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So "X" - nothing to see here. Elon's in control - Part XXX **Threadbans in OP**

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    #932
    Ush1
    Registered Users Posts: 11,469 ✭✭✭✭Ush1


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119317372#Comment_119317372

    His companies were never particularly profitable, at least when he ran them. He's good for share price but not much else. Buffett steering well clear speaks volumes.



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    #933
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,444 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322237#Comment_119322237

    I think Musks skill is in delivering "proof of concept" type stuff and creating/pushing a market forward.

    With Tesla he pushed the envelope really out there for Electric cars , he proved that you could make a desirable car that people would buy and use.

    In doing so he forced the big car manufacturers to accelerate their efforts , now though he is finding that Tesla just cannot compete with the speed and efficiency of the Big guns when it comes to developing and building cars. Life is going to get hard and harder for Tesla.

    He ability to do all the other stuff has been driven by the crazy valuation of Tesla - The idea that Tesla was the most valuable company in the world or that it was going to outlast/outsell the VW's and GM's of this world is now being seen for the nonsense that has always been and that will be reflected in the Stock price in a very very big way.

    That more than anything is a big part of why Musk doesn't want to have to spend ~$40B on Twitter.



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    #934
    Beta Ray Bill
    Registered Users Posts: 3,630 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119320992#Comment_119320992

    None of these are his achievements.

    He founded SpaceX, not Tesla and not Paypal

    Elon Musk is NOT technical. I know people that worked in PayPal when he was there.

    Mr Musk's modus operandi is to find a company, buy his way in, push out the board.

    He's an out and out business man, which raises the question about Starlink... how the hell is this gonna make money given that majority of the worlds democratic population has access to faster and cheaper internet via fibre or cell towers

    When you understand who the main customer is, you'll understand that starlink probably wasn't his idea either, rather a business opportunity presented to him.



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    #935
    Dyr
    Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322302#Comment_119322302

    I can't believe the rest of the world has not cottoned on to his methods and also become the world richest gazillionaires..it's so easy!



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    #936
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322413#Comment_119322413

    Commercialising things, bringing them to market, getting them into the public consciousness, marketing them, is as important as the technology development

    again, not defending him. He is a ****. But dismissing him as a fluke who’s done nothing other than buy some shares here and there is too dismissive of what he has achieved



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    #937
    Beta Ray Bill
    Registered Users Posts: 3,630 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322413#Comment_119322413

    You need money to make money

    The Musk family owned mines in Africa (I don't think they own them anymore though)

    Let be frank though, white people residing in apartheid SA and owning mines on the continent, doesn't sound good at all really.



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    #938
    Beta Ray Bill
    Registered Users Posts: 3,630 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322458#Comment_119322458

    He's not a fluke, he had a lot of money behind him when he started out. (Same as Jeff Bezos)

    He's also very shrewd business man like (Jobs and Zuckerberg)

    People like him are usually quite successful in the business world as they are some how able to remove all emotion from their business activities.



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    #939
    Thinkingaboutit
    Registered Users Posts: 2,193 ✭✭✭Thinkingaboutit


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118928821#Comment_118928821

    It encourages and fosters a culture of offence taking and outrage mongering. Toxic isn't strong enough. Faecesbook is okay in comparison, though it is a sort of doxxing system for its robot founder of Meta.



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    #940
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,444 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322458#Comment_119322458

    Absolutely - He's a Marketing/Sales guy and an exceptionally good one at that - He's not a tech genius/guru though, he's not an "operations" guy either.

    I mean look at the Cyber Truck as an example - He does an amazing job of hyping that thing and they get a huge number of pre-orders and all the hype that goes with that. But we are still waiting for it and will be for another good while it seems.

    In the meantime , Ford have developed, built and launched their Electric Pick-up Truck and have stolen his thunder and probably lots of people are cancelling their Cyber Truck orders.

    The car manufacturers are going to just swamp Tesla over the next year or two - For every Tesla Model (real or planned) there are now a half a dozen plus competing models from the Big players all available to buy right now , cheaper and with better build quality and reliability.



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    #941
    Potatoeman
    Registered Users Posts: 4,304 ✭✭✭Potatoeman


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322466#Comment_119322466

    You know there are concentration camps in China? I’m waiting in bated breath on the boycott.

    Remember free Tibet? That disappeared when business and Hollywood thought they could make money there. What about Apples outsourced factories where employees regularly jump from the building, going to give up the iPhone?

    Amazing how morality is subjective on what the current climate see as acceptable. Was Elon screaming and lashing people with a whip too?



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    #942
    Dyr
    Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322505#Comment_119322505


    Aye thats why Bezos and Musk are successful, the money they had behind them 😂



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    #943
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,444 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322570#Comment_119322570

    While it's not at all accurate to say that they were only successful because their parents had money there is absolutely categorically no question that the safety net (and cash) provided by their wealthy families played a significant role in them being able to get started.

    Far easier to "have a go" at a business when you know that you'll always have a roof over your head and you have someone who can bail you out if it goes wrong.



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    #944
    Dyr
    Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322610#Comment_119322610

    Ah right, so their secret sauce was that they were upper middle class.

    So much copage.



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    #945
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,444 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322911#Comment_119322911

    Hard to name a "founder" that wasn't.... - Bil Gates , Micheal Dell , Brin and Page , Zuckerberg - everyone of them from comfortable backgrounds where dropping out of (their very expensive) college and trying to get their business going was an easier decision than if your college was funded by Student loans and you had no savings to feed yourself while you wait for your business to kick off.

    Don't get me wrong , there are thousands of people that have the same kinds of "safety net" available to them that end up doing feck all and just spend all their Parents money, so all those people above had to have the ideas , the drive and ability to leverage the opportunity that their environment afforded them.

    If I have an amazing idea for a business , the decision to jack in my job and give it a shot is made considerably easier if the worries about Rent/Food etc. are off the table.

    Equally , if I go to the bank/investor with my idea I'm far more likely to get funding for my idea if I am back-stopped by family money.

    That's not "copage" it's simple reality.



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    #946
    Beta Ray Bill
    Registered Users Posts: 3,630 ✭✭✭Beta Ray Bill


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322942#Comment_119322942

    100%!

    Bezos parents gave him $250,000 to start up Amazon from from Garage....

    And like you said, if you have something cushy to fall back on, then the risks aren't that really that risky at all.



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    #947
    Dyr
    Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119322942#Comment_119322942

    Thousands? Try hundreds of millions.

    The reason that people like Gates or Musk become multibillionaires is not mummy and daddys money, otherwise all their siblings would be billionaires. It's as pointless as saying that they're only billionaires because they're smart. The world is full of smart people. All this is a massive cope to try and dismiss their success as being primarily a result of their own efforts.



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    #948
    Cordell
    Registered Users Posts: 5,922 ✭✭✭Cordell


    None of those saying that if they were to be rich to begin with won't be able to have the same success as Musk and Gates and Bezos, but whatever makes them feel better I suppose. It takes more than money, it takes vision and leadership and discipline and hard work to achieve what they achieved, qualities that are almost guaranteed to not be bestowed on those bickering on the internets.



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    #949
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,307 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119327317#Comment_119327317

    'cos Elon Musk would never be caught bickering and picking fights on the internet? Uhmmmm ...

    As within anything else in life, money opens doors - and keeps them open; especially useful when trying to make a career. No doubt, there are plenty of "self made" millionaires out there as well; but I daresay even if you asked a silent success like ... I dunno, Eddie Stobart, if he'd have taken $250k to start his logistics empire, he'd have said yes please (gonna turn out Stobart was middle-class, ain't it)



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    #950
    Cordell
    Registered Users Posts: 5,922 ✭✭✭Cordell


    Well it's different when someone like him is doing it, he earned his right.



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    #951
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,307 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119327395#Comment_119327395

    He earned the right to try and destroy a cave diver's reputation? No. Elon Musk is an adult human being like (presumably) the rest of us; success doesn't "earn" the right to be a piece of shít. If wealth and success confers some kind of automatic superiority on a person, then if anything, he should be the best of us.



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    #952
    Cordell
    Registered Users Posts: 5,922 ✭✭✭Cordell


    Riiiight. You may be surprised or maybe not, but strong leaders like him absolutely have to be at least some degree of pieces of sh1t. Like, they should be able to fire hundreds or thousands of people potentially sending them into poverty in order to preserve the wealth of the investors and the future of the company and not lose any sleep over it. This is how it works, like it or not. I know he's a horrible person, but it's not his personality that I admire.



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    #953
    joseywhales
    Registered Users Posts: 4,036 ✭✭✭joseywhales


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119327487#Comment_119327487

    I think our definitions of leadership are different. For me it's inspiring people to follow you and getting the best out of those people and growing them to their maximum. A lot more than being capable of firing a bunch of people. The leader serves their followers.



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    #954
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,180 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    *snigger*

    "Strong leaders". 😄



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    #955
    Cordell
    Registered Users Posts: 5,922 ✭✭✭Cordell


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119327686#Comment_119327686

    That's the romantic version, not the real one.



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    #956
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,307 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119327487#Comment_119327487

    All the more damning Musk can't separate hard business decisions from attacking people on twitter within a personal capacity. Doesn't really speak well of him no matter how you try to spin a personal choice of àssholery.

    "Strong leaders" know the difference. Weak leaders think there's only one way. Weak people attack others online.



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    #957
    kowloon
    Registered Users Posts: 13,434 ✭✭✭✭kowloon


    Money does afford people better opportunities, be it education, startup money or just a place to live and eat while you work, but there are other factors like nepotism and connections that aren't strictly money-related. That said, Cordell is right insofar as you have to be a pretty ruthless person in business to give you the edge because good business sometimes means screwing people over for profit. It's the reason sociopaths are so well represented at the top.

    I think it's harder to lay off people when you have experience of struggling to put food on the table, but even easier still when you just don't care about other people.



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    #958
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,180 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119329803#Comment_119329803

    None of that has anything to do with good leadership.



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    #959
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,444 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119329844#Comment_119329844

    All depends on the definition of leadership you align with.

    Is "Good leadership" success/victory at all costs or is does good leadership mean something more like creating an environment where everyone feels comfortable and are successful (and rewarded accordingly) ?

    For me it's the latter but for some the victory is all that counts so the end always justifies the means.



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    #960
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,939 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119327487#Comment_119327487

    Does 'strong leadership' include agreeing a price for a deal before you have enough information to set a sensible price?



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    #961
    Cordell
    Registered Users Posts: 5,922 ✭✭✭Cordell


    Strong leadership includes making mistakes and not hiding them or blindly go forward with them. He made a mistake, he's trying to back out of it.



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