal in Punjab province.

https://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/man-accused-blasphemy-stoned-death-mob-pakistan-82858123

robindch · 14-02-2022 5:58pm

An enraged mob stoned to death a middle-aged man

Coincidentally, I watched Alejandro Amenábar's 2009 film Agora again last night - the film suggests that not a lot has changed since the time of Hypatia of Alexandria in the late fourth century.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agora_(film)

robindch · 16-02-2022 1:06am

Indigenous people in Canada say they've discovered further unmarked graves at residential schools funded by the Canadian state, but controlled by the catholic church. The latest discoveries bring the total number of unmarked graves discovered in the last year alone to over 1,100.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60395242

ohnonotgmail · 17-02-2022 10:14am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118638411#Comment_118638411

I haven't been following this in the canadian media but do they have the same sort of catholic church apologists as we have here?

Hotblack Desiato · 17-02-2022 12:44pm

No doubt some, but they don't appear to have the ear of government. Unlike here, it looks like reasonably prompt action will be taken to investigate these crime scenes and follow up appropriately.

robindch · 08-03-2022 5:22pm

Turns out that while the state has paid out €32.8m to 814 surviving victims of the Magdalene laundries, the nuns who actually ran the laundries - well, they've yet to stick their hands into the cassocks.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/nuns-who-ran-magdalene-laundries-have-not-contributed-to-redress-for-women-1.4816666

It's also emerged that The Religious Sisters of Charity, which ran three of the laundries...

...has applied to Dublin City Council for planning permission to allow “high quality residential development and address housing need” at their site on Merrion Road in Dublin 4. A senior property industry source estimated it could sell for “€50 million-plus” if zoned for homes.

Igotadose · 25-03-2022 9:34am

Not sure this is quite a scandal, but some bizarre conspiracy theory (well, par for the course I suppose) running around the RCC that Pope Frank has maybe resurrected some earlier religious twaddle that took place in Portugal, Fatima something, and various zealots in the RCC are unhappy with him. One zealot called Frank a Freemason, that's so 15th century...

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2022/03/pope-francis-consecration-ukraine-russia-fatima-conspiracy-theories.html

Hotblack Desiato · 25-03-2022 12:01pm

Not too sure what the actual conspiracy theory is after reading that...

ohnonotgmail · 28-03-2022 9:55am

Former bishop of Albany New York admits he covered up sex abuse by priests.

I think this sums it up

Hubbard testified he didn’t report the allegations to law enforcement because he didn’t feel he was required by law to do so, and instead kept the allegations against Bentley, and others, secret out of concern for “scandal and the respect of the priesthood”.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/mar/27/former-bishop-new-york-sexual-abuse-allegations-cover-up

Hotblack Desiato · 28-03-2022 11:19am

So, how's that respect for the priesthood thing working out for you lads?

Bannasidhe · 28-03-2022 12:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118833376#Comment_118833376

It's the oldest one associated with the Church of Rome rearing up again as it does periodically.

It has its roots in the belief that in order to trigger the 2nd Coming the whole world must be Christian. Therefore go forth and convert by any means necessarily. All the woes in society were because the people we not faithful, and all faults within the church were.. because the people weren't faithful enough. The ye all partied defence.

This theory literally goes back to Late Antiquity and grew legs as the Roman Empire collapsed. Rome was literally a backwater and running last in the race to determine who would be #1. Using the structure of the Empire Rome began to Proselytise with a vengeance - something neither the Orthodox or Coptic faiths bothered with.

Alles is gut and Rome is gaining global ground until a stroppy German took issue and upset the Christian monolith cart by undermining Rome. Now. Luther also believed the whole world needed to be Christian but his version - not Rome's (one of his reactions was to build anti-Semitism into his new religion but that's another tale).

It is from this time period that Rome really began to push the BVM as "Catholic".

BUT - alles was not really gut because of the Orthodox Christians. Rome had been able to quietly ignore Greek Orthodoxy as Constantinople was nowhereville, and the other challenger's to Rome's claim of being THE city of Christianity fell to Islam thereby 'proving' they were not chosen.

15th C as @Igotadose mentions it all came to a head.

The Ottoman's overrun Greece (yipee say Rome) but a few short years before that Russia went Orthodox (F sake says Rome) by choice. A huge landmass with loads of people are the wrong kind of Christians. Orthodoxy isn't dead, it's managed to expand against all the odds.

This is a bad thing - Russia MUST abandon Orthodoxy and accept Rome's authority - i.e. be consecrated to Mary.

But they also have those pesky Muslims to deal with so it's a thoughts and prayers situation when it comes to East of Christendom.

And then Luther schisms Christendom it'self.

Added into the mix is another theory concerning the validity of The Pope - that one goes back to at least the 12th C.

So - is the Pope really genuinely attempting to "convert Russia to Mary" (i.e. Rome) in order to bring about the 2nd Coming which is Pope's top job OR is he only pretending due to being the Anti-Pope.

robindch · 28-03-2022 3:53pm

You'd really wonder what Jesus would make of the history of the last two thousand years if he ever does show up again.

"Like, how precisely the **** did you lot go from 'Love your neighbor as yourself' to whatever sinkhole of doom you now sit at the bottom of?"

Hotblack Desiato · 16-06-2022 12:46pm

https://www.irishtimes.com/crime-law/courts/2022/06/16/former-franciscan-brother-jailed-for-indecent-assault/

Why so lenient? A 10 year old kid ffs.

A former Franciscan Brother from Co Cork, who was previously convicted of masturbating in front of a male teenager at Knock Shrine, has been jailed for 27 months for indecent assault and sexual assault of a 10-year-old boy.

Christopher McCarthy, 74, with an address at Richmond Court, Mount Kennett, Dock Road, Limerick, was jailed for three years with the final nine months suspended at Limerick Circuit Court.

Judge Pat Meghan said McCarthy could be identified. The victim cannot be named for legal reasons.

Reading his victim impact statement in court, the man told McCarthy he wanted him to “rot” in jail.

McCarthy reacted by rolling his eyes upwards, sighing, and shaking his head in apparent annoyance, as the man told the court how the sexual assaults had “changed my life forever”.

A jury reached unanimous guilty verdicts on two counts in McCarthy’s trial on October 6th, 2020, after he denied the allegations which dated back thirty years.

The jury rejected McCarthy’s denials that he had rubbed his erect penis against the boy’s backside from outside his clothes; and that he masturbated himself as he grabbed the victim’s penis outside of the victim’s trousers.

The victim said the assaults have “stayed” with him throughout his life and he eventually told his wife after seeing McCarthy for the first time in thirty years which “brought it all back”.

McCarthy, who later resided at a hostel in Limerick City, denied the allegations when he was questioned by gardaí in March 2019.

Addressing McCarthy in court, the victim said: “I have waited years to say these words to you — Christopher McCarthy, I f**king hate you — I hate what you have done to me, I hate that you have consumed my childhood and most of my adult life, I hate the fact that you sat through four days of your trial without showing any emotion of sadness or remorse for what you put me through.”

“I will never forgive you for what you have done and what you have taken from me. To be honest, it’s irrelevant how long (a sentence) you get for this, because it will never replace the years you have taken from me.”

“You will never understand how much you have taken from me, you stole my childhood, you robbed me of my innocence, you took advantage of my vulnerability, and worst of all, you made me believe that I would get in trouble for it. How f**king dare you do that to anybody, let alone a child.”

McCarthy, who continues to deny the allegations, joined the Franciscan Order aged 17, but he left the Order when he was 20, he lived in London for a period, and he suffered with depression and other mental health issues, the court heard.

On January 7th, 2020, McCarthy received a fully suspended three-month prison sentence at Castlebar District Court, after he was found guilty on January 2nd, 2019, of masturbating in front of an 18-year-old male at Knock Shrine, Co Mayo, on September 17th, 2017, a charge he denied.

Hotblack Desiato · 23-06-2022 10:47am

It never ends, does it?

https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/social-affairs/2022/06/23/irish-victims-of-comboni-abuse-what-we-want-is-to-be-believed-to-be-understood/

A religious order has bowed to pressure from Pope Francis to meet face-to-face with three Irishmen who were sexually abused at a training college for priests in the UK during the 1960s.

The Comboni Missionaries, headquartered in Rome, has refused for decades to acknowledge the horrific ordeal suffered by the men and others who were enticed as children into St Peter Claver College in Mirfield, West Yorkshire, which was run by the order.

Last week Frank Barnes, from Finglas, Dublin, Gerry McLaughlin of Moville, Co Donegal and Jim Kirby, from Glasheen, Cork City, were among eight survivors who held an emotionally charged meeting with Francis at The Vatican.

The pontiff personally pleaded for their forgiveness and vowed to contact Fr Tesfaye Tadesse Gebresilasie, superior general of the Comboni Order, to ask why he had not made any effort to speak with them.

Frank Barnes, 70, a company director who was born in Crumlin, Dublin, told The Irish Times: “This is what we have always been fighting for. To be listened to, and to be directly heard by the Comboni Missionaries. Any other approach we have made to them over the years, they have come out with the usual claptrap, saying that they didn’t do it, they did nothing wrong, they knew nothing about it.

“I’m absolutely delighted. Hopefully this is the beginning of us receiving closure of all that went on.”

Like others, Barnes, whose family moved to Manchester when he was aged 10, said he was lured into the seminary by a visiting missionary at his primary school, promising a “wonderful life, seeing Africa, all the lions, giraffes and chimpanzees”.

“I fell for it, same as all the other guys,” he said. “Now I realise what a mess they made of our lives.”

“It was only years afterwards I could bring myself to talk about it, even though it was in my head all the time. You feel guilty for it happening.

“I was 12 years old and I used to watch one of the priests on the altar raising the host, saying Mass, and I used to think how can he possibly do that, when he was touching me last night. The tears would be running down my face.”

As he did with Pope Francis during a 1½-hour meeting in his Apostolic Palace, Barnes wants to look the head of the Combonis in the eye and detail the impact of the abuse on him and what, he says, was decades of a cover-up.

“They have always said we have been after them for money, which we haven’t. What we want is to be believed, to be understood,” he said.

“The only way for any closure is a face-to-face meeting. We want them to admit it happened, which they have always denied. We want them to believe us, which they have never done. All we ever wanted was some kind of admission from them and for them to say sorry.”

The Comboni order, previously known as the Verona Fathers, paid compensation to 11 of the abuse survivors in 2014 without formally acknowledging it happened. It amounted to as little as £8,000 (€9,370) each.

An investigation by West Yorkshire Police into historical sex abuse at the seminary was hampered as two suspects — Fr John Pinkman and Fr Domenico Valmaggia — were dead, and a third, who is still alive in Italy, could not be extradited because of ill health.

Igotadose · 23-06-2022 11:21am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119238189#Comment_119238189

Pathetic response by Pope Frank. "Let's have a meeting and make consoling noises." How about dissolving that ordure and feeding a few of them to lions. In Africa. A fine biblical punishment

Hotblack Desiato · 23-06-2022 11:33am

This is where they'll say the orders are private organisations and are not under the control of the local diocese etc. etc.

Hotblack Desiato · 07-07-2022 6:35pm

From the UN human rights commission hearings:

Asking about survivors of mother and baby homes, she said the provision of redress on condition that they not pursue separate legal claims was “a complete flagrant violation of the CCPR and the European Convention on Human Rights”.

“I will remind you there are very serious violations here. The payment of financial compensation ex gratia does not free the State of its obligation to investigate, prosecute and bring to justice those responsible [for abuses within the homes].”

Our preferred approach - ignore the testimony of victims, produce a whitewash report, absolve the orders of any financial responsibility, make payments to victims provided they agree to keep quiet, and refuse to even consider investigating the serious crimes committed.

Hotblack Desiato · 09-07-2022 4:45pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119238372#Comment_119238372

"ordure"

Freudian slip there maybe 😁

Igotadose · 09-07-2022 4:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119313890#Comment_119313890

😉😉😉

Ongoing religious scandals

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