Public Pay Talks - see mod warning post 4293

Every time public service pay is talked about fliball and salonfire turn up. And this is going back over 10 years btw. What is that about? Imagine being that obsessed about PS pay.

It paints a depressing picture of where they must be in their lives. Sorry to be blunt but it’s very peculiar.

Vote on strike action. The 10% pay risees in the private sector won't be much good when they don't have jobs.

Well the fact is we are paying more on average now for public sector pay and pensions than we did during the last crash the problem has not gone away and it looks like its going to be escalated with even more pay rises and the up coming recession so just to give the public sector something to think about.

Before last recession 2008

no. of employees = 320k

Cost = 18.7 billion

Cost per employee = 58437.50

After last recession 2014

No of employees working 288k working

Cost = 16.2 Billion

Cost per employee = 56250

2021

No of employees working = 356k working

Cost = 23.5 Billion

Cost per employee = 66011

So those additional employees recruited between 2014 and 2021 are working out at being paid over 107k each if all the woe is me, poor me stories are to be believed in the public sector and they are getting nothing which couldn't be further from the truth. There has been pay rises and increments going on all the time even during the recession so the math is that we are paying 17.35% more for our public sector employees since 2014 , yet in all that time our inflation rate has only gone up by about 2% in 2021. (I appreciate it has gone up in 2022)

If you want to say but but but but we got our pay cuts (which have been more than paid back and then some). Just do the same equation with the 2008 numbers (ye know after the 2 rounds of bench marking and before the temporary pay cuts not like the fecking USC which is here to stay) and its just under 13% and in that time inflation was actually lower in 2021 (so a minus on the auld inflation) than in 08.

So the argument made here about inflation is funny its like bench marking the public sector pay can only be compared when it goes up yet for the guts of 15 years inflation never grew but the amount paid per public sector employee grew by 13 - 17% in 2021. Go figure

Public sector pay and numbers

Irish inflation rates

s://www.macrotrends.net/countries/IRL/ireland/inflation-rate-cpi

Employee numbers in 2008 to 2022 increased by 11%

The population increased by nearly 13% in the same timeframe.

You still haven’t explained why you are so obsessed (jealous) about PS pay. PS pay is negotiated by representatives of the government and unions. I’ll leave it to them to hash out their worth.

That's funny, I don't remember commenting one way or the other when the Government's reasonable, initial deal was put forward. Maybe you could prove me wrong?

Only in the past few days when greed and bravado about striking surfaced, the usual union antics, did I start commenting.

You're seeing things that aren't there, go get yourself checked out.

As it happens, I'm quite happy where I am in my career. A couple of years ago, I took voluntary redundancy with a pay out that would make any public employee blush compared to their lump-sum. And unlike govt employees, I did not pay a penny towards it. Then I started a better paying job the week after.

Just to remind everyone there is a feature that allows you to ignore a user. Unfortunately you can still see that they've posted but you don't have to read through it. It does improve the thread.

Some users have shown a deep-seated unhealthy obsession with all things public sector for a decade or more. They've spent literal days of their lives on here moaning about it. It does paint a bit of a depressing picture but the main thing to understand is that there is no point in arguing with them. They might use spiraling inflation as their argument this time but it was something else last time and will be something else next time. Their real issue with the public sector is almost certainly something far more personal - perhaps they failed to get in, perhaps they know someone they feel beneath them succeeding in the public sector, who knows.

Fillet steak is 50% more expensive than round steak mince "on average".

You're really not very good with figures are you?

"So those additional employees recruited between 2014 and 2021 are working out at being paid over 107k each if all the woe is me, poor me stories are to be believed in the public sector and they are getting nothing which couldn't be further from the truth. "

That's hilarious.

Of course the comparisons are relevant. All employers are fishing from the same pool. The staff of KBC and Ulster will be sought after by Dept Finance, Revenue, C&AG, NSSO, Central Bank and more. If public sector salaries aren't rising relative to private sector, they won't be able to keep and retain professionally qualified staff, like auditors and accountants.

By 'wedge of cash and golden parachute' I presume you mean the incentivised early retirement scheme which provided very modest benefit from those who chose to get off the payroll. Which organisations took back realms of these staff 'on contract wage'?

Pop is older, fatter, and sicker now. We get an ungodly amount of referrals through the hospital now

That figure will also show that 100% public sector employees are getting a pay rise which they will be this year. So lets see 2.39 million people working in Ireland in 2021. So that 1.2 million getting a payrise. The .39m is basically the public sector. So that means roughly 1.2 million private sector employees will not be getting a pay rise.

read my response to Andrew I was taking the p1ss with that to highlight something.

The facts are there that I have put up. Can anyone come up with a reason why there was not pay cuts going on in the public sector when the pay per person went up by over 17% in the years from 2014 to 2021 and inflation went up by 2%? Yet we have the unions banging on for 10% increases with inflation at just over 9% in 2022.??

Figures are there for anyone to see not pseudo fact, actual fact if the figures are wrong you will have to get on to your dept of finance as I believe that is where the information was gathered from.

Yeah you like to resort to name calling when you cant come up with a proper argument typical.

The redundancy scheme back after the last crash was a joke there was no one forced to go they were politely asked, if you have proof of people being forced to retire show me and contract workers are not full time employees before that is thrown into the mix.

You have that option, public sector workers don't.

Also if your previous employer continues to underpay relative to competitors, they will find it impossible to recruit or retain staff so will be forced to increase their salary levels sooner or later. Tightfisted employers lose talent and ultimately their business suffers as a result.

But we're already seeing that it is practically impossible to recruit teachers, nurses, bus drivers, etc. etc. especially in, but not only in, Dublin. Dublin people pay their taxes and have as much right to healthcare, education for their kids, etc. as anyone else so something is going to have to give.

Joining the public sector is a complete loser nowadays if you have to live anywhere near Dublin and jobseekers know this. Given the pay on offer at entry levels and the joke of a pension scheme, it's not much of an attractive prospect no matter where you live, unless living in your mammy's for the rest of your life is your plan.