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Cancellation Nightmare- no refund

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  • 23-04-2020 5:02pm
    #1
    aabarnes1
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭


    Hi folks,
    I am seeking advice on the following:
    Booked flights, cruise, hotels and transfers with the one travel agent- so they handled everything and we paid them one full total price. It was for flights from DUB to MIA, a night in a hotel pre cruise, 7 day cruise, 4 nights hotel post cruise and return flights to Dublin plus all transfers, Flight out on 13 march as all sailings were going ahead. During the 9 hour Flight cruise company cancelled the cruise. So on arrival in Miami we were made aware and called the travel agent who told us to go to hotel as planned and they would try to sort return flights asap. next day they told us to go to the hotel we were meant to be in after the cruise, turns out this hotel agreed to take us a week early due to the situation. On the 17/03 we got confirmation that the flights had been secured and we were leaving on 18/03 and we did. So on our return I got in touch with travel agent who basically say that the cost of the cruise will be refunded minus the extra €320 it cost to change the flights, but that's it. No refund for the hotels or transfers. Where do we stand? we would never have flown had we know, as there were no travel restrictions in place at this time.
    The upshot is I will be out of pocket by €3000 roughly.


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Comments

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    #2
    Rotweiler
    Registered Users Posts: 95 ✭✭Rotweiler


    No need to panic.

    Call your bank, state that your transaction was not fulfilled and the service provider did not provide you with the exact service they promised.
    Show them your invoice and all travel details(In your case an email from your agent about the refund etc.) and ask for a chargeback.

    They will not be able to prove otherwise and your bank will charge them back.


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    #3
    lawred2
    Registered Users Posts: 24,397 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    Rotweiler wrote: »
    No need to panic.

    Call your bank, state that your transaction was not fulfilled and the service provider did not provide you with the exact service they promised.
    Show them your invoice and all travel details(In your case an email from your agent about the refund etc.) and ask for a chargeback.

    They will not be able to prove otherwise and your bank will charge them back.

    I'm not so sure it's that clear to be honest...

    They were carried on a flight out and home. They stayed two nights in hotels as was included in the booking. And they are to be refunded for the cancelled cruise.

    You can't claim that the airline and hotels didn't provide the service they were paid for.

    OP - feel for you - the 13th March was a day after we closed the schools here - not that it might have made much difference to you financially but I can't believe you still traveled.

    Did you have insurance? Have you contacted them? Maybe they can compensate you for out of pocket expenses due to curtailment?


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    #4
    Rotweiler
    Registered Users Posts: 95 ✭✭Rotweiler


    Hi,

    If the details that they have bought does not match(i.e. price, dates, comfort class, hotel type etc.) the service they have received, they will get the refund whatever is the difference.


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    #5
    Esse85
    Registered Users Posts: 8,243 ✭✭✭Esse85


    Rotweiler wrote: »
    Hi,

    If the details that they have bought does not match(i.e. price, dates, comfort class, hotel type etc.) the service they have received, they will get the refund whatever is the difference.

    Banks are hard pressed to chase up on charge backs, Irish Permanent TSB refused to do one for me after my hotel in Portugal cancelled my reservation.

    Banks are useless when you need them.


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    #6
    aabarnes1
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭aabarnes1


    "I can't believe you still traveled."- really?
    Why wouldn't we have traveled, there were no restrictions in place, the cruise was going ahead the morning we flew. If we had cancelled of our own accord we wouldn't have a leg. The way I see it is that I bought a product from them that didn't match up to what I paid for, under the Package holiday and travel trade act, I am entitled to either a refund in full, a like for like holiday or a holiday for a lesser value and the difference reimbursed.
    And as for the flights and hotels where else were we going to stay when stranded in Miami? Its not a matter of whether the airline or hotel fulfilled their obligations, its about the travel agent.


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    #7
    Xterminator
    Registered Users Posts: 4,740 ✭✭✭Xterminator


    OP

    what travel insurance did you have for this trip?


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    #8
    pol12
    Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭pol12


    aabarnes1 wrote: »
    "I can't believe you still traveled."- really?
    Why wouldn't we have traveled, there were no restrictions in place, the cruise was going ahead the morning we flew. If we had cancelled of our own accord we wouldn't have a leg. The way I see it is that I bought a product from them that didn't match up to what I paid for, under the Package holiday and travel trade act, I am entitled to either a refund in full, a like for like holiday or a holiday for a lesser value and the difference reimbursed.
    And as for the flights and hotels where else were we going to stay when stranded in Miami? Its not a matter of whether the airline or hotel fulfilled their obligations, its about the travel agent.

    It's definitely worth talking to your Credit card provider if you paid by card. I am in a similar situation but didn't travel (lock down came before travel).Travel Agent won't give back cost of flights . Rang AIB and rep said they would charge back. Have sent them the details. He was fairly confident that I would be able to get it back.


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    #9
    GerardKeating
    Registered Users Posts: 7,667 ✭✭✭GerardKeating


    Rotweiler wrote: »
    Hi,

    If the details that they have bought does not match(i.e. price, dates, comfort class, hotel type etc.) the service they have received, they will get the refund whatever is the difference.

    But that's what the travel agent already did. the OP got his flights to/from Florida, and a few nights in a hotel, and was refunded for the cruise.


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    #10
    aabarnes1
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭aabarnes1


    pol12 wrote: »
    It's definitely worth talking to your Credit card provider if you paid by card. I am in a similar situation but didn't travel (lock down came before travel).Travel Agent won't give back cost of flights . Rang AIB and rep said they would charge back. Have sent them the details. He was fairly confident that I would be able to get it back.

    I paid last May on my card, maybe it’s too long ago.


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    #11
    aabarnes1
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭aabarnes1


    Xterminator wrote: »
    OP

    what travel insurance did you have for this trip?

    Multi trip worldwide platinum with Chill (Mapfre)


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    #12
    pol12
    Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭pol12


    aabarnes1 wrote: »
    I paid last May on my card, maybe it’s too long ago.

    It's worth the call. Try insurance if that doesn't get you anywhere.


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    #13
    daheff
    Registered Users Posts: 5,866 ✭✭✭daheff


    OP you need to look at T&C's for the package you bought. That will determine whether you are entitled to some or all of your money back (as long as it's in accordance with laws).

    In fairness you didn't get the package you paid for...you flew to Miami for 2 nights and went home again.

    In my book you should get a full refund.


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    #14
    endofrainbow
    Registered Users Posts: 2,705 ✭✭✭endofrainbow


    Just a thought but were the airlines not waiving fees for flight changes ? Therefore you shouldn't have been charged for a flight change?


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    #15
    Darc19
    Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Darc19


    I can't see why the first port of call is not the insurance company.

    Whilst the travel agent arranged the different parts, it was not a "package holiday" so flights and the few nights hotel stays would not be refundable and looks like all hotel nights were taken and so were the flights

    The flight change fee is debatable as it depends on what was said and naturally there's only one side here.

    But insurance company is first port of call on this.

    But at worst, unless this was a package deal and marketed and sold as a fixed package, then it's just the cruise that is to be refunded


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    #16
    aabarnes1
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭aabarnes1


    Darc19 wrote: »
    I can't see why the first port of call is not the insurance company.

    Whilst the travel agent arranged the different parts, it was not a "package holiday" so flights and the few nights hotel stays would not be refundable and looks like all hotel nights were taken and so were the flights

    The flight change fee is debatable as it depends on what was said and naturally there's only one side here.

    But insurance company is first port of call on this.

    But at worst, unless this was a package deal and marketed and sold as a fixed package, then it's just the cruise that is to be refunded

    In the eyes of the law it is a package holiday as it meets the requirements set out in the legislation governing consumers rights, the travel trade act 1995


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    #17
    lawred2
    Registered Users Posts: 24,397 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    Don't accept the part refund and go for the small claims court.


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    #18
    aabarnes1
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭aabarnes1


    lawred2 wrote: »
    Don't accept the part refund and go for the small claims court.
    Looks that way, cheers


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    #19
    Darc19
    Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Darc19


    aabarnes1 wrote: »
    In the eyes of the law it is a package holiday as it meets the requirements set out in the legislation governing consumers rights.

    Without knowing the instructions that the op gave the agent, you cannot say.

    It looks like the op liked a particular cruise and wanted to go on it, but needed to get to the departure point and decided to add a few days.

    That is not a package holiday.


    If the travel agent created the package and marketed as a package themselves, then it is a package holiday.

    But I suspect the former.

    In any case, it probably would be an insurance issue anyway


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    #20
    aabarnes1
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭aabarnes1


    Darc19 wrote: »
    Without knowing the instructions that the op gave the agent, you cannot say.

    It looks like the op liked a particular cruise and wanted to go on it, but needed to get to the departure point and decided to add a few days.

    That is not a package holiday.


    If the travel agent created the package and marketed as a package themselves, then it is a package holiday.

    But I suspect the former.

    In any case, it probably would be an insurance issue anyway
    Package holidays
    Under consumer law, a package holiday is defined as a pre-arranged holiday that is sold at an inclusive price, which must last more than 24 hours or include an overnight stay.
    From the CCPC.ie website.


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    #21
    Darc19
    Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Darc19


    aabarnes1 wrote: »
    Package holidays
    Under consumer law, a package holiday is defined as a pre-arranged holiday that is sold at an inclusive price, which must last more than 24 hours or include an overnight stay.
    From the CCPC.ie website.

    Exactly "PRE-ARRANGED" and "INCLUSIVE PRICE"

    Precisely what I have said.

    You seem not willing to give information on how it was booked.

    As I said if you picked a cruise that was not "prepackaged" by the agent and marketed as such that included the flights and hotel, then your only option is the insurance.

    I'm guessing from your lack of saying how it was bought that the travel agent facilitated the cruise and booked the flights and hotel separately after a specific request from you. That you paid in one sum is neither here nor there.


    Feel free to believe those who give you the answer you want to hear. But scc will not rule in your favor and on top of that the amount you are claiming is above their limit.


    As I said, insurance is what this is for. But as you had the flights and hotel and are getting a refund for the cruise, I can't see hope there either.


    I'd be thinking myself lucky considering the amount of Covid-19 on cruise ships.


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    #22
    GerardKeating
    Registered Users Posts: 7,667 ✭✭✭GerardKeating


    Darc19 wrote: »
    unless this was a package deal and marketed and sold as a fixed package, then it's just the cruise that is to be refunded

    Which is what the OP is complaining about, only the cruise was refunded, not the flights.
    aabarnes1 wrote: »
    I paid last May on my card, maybe it’s too long ago.

    Not always an issue when paying in advance for services, likes holidays, concerts etc.
    lawred2 wrote: »
    Don't accept the part refund and go for the small claims court.

    I think they already did...


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    #23
    aabarnes1
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭aabarnes1


    Darc19 wrote: »
    Exactly "PRE-ARRANGED" and "INCLUSIVE PRICE"

    Precisely what I have said.

    You seem not willing to give information on how it was booked.

    As I said if you picked a cruise that was not "prepackaged" by the agent and marketed as such that included the flights and hotel, then your only option is the insurance.

    I'm guessing from your lack of saying how it was bought that the travel agent facilitated the cruise and booked the flights and hotel separately after a specific request from you. That you paid in one sum is neither here nor there.


    Feel free to believe those who give you the answer you want to hear. But scc will not rule in your favor and on top of that the amount you are claiming is above their limit.


    As I said, insurance is what this is for. But as you had the flights and hotel and are getting a refund for the cruise, I can't see hope there either.


    I'd be thinking myself lucky considering the amount of Covid-19 on cruise ships.

    I think you are misunderstanding the term package holiday, and the fact that I mentioned in my OP how the package was booked and paid for, you clearly haven't read it.
    But for your clarification, I have included the following just so you don't get mixed up or further confused.
    What is a package holiday?
    Your holiday is a package holiday if:

    it has been pre-arranged/is ‘ready-made’
    it is bought at a single point of sale
    it is sold at an inclusive price by a travel agent or tour operator
    it covers at least 24 hours (or includes an overnight stay) and
    it is made up of at least two of the following:
    transport
    accommodation
    car or other vehicle hire
    other tourist activities that are not directly linked to the above but which make up a significant part of the cost and package (e.g. guided tours).
    This is regardless of accommodation, carrier or ticket type.


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    #24
    Darc19
    Registered Users Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭Darc19


    aabarnes1 wrote: »
    I think you are misunderstanding the term package holiday, and the fact that I mentioned in my OP how the package was booked and paid for, you clearly haven't read it.
    But for your clarification, I have included the following just so you don't get mixed up or further confused.
    What is a package holiday?
    Your holiday is a package holiday if:

    it has been pre-arranged/is ‘ready-made’
    it is bought at a single point of sale
    it is sold at an inclusive price by a travel agent or tour operator
    it covers at least 24 hours (or includes an overnight stay) and
    it is made up of at least two of the following:
    transport
    accommodation
    car or other vehicle hire
    other tourist activities that are not directly linked to the above but which make up a significant part of the cost and package (e.g. guided tours).
    This is regardless of accommodation, carrier or ticket type.

    You're still not telling anyone whether it was a prepackaged holiday sold as such and marketed as such by the travel agent (a package holiday)


    Or

    You requested the travel agent to book the cruise and to book tickets to get you there and to add a few nights accommodation at the end of the cruise (NOT a packaged holiday in terms of the legal meaning). For clarification, this is not "pre-arranged" and therefore you fall at point one above.


    Believe others if you wish, but your options are

    1. It is over the scc limit, so a 2 year expensive Civil case is one option where you will most likely lose and be responsible for costs.

    2. Go to the insurance company.


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    #25
    rock22
    Registered Users Posts: 1,623 ✭✭✭rock22


    aabarnes1 wrote: »
    I think you are misunderstanding the term package holiday, and the fact that I mentioned in my OP how the package was booked and paid for , you clearly haven't read it.
    But for your clarification, I have included the following just so you don't get mixed up or further confused.
    What is a package holiday?
    Your holiday is a package holiday if:

    it has been pre-arranged/is ‘ready-made’
    it is bought at a single point of sale
    it is sold at an inclusive price by a travel agent or tour operator
    it covers at least 24 hours (or includes an overnight stay) and
    it is made up of at least two of the following:
    transport
    accommodation
    car or other vehicle hire
    other tourist activities that are not directly linked to the above but which make up a significant part of the cost and package (e.g. guided tours).
    This is regardless of accommodation, carrier or ticket type.

    As Daric19 has already stated, nothing in your OP suggests how you booked the holiday and if it is a package.


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    #26
    aabarnes1
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭aabarnes1


    Ok, just an update, following a small claims appeal and a day in the circuit court I won my case against Cassidy travel. They breached the terms of the LTA/Package holidays act as I have mentioned. I received my money back plus expenses.

    For the people who said a flight, cruise and hotel is not a package holiday I suggest you re-read the legislation of the act and the terms of reference set out therein.



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    #27
    lawred2
    Registered Users Posts: 24,397 ✭✭✭✭lawred2


    Well done



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    #28
    aabarnes1
    Registered Users Posts: 295 ✭✭aabarnes1


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119363555#Comment_119363555

    Cheers



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    #29
    treascon
    Registered Users Posts: 242 ✭✭treascon


    Well done for your persistence. You shouldn’t have had to go to those lengths to get your money back but it appears it is becoming more and more common to have to threaten the small claims court/actually take your case to the small claims court to get money back from certain companies



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    #30
    HildaOgdenx
    Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 7,134 Mod ✭✭✭✭HildaOgdenx


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119363511#Comment_119363511

    Well done!



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    #31
    whiterebel
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 14,928 Mod ✭✭✭✭whiterebel


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119363511#Comment_119363511

    What expenses were covered?



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