The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 3) Mod Notes and Threadbanned List in OP

I presume if SF have parroted taxing these corporations many times, you can give specific examples of what they are proposing.

Of course these corporations wouldn't stay if SF were looking to empty their pockets, it would be pure madness for them, imagine showing up at the AGM and saying we are staying in Ireland but we will never make a profit while Sinn Fein are in government, they would have to be batsh1t crazy to stay under those circumstances.

So again I will ask, specific examples of what Sinn Fein are proposing, no waffle, bullsh1t, or pretty little Mount St cliches.

I hope it's OK to post this in a Sinn Fein thread.

A Sinn Fein disease

There were a number of promises in the SF manifesto for 2020 that would disproportionately affect the MNC sector.

Tax intangible assets onshored by multinationals - €722m, the biggest revenue-raising element of their tax package.

Most of the people earning over €100k are employed by MNCs. The total tax take envisaged from them is over €1.5 bn, over a range of measures, fantasy stuff because many of them would just up and leave. We already have the situation whereby above-average earners face the highest tax bills in the EU, this would be crazy stuff and the MNCs couldn't afford to make up the difference to employees with pay rises.

I agree with you that these corporations won't stay if SF is looking to empty their pockets. As SF have promised to take around €2bn extra in tax from them, I think you see the problem.

Bloody hell, are you understanding anything about this. I'll try to put it as simply as I can. Apple were playing ducks and drakes (facilitated by the Irish authorities) with the corporation tax system. Ireland's Corporation Tax rate is 12.5%, Apple WERE NOT paying this, they were paying a miniscule fraction of it. Of course “A Sinn Féin spokesman called it a bad day for the Irish taxpayer that would draw negative attention to the country's international tax reputation.”, and they were bloody right to do it - people all over the world were sniggering at the Irish tax haven. Sinn Fein didn't want Apple to pay a dime more than the going Corporation Tax rate that applies (or should apply) to every corporation (indigenous or otherwise) operating in Ireland.

'Now take a knee comrade, the revolution is not today.' - all I can say to that is SSJ.

So once more I will ask, specific examples of what Sinn Fein are proposing, no more waffle, bullsh1t, or pretty little Mount St cliches. I presuming you aren't struggling on a very simple and straightforward question.

To be fair, in recent years and recent manifestos, they have toned down their objections to the 12.5% rate, even promising to retain it in one manifesto. However, their repeated references to loopholes and tax breaks suggests that they see something to go after, and their ludicrous attempts to bleed anyone who earns over 100k dry, will cause problems for MNCs.

I'm afraid of mamma

While I'm not in the, 'Cayman Islands Arrangements' income bracket by any means, I already feel like I shoulder a substantial tax burden here. I have enough pull factors in Ireland to probably keep me here in Ireland grumbling on when the Shinners set their sights on increasing that burden, but I work in an industry in which remote working was commonplace pre-pandemic and is almost universal now.

Even in my own company alone, there are an awful lot of young people on six figure salaries without so many commitments here in Ireland who could easily decide to pop to another country and keep the very same job.

I'm still a lefty at heart, I'm fine with the concept that as a relatively high earner I should shoulder a higher share of taxation. You'd even get me on board and cheering on paying more tax if I could just see the f*cking value we would get out of it. Anything forward thinking; infrastructure, modernisation, investment in trying to avoid future exacerbation of the housing crisis by encouraging and subsidising training for the trades or inward attraction of these skillsets....big and difficult decisions that will actually provide longterm benefit to our society as a whole rather than short-termist, 'stick a few quid in that cohort's pocket for now to buy their vote' would have me celebrating....but the Shinners just seem to be lining themselves up as an even more short-termist, somehow even more populist nonsense than what I'm already fed up with.

This is the typical shortsightedness, we are not due this money. The EU was pushing this to undermine the tax incentives here which is exactly why the government was fighting it. Get the 13bn but scare off the next investors. You’ll wake up from your fantasy’s if the shinners get into power and put a saddle on you.

Apple do pay 12.5% on the profits of their Irish branch in Cork.

That branch is part of Apple Sales International (ASI), which is massively profitable.

A slice of these profits are attributed to the branch in Cork, and we charge 12.5% on those profits.

Some people suggest that all of ASI profit should be taxed by Ireland.

http://www.irisheconomy.ie/index.php/author/scoffey/

Regarding SF policy towards business taxes, I had a look at the 2020 GE manifesto.

I don't see many tax increases for MNC specifically, although there are a range of proposals to tax high incomes / wealth in general.

(1) a change in tax reliefs on intangible assets available to MNC = 722m, in typical SF style this is listed as extra tax revenue, whereas it is actually just a timing issue

(2) end the CT tax break for banks (SF seem really anti-bank) = 175m, I am not aware of any special CT tax break for banks, so I don't know what they are referring to

(3) increase annual bank levy = +50m

(4) higher employer PRSI of 15.75% on portion of incomes over 100k

Individual income taxes

(1) 5% high income levy on incomes over 140k, that means a 57% marginal income tax rate

(2) taper out tax credits on incomes over 100k

Wealth taxes

(1) wealth tax at 1% on wealth over 1m = +89m

(2) increase CAT from 33% to 36% = +45m

(3) reduce tax relief on pensions = +494m

(4) abolish LPT

(5) tax on second house = +104m

Yes, and the conclusion is the same as mine - there are a number of their proposals that will hit MNCs quite hard, albeit somewhat indirectly.

If you have a range of proposals to target wealth generators and high incomes, then you are hitting that sector - the MNC sector - with the disproportionately high numbers of such people.

Yeah to be honest that's why I asked. Their rise has been spectacular, but it's hard to get a sense of what their policies are.

Was hoping some existing or soon to be voters would point me in the right direction

Well to be fair change appears to be the USP.

Maybe it's referring to the website

Unique selling point.