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General British politics discussion thread

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  • Registered Users Posts: 16,332 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    Well they do in Ireland but my impression is the Brits take pre-election pledges as bit more seriously. Hard to imagine an Irish politician coming out with this

    And Starmer doesn't seem to have left much, or indeed any, wiggle room...

    Keir Starmer has explicitly ruled out "any" deals between Labour and the Liberal Democrats at the next election.

    The Labour leader said he wouldn't form a coalition with "anyone" and also insisted his party would not enter into a looser "confidence and supply" agreement.

    Could we see him doing a Trevor Sargent if his party decides it needs to cut a deal with the Lib Dems after the election?

    Has already signalled his willingness to quit the leadership on a 'point of honour'...



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,650 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    You will not hear any Tory talk about 'a point of honour' - particularly the Johnson/ERG types.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,718 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    Regardless of whether you like the shows which is purely personal what reason is there to shut down the station.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,304 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    I personally couldn't care less.

    But pointing out that Channel 4 isn't some beacon of public service broadcasting.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,718 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    The public want it and it pays for itself so why other than ideology should it go ?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,304 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com




  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,650 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    More likely it has two reasons for the sell off.

    1. To bring editorial control to the channel - more Tory ideas, probably also keep the investigative side under control.
    2. To give the opportunity for the chums to make a few bob. [Remember the sell off of the Post Office - which a few chums posted a nice profit as it was sold for half price]. Chums are good for the economy because they tend to donate to the Tory Party, and maybe to a few influential Tory MPs.

    Plus, it needs to be shown who is boss. Currently it is not under the control of foreign billionaires (we like and who like us) or direct Gov direction - can't have that. Laisser-faire can only go so far.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,839 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    Well they had a pretty exposing piece on Sunack the other night, about his upbringing not being as modest as he makes out, that his parents paid for him to go to one of the most expensive schools in the country while his supporters were claiming he got a scholarship, that when in USA he was involved with companies in the Cayman Islands, etc. I certainly couldn't see BBC going that "gloves off", will be interesting to see if Truss gets the same treatment.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,304 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    Do you think the BBC, ITV or Sky have editorial influence from the Tory Party?

    I agree with your second point. Money is to be made from this. Money is always made when something is privatised. But that's the free market economy which Labour, Lib Dems and the SNP all support.

    In the modern age of streaming services, many people in the UK and Ireland don't want to pay a licence fee. ( I realise Ch 4 doesn't get any licence fee AFAIK). But the age of State owned and funded tv channels will come to an end at some point. That seems to be future.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,650 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    I think the BBC demonstrate a level Gov editorial interference in some of their programming - particularly the QT programmes dealing with Brexit. They are also on the hook to the Gov re the licence. Sky was, until recently, under Murdoch - you know the guy who owns the Times and the Sun newspapers. ITV have always leaned to the right.

    I think that many people (most?) in Britain and Ireland do not want to pay for anything they can get out of - think bin charges, water charges. The estimate of those who should pay for a TV licence but do not is that 15% evade the fee.

    Channel 4 get no external funding and any funding surplus goes back into new programmes. What would happen if it is sold off? Well, what do think?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,987 ✭✭✭✭Tom Mann Centuria


    Sir Keir probably needs to get his Shadow Ministers singing from same hymn sheet when it comes to quite big policy issues.

    Like Rail Nationalisation.

    Or, on the other hand

    More broadly Rachel Reeves fits in to same "how on earth is she a Labour MP" category as Kate Hoey used to. She's further right than a lot of old school Conservatives imo.

    Oh well, give me an easy life and a peaceful death.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,857 ✭✭✭10000maniacs


    RIP David Trimble. Not sure how I feel about his contribution to UK, Irish and Northern Irish politics.

    He seemed at the time to be dragged screaming into the Good Friday Agreement, but did the correct thing in the end, and his party paid a hefty price.

    His legacy will be that he done a lot for peace on the island.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,867 ✭✭✭amacca


    In fairness to the man I think he did pay a price for doing what was the right thing......

    ....who knows how many lives were saved and suffering averted due at least in part to his actions.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,578 ✭✭✭Field east


    I wonder why the conveyer of the first debate allowed so much speaking time to Sunack and significantly less tome to truss

    Why also did she allow Sunack to be constantly butting in on a truss . Truss would be half ways to making her point when Sunack , on most occasions, would overspeak her. Bias comes to mind



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,304 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    But it backfired. He came across as rude and arrogant and talking over a woman.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,175 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    Starmer sacks Tarry because Tarry went on the picket line today. If Labour cannot show support for striking workers, what on earth are they for? You might as well vote Tory



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,987 ✭✭✭✭Tom Mann Centuria


    Fuppin depressing. Unions need to disaffiliate, what are they gaining from it when the Labour front bench aren't even allowed on picket lines. TSSA Union have said Starmer isn't fit to lead. Keeping Labour in the news for all the wrong reasons.

    Oh well, give me an easy life and a peaceful death.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,389 ✭✭✭✭ArmaniJeanss


    Sunak (your spelling just looks kinda weird, but no big deal).

    I didn't read anything untoward into it. Ultimately it's an editorial decision as to whether you are going to let them debate in a robust method, or a strict 'your turn'. They are both perfectly valid ways of doing it. If one person grabs more time and the other person doesn't respond and force their way in, then so be it.

    As I understand it there is no 'equal time' broadcasting rule that has to be adhered to in this 'intra party' debate. When it's Starmer v Truss (or Sunak) in two years time then there'll obviously be strictly agreed rules.



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,959 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    It baffles me that Starmer would sack a shadow minister for picketing what do Labour even stand for anymore?



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,718 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    This is what the Blairites wanted.

    Could have taken the best of what Corbyn was and merged it with a moderate stance and more electable leader but no it was straight back to full on Thatcher light.



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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,595 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl



    Blair (and Starmer) are lightyears away from Thatcherite politics and policies. The Corbyn tactic of pronouncing the UK had lived under 40 years of Tory rule has to go down as one of the stupidest election strategies of all time.

    I do not agree with him on this. Suspect there is an element of distrust between him and the unions, particularly given the role they played in foisting Corbyn upon a Labour Parliamentary Party that didn't want him but this seems a bit boneheaded.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,650 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Do not forget that the unions foisted the wrong Miliband brother on the Labour Party.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,304 ✭✭✭✭hotmail.com


    The unions aren't popular in the UK like the way they aren't popular here.

    Labour trying to be in the centre on everything and not upsetting anyone. Sinn Fein adopting the same strategy. The result is hardly any policy differences between the main parties.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,650 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    That is called populism. It works - sort of - but it takes a lot of polling to find out what is popular and what is unpopular, and trying to keep in the right zone. The real winner is to find a 'cause' that gets most people riled up and pursue that - like Brexit, but nobody wants to talk about that issue anymore.



  • Registered Users Posts: 25,718 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    It's nothing to do with distrust he just thinks he is courting the swing voters. The y said themselves this is about showing they are "ready to govern"

    I defended a fair bit but sacking people for picketing is where I draw the line. What does that say about his stance on workers rights if he can sack a striking worker.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,987 ✭✭✭✭Tom Mann Centuria


    Blair wasn't far from Thatcher at all.

    Here's a Guardian article:



    Here's Thatcher on Blair:


    Here's the man himself:

    Tony Blair: 'My job was to build on some Thatcher policies'

    Former Prime Minister Tony Blair has described Baroness Thatcher as "a towering political figure" whose legacy will be felt worldwide.

    Mr Blair said Lady Thatcher had always been "immensely kind" to him.

    He added: "I always thought my job was to build on some of the things she had done rather than reverse them.

    "Many of the things she said, even though they pained people like me on the left... had a certain creditability."

    Oh well, give me an easy life and a peaceful death.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,497 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    He didn't. The minister was sacked for an unapproved media appearance and for inventing a policy.

    Labour leader Sir Keir Starmer has sacked a junior shadow transport minister who joined striking rail workers on a picket line.

    Ilford South MP Sam Tarry attended the protest at London's Euston station despite Sir Keir calling on his frontbench MPs to stay away.

    Labour said he had been fired for making unauthorised media appearances.

    Mr Tarry said he had been "standing shoulder to shoulder in solidarity with striking workers".

    In a statement Labour said it would "always stand up for working people fighting for better pay, terms and conditions at work".

    "This isn't about appearing on a picket line. Members of the front bench sign up to collective responsibility. That includes media appearances being approved and speaking to agreed frontbench positions.


    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,987 ✭✭✭✭Tom Mann Centuria


    Lol, so Rachel Reeves should expect the bullet for going off script re nationalisation of the railways should she?

    Oh well, give me an easy life and a peaceful death.



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,497 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Lol? What is this supposed to contribute, exactly?

    The Corbynista tactic of aiding and assisting the Conservatives continues I see.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,578 ✭✭✭Field east


    Sunak’s story re family entering the UK is of interest . He would like you to believe that they were very poor when they came, etc, etc, etc . It would be of interest to find out the status of the relatives back home in India. Also the family owned and ran a pharmacy. Where did it get the finance to set one up. And was it necessary to have a degree in pharmacy before one is qualified to run a pharmacy.

    it would not surprise me if the family came from a wealthy background back in India.

    re his family working very, very hard - of course eg the Irish on the building sites did not . Only the Sunaks worked very hard. Everyone else just worked



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