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Is it time to join Nato

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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    You don't like the verdict of the Court of Appeal because it made you look foolish. Head-the-balls take High Court actions every day of the week, I wouldn't get too excited, because the UK High Court sent them packing the last time, and the Court of Appeal granted them only one of their appeals on narrow administrative grounds which has subsequently been resolved by the Government's adoption of assessments.

    Chagos islands, utter off-topic nonsense.

    You're Anglophobic, in league with autocrats worldwide, and have a juvenile doctrinaire world view that leads you towards conspiracy theorizing and embarrassing yourself.

    If you thought at the start of the thread you'd be opposing NATO on the grounds of an obscure dispute about an Indian Ocean island, you'd probably have admitted to yourself you'd have lost the thread. But you've come so far with the nonsense that you actual went there.



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Ah the auld pivot now.

    I mentioned a number of reasons why we should not trust a country like the present UK,,,boo hoo, sorry to have hurt your sensibilities.

    We haven't even had a look at other NATO members actions and dealings with arm companies.

    I am sure you'll be trotting out the old Americanphobic, Francophobic Canadianpobic nonsense (the sign of a defeated debater IMO) when that happens.

    You have shown you can turn a blind eye. That's about all you have done.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    You don't get to have any standing accusing anyone about "pivoting" you're the cowboy that brought up Yemen (and then denied you brought it up), the Chagos Islands (hilariously), the NI Protocol.

    It goes like this: you bring up yet another off-topic non-sequitur, you get absolutely filleted, then you move on to the next thing out of embarrassment. Rinse and repeat. What next? Toblerone shrinkflation and NATO?

    Bring up other NATO countries arms industries if you wish. I'm mature enough to know developed democracies who defend themselves have defence industries, as they must. You're in la la land if you think setting down arms will make undemocratic actors like Russia, China etc play nice. In fact, you're a full-time resident of la la land.



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    The British are a powerful member of NATO.

    As I said earlier, we haven't even begun to look at the relationships the others have with arms manufacturers.

    It isn't just because of the British that we shouldn't join.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Thank f*ck for NATO countrys defence industrys. They're the only thing at this very moment keeping a sovereign nation being swallowed by a fascist irredentist neighboring state.

    Not that you give a hoot. All you want to do is indulge in Anglophobia and edgelord fringe conspiracies.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Misrepresentation again.

    I didn't pass any comment on the war in Yemen, I mentioned it in relation to UK selling arms to Saudi.

    I also said diddly squat about setting down arms.

    You are far too desparate to win.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    You directly brought up the Yemen conflict. You'll be made own it. You have zero standing to tell anyone about "pivoting" and off-topic posting.

    You'll be filleted on this as you've been filleted on everything else.

    If you're so sanguine about countries having the means to defend themselves, why are going off on an elaborate conspiracy theory about them for?

    How are they supposed to defend themselves if not having domestic arms manufacturers? Pikes and flaming sods of turf? You're a serious joke.



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I'm sure there are those in those multi billion dollar/euro/pound defence industries saying 'thank f*ck for a war'.



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    I brought it up as PART of a point and don't have to apologise to you. If it was against rules, contact a mod.

    I have no issue with anyone defending themselves. Gross immoral selling of arms into conflict zones is the issue



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    The above post is the tell-tale sign of the edgelord conspiracy theorist. Your Anglophobic obsession is merely the Cadbury flake in the 99 to top it all off.

    You'd be better off waving a little white flag Francie.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    I won't be contacting a mod. I'm filleting you for denying you brought it up in the effort to go wildly off-topic after getting your backside handed to you on another off-topic tangent.

    Your dishonesty has you caught out, and I'm letting it be known.

    Selling into conflict zones eh? What like Libya arming the Provisionals? (Indulge me on this off-topic venture for a moment)



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Only reading the first sentence of these rants of misrepresentation.

    I didnt deny I brought it up.

    I brought it up as part of a wider point.

    YOU spun an opinion on it for me.

    My opinion on that war for what it is worth is that both sides are wrong. But that the Saudis have committed a litany of war crimes.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    "Both sides"

    What a cute little evasion. "Both sides" but one side more than the other because it suits your doctrinaire edgelord world view. I'd do a bit of reading about who's doing what in Yemen and who's friends with who before you retreat to your "both sides" hidey-hole. You only see war crimes where you want to see them.

    "Both sides" in the case of NATO and Russia as well apparently.

    "Both sides" everywhere, except in the case of the UK, where revoked export licences for fuel gauges and radio equipment is apparently cause for deep alarm and devil horns to be painted on the object of your doctrinaire obsession.

    Edgelord, Anglophobic, conspiratorial.



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Neutral Yurt...ever hear of it?

    I think both are antiquated anti democracy states. They are both wrong.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Are you talking about the Yemeni government or the Iranian and Hezbollah backed militias trying to pull the state down and set up a Tehran proxy state?

    I can tell you don't have a f*cking bean what's going on in Yemen.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Actually, you're better off having a non-opinion "both sides" opinion, the reply will hurt everyone's ears.

    Yes, yes, war bad. We get it. "Both sides" but particularly any side tangentialy associated with your blood hatred of all things British. Then you *definitely* have an opinion magically.

    Iran and Hezbollah overthrowing states go under your radar and you stay asleep, unless British made radio sets are involved. In which case you wake from your slumber.



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady




  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    More insubstantial ranting.

    Why do you do so much of it?

    As Arlo Guthrie might have said ‘you can see ‘the veins in your teeth’.

    I am not apologising to you for deeply distrusting the British state. There are many more than me who do that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    It would have been useful had YOU done so, because you were the one that brought it into the thread. You'll be made own it.

    And you embarrassed yourself on the facts.

    I'd also invite to start your thread on the Chagos Islands and whatever other aquarian topics you tried to shoehorn in here. But the reality is, you actually don't care about Chagos Islanders and you hadn't heard about them until you stumbled across the obscure matter while desperatley googling to buttress your Anglophobic rants.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Your Anglophobia is far greater than your faux concern you have for Yemen. That much is clear.

    I pity you that you live with this hatred of Britain, because as an Irishman, you'll be living with it for quite a while yet.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    😁 I do own it as part of a wider point. I could have used Blairs adventure in Iraq to make the same point about a NATO power not to be trusted.

    If it is against the rules to use examples point me to that rule or up the yard as they say.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Except you would have made an arse of yourself there too because the Iraq war was not a NATO operation.

    You are getting owned by your own words so badly, it's actually ridiculous.



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Distrust of the British state and it’s motives? Never denied that. I will own that all day long.

    Anglophobia, no. There are many things about Britain I love and cherish.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,839 ✭✭✭Polar101


    So.. Ireland shouldn't join Nato, because Saudi Arabia is bombing Yemen and it's the UK's fault - and joining isn't necessary anyway, since the UK will help Ireland (even though they are the reason Ireland shouldn't join a defensive alliance).

    Also, Iraq.



  • Registered Users Posts: 95 ✭✭hairymaryberry


    Hell no!

    The people pushing for joining NATO are the usual fantasists, read too many Tom Clancy books, and you just know they wont be anywhere near the fight if if did break out. Pure losers dreaming of glory on the battlefield...............but heaven forbid that they do the actual fighting, flat feet and asthma has them on the disability welfare, but only for that they would give Ivan a good pasting.

    Losers one and all!



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    No, not my argument anyway.

    We shouldn't join NATO because it's leading powers are not to be trusted. I don't want to be involved or my children and grandchildren involved in the geopolitical gameplaying that places no value on the lives caught up and lost as a result of it.

    Again I stress that Russia is by far and away the major culprit but I am also not convinced that ending conflict is the goal of NATO and it's primary players. The arms industry is worth hundreds of billions and I don't think it is a stretch at all to see that they have a vested interest in major conflict to remain being fed. I have linked to organisations like CAAT who believe they have infiltrated NATO governments and have managed to influence policy. The only response to that here is 'Putinbot' invective and attempts to bully the issues out of the conversation.

    I also don't think there is any credible physical threat to us and we can protect ourselves in other ways by properly resourcing defence and infrastructure.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,689 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    So you don’t trust the UK?

    But you give them carte Blanche to invade our airspace and you want to enshrine their veto on our armed forces into our constitution.

    Pathetic.



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    When has the UK ever blocked a mission we wished to go on blanch?

    I happen to think conducting peace keeping missions under the banner of the UN is important to the validity of that mission and the force that it has behind it. The vetoes are not ideal but nothing ever is.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    "When has the UK ever blocked a mission we wished to go on blanch?"

    🤣

    So you do trust the UK now, except when you don't - but you really trust them. But you have suspicions, which are based on facts, but your suspicions are not facts. Not yet. But they might be (maybe).

    That's a hell of a foreign policy you have there.




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  • Registered Users Posts: 68,705 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Out comes the memes again. Somebody's argument is in trouble, again.

    P.S. I think it is safe to say that I don't trust many countries not to act in their own interests. T'is a fact of life, not ideal but it's all we have.



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