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NZ Tour 2022 - Māori June 29th, NZ July 2nd, NZ July 9th, Māori July 12th, NZ July 16th, KO 8.05am

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,458 ✭✭✭kuang1


    Very different reffing of the breakdown today compared to what I'm used to watching normally.

    Hopefully we adapt to it before Saturday.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,275 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    Casey has had one of those rabbit in a headlight games that sometimes happens to a young SH. He'll learn from this.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,275 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    That was a hospital ball to Frawley.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    That was some skill from Sullivan



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,711 ✭✭✭clsmooth


    Think Coombes has been ok but the bar is so low out there. I was expecting more from him and the rest of the pack. Was a real chance to put his hands up for selection but think he’s still behind Doris, VDF, Conan and POM for the 23.

    Or do people feel that he’s played so well tonight that Farrell can’t leave him out of the 23?



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,313 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Coombes has shown very good strength in the carry, but has also made some poor decisions - by no means the only one but he and others have forced the pass far too often.

    Having said that he's probably the only one that will leave this game having added to their standing.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]




  • Administrators Posts: 54,168 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    These kicks are a joke.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Every single thing Casey does looks frantic and off the cuff. Just brings absolutely zero control.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,711 ✭✭✭clsmooth


    Big concern with our strength in depth in the pack. Injuries to Herring and Henderson. Kelleher before leaving. Healy looking likes he’s out now. Loughman seemed lucky to be brought back on following his HIA.. looks like it’s going to be a very long tour



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  • Normally I'm not Niall Scannell's biggest fan but he's had a good 30 minutes for someone that only travelled yesterday and hasn't been in the Irish setup since RWC19



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,313 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Ah that's poor.

    He "Burns'd" it



  • Registered Users Posts: 762 ✭✭✭starkid


    absolutely ridicoulous takes on Coombe. Quelle surprise. He's possibly a generational talent thats been injured most of the year. Conan is an 8 who can be great in one match and invisible in the next. The Lions selection totally transformed perceptions of him and he was very lucky to be on that tour.

    of course a 6,6 8 is too obvious for Irish rugby so he must do more somehow. he's had a tonne of carries and loads of nice passes.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,765 ✭✭✭Shehal


    Another shocking kick, a fitting end to the game really.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,189 ✭✭✭munsterlegend


    Larmour is absolutely awful.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,325 ✭✭✭cuttingtimber22


    we have been poor at the basics. Poor discipline. Not playing the ref.

    Selection issues don’t help like Frawley and JOB playing out of position.

    Timoney and Coombes were the pick of the Irish bunch.

    Conan did nothing wrong.

    Injuries worrying.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,214 ✭✭✭Xander10


    That was pretty drab

    The nose thing with Covid still around seems a bit strange



  • Administrators Posts: 54,168 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    "Conan did nothing wrong".

    This genuinely made me laugh, I appreciate your humour at this time. 😂



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,300 ✭✭✭✭razorblunt


    Could Oli Jäger tog out against the Māori next week and not effect his eligibility for NZ?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,316 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Thought Aki played quite well tbh. Clearly meant a lot to him to be facing the Maori.

    Not a good day for the pack. Too many players lost collisions in the first half and made silly decisions. Prendergast and McCarthy will be mainstays for Ireland in the futures but tonight they looked very nervous. Did better in the second but I wonder had the opposition took their foot off the pedal by then.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,167 ✭✭✭testtech05


    Nice to see Barnes consistent to the end. Not that it mattered at all but called advantage over for a late tackle on frawley when he had never actually said Ireland were on advantage or stuck his hand out to indicate it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,325 ✭✭✭cuttingtimber22


    He has had a good season - addressed weaknesses in his game. Brings bulk to the scrum. I can see him benching during the tests



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,711 ✭✭✭clsmooth


    Think he was the big winner from tonight. Had a very good game and will be in with a shout of starting the second or third test as a result.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,330 ✭✭✭Former Former Former




  • Administrators Posts: 54,168 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Timoney, Coombes and Aki can be happy.

    Frawley was fairly poor, but it's his first go at it and 10s mistakes are always more high profile.

    Everyone else was just middling.

    It is hard to take too much from these games where the entire team is changed, they are genuinely nothing but filler in this tour.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,316 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Our attacking structure seemed to fall apart after 50/60 minutes today. It's a problem we have when anyone who isn't Sexton is on the pitch at 10. There were a few occasions when Frawley received the ball and there was nothing promising outside him so he had to kick. Thought he did ok today and is worth persisting with as another playmaker.

    Would prefer to see him at 12 though. He's played his best rugby there.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,757 ✭✭✭✭AdamD


    Aki gave away at least 3 penalties, can't say he played well. Coombes was good, Larmour solid enough in the back 3, O'Toole held up decently well, Baird decent off the bench. The less said about the rest the better...

    Suppose Timoney was decent at times too



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,458 ✭✭✭kuang1


    No one in munster had a good season. And definitely not Scannell.

    But like others, there's every chance he'll play better in green than red. 5 years of JVG running things has made that be a thing imo.



  • Registered Users Posts: 762 ✭✭✭starkid


    ok maybe, generational size lets say at least. We go on and on about size and lack of size and genetics and lack of outsiders etc. and there is a SKibereen born 6,6 18/19 stone number 8 with a bit of pace and goodish hands. People raving about McCarthy and his size (which is overblown) and there is Coombes and people just go he needs to do more after that performance. its utterly bonkers and a complete provincial bias. He is 24 and has had an injury ravaged season.

    in the next couple of years a Doris, Coombes, Timoney backrow would be freakishly powerful. we can't be moaning about genetics (which is nonsense) and then dismiss lads like this.

    all in all a worrying game for Ireland. its like a typical game against NZ pre 2016.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,770 ✭✭✭arsebiscuits1


    Very disappointing all around from a number of facets.

    As a team we were underwhelming. Very few people stepped up in a meaningful way.

    We got very little rub of the green. A solitary steal in 80 minutes at the breakdown was a very harsh return. Needless injuries. Awful conditions too. So I'm a bit deflated.

    While I have the utmost sympathy for Frawley as he was put in an untenable position. It will still go down as one of the worst performances at 10 in recent (and not so recent) memory for Ireland.

    Penalties were just so needless. Bundee a big culprit. We needed more from him in that regard. McCarthy no saint either with 4 or so offside penalties from his over eagerness.

    Backline really didn't offer much. Larmours influence was curtailed by the conditions underfoot. Fancy footwork a mere concept with the pitch like that.

    Earls, JOB both disappointing. Hume coming off early and rarely getting the ball outside 12.

    Casey had a reasonable performance. One of his better in green. I still think his kicking game isn't good enough and puts too much pressure on 10

    Pack had more success. The injury is a **** one for Healy but at least we can put to bed any notion he's finished at this level. Different class out there tbh.

    TOT was solid and industrious while he was on. As was Treadwell I thought.

    McCarthy outside of his over eager penalties showed at least he's at this level. Some good impact moments.

    I thought Prendergast was poor outside of the lineout to be honest. The impact we needed from him and have gotten used to watching Connacht was absent. Coombes gave some good front foot ball we sorely lacked.

    Timony was very very good and easily Irelands best player. Yet still only a generous 7/10 that I could see.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,846 ✭✭✭shootermacg


    You'd have to wonder about Faz.

    Playing people out of position, in important positions at that, when there are plenty options in that position sitting at home.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,770 ✭✭✭arsebiscuits1


    So presumably we're gonna see Ed Byrne or Warwick called up for Healy. Form selection is the latter but Warwick has never been called up to a single squad where as Ed Byrne has been capped under Farrell.

    I wonder who comes in for Hume. Farrell or Stu? Possibly Moore as an outside bet?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    With the immediate casualty list is the squad big enough for the rest of the tour, especially with the likely attrition rate?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,172 ✭✭✭OldRio


    A better showing the second half, although the bar was set very low.

    Aki and Coombes were the stand outs for Ireland. As for the poorer players? Too many to mention.

    I thought Barnes was one of the best referees in the World a couple of years ago. Having seen a number of his performances in both the EPL and Europe my opinion has changed. He's cack.

    Ó Toole and Timoney were solid as well.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,330 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    Who are we talking about? Frawley?

    Harry Byrne was obviously meant to be playing but got a knock. Hardly worth flying Burns or R Byrne over



  • Administrators Posts: 54,168 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Sorry Clegg but you're sugar coating it here for Frawley.

    He wasn't forced into those kicks, they were just really bad decisions. There were numerous kicks where he had men outside him to pass to.

    I don't want to be too harsh on him as it was his first go at it, and he doesn't even play there for his club, but he wasn't good at all. Which in reality, is probably to be expected.



  • Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭letsbefair


    Very harsh to have a go at the backs, they got no ball going forward. Conditions very difficult.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,711 ✭✭✭clsmooth


    He looks a very good player in the making. The use of the term ‘generational’ is what I would say is overblown as you end up having people expect ‘generational’ performances each time he takes the pitch.

    Think he went ok today (could have done with a few more players going ok in the pack!) but don’t think that was enough for him to make the 23 for Saturday or even if the game was hypothetically next Wednesday allowing for body recovery.



  • Subscribers Posts: 41,915 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    well that was terrible, second half consolidation not withstanding.

    That was a young Maori team full of debutants and they played us off the park. We had to resort to grunting and bashing whenever we got within 10 meters. Error strewn with many poor decisions.

    Casey was the only player who was actively good. Most of the other performances will be judged by the the amount of mistakes they made.

    The number of bad injuries shipped already after only 80 minutes is also very worrying, though it was good to see Hume standing out there at the end



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 10,735 Mod ✭✭✭✭aloooof


    No one in munster had a good season.

    That’s just not true, tho. The season ended badly, which I think is colouring people’s opinion, but for example, POM had an outstanding season. Beirne, Coombes and Conway (when they weren’t injured) were also very good. Kendellen too. And equally, guys like JOD, Kleyn, Haley all had (at a minimum) good seasons.



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  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 16,313 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    Hard to take many positives from that game at all.

    A few concerning injuries - Loughman should have stayed off after that early knock and might end up having to be stood down for concussion and the Healy injury looked bad and puts serious pressure on the Front row - definitely for Saturday and potentially for the whole tour. No obvious candidate stands out as a replacement to be called up.

    Humes injury didn't look great either , but at least there is better cover there if he is unfit to continue the tour.

    None of the backline played particularly well but JOB and Earls for me both looked especially off the pace.

    In the pack , Coombes did reasonably well and showed good power at times . Timoney had a few moments , but like the rest of the team failed to adjust to Barnes at the breakdown and as such wasn't his usual nuisance there.

    Prendergast and McCarthy are both genuine prospects but showed their lack of experience by rushing things and going for the big smash in defense too often and getting caught out.



  • Registered Users Posts: 762 ✭✭✭starkid


    yeah he won't make the 23 cause we are blindly wedded to our squad just like in the past. only chance he has if the team gets physically destroyed on Sat. if its a car crash of a game this coming Sat, we really need to shake things up. by car crash i mean a performance like we have just seen.

    After that i am not confident at all. I thought a first up test would be our best bet.

    It really destroys the strength in depth argument. we really pay the price for not giving lads enough exposure in clutch games like November. we are heading into another disaster of a WC.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,316 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    I'm trying to to be too harsh on Carbery as there's a lot of pressure on him, but he was very poor. The only things I remember him doing are a kick out on the full and a knock on in a semi-promising position.

    I don't know what Ireland does with him now. He's clearly a talented player, but he isn't performing well, nor has he really had any outstanding games in red or green recently.



  • Subscribers Posts: 41,915 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    travelling with 40 now looks like a very illogical decision



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,711 ✭✭✭clsmooth


    One positive is that we didn’t fold in the second half which looked a distinct possibility at halftime.

    A bigger question is how did they let Loughman back on? He looked very unstable on his feet after the collision before his HIA.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Genuinely, what are you seeing from Casey in that game that made you think he was good?

    I do appreciate the breakdown was a shambles, and that made life difficult, but he made the wrong decision time and time again out there. There were points where he looked totally overwhelmed and was just flinging the ball out from a ruck to anyone who was there. He kicked badly repeatedly. He made poor decisions to snipe, leaving himself isolated or slowing the ball down for the next ruck because there was no one to move the ball.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,316 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    There were definitely times when the only option was to kick. I don't think Frawley had a good game, but there was a breakdown in attack today. Probably caused by the pressure the MAB put us under, that forced our patterns to unravel.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,824 ✭✭✭Jump_In_Jack




  • Registered Users Posts: 762 ✭✭✭starkid


    how many could they feasibly bring? and in all honesty who are we looking at who is left out? genuine questions not arguing



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,422 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    I see a poor match with a scratch side and we’re amazingly back at Farrell is conservative.

    it’s a nothing match in the grand scheme made up of thrown together team, it won’t affect Saturdays performance.



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