Random EV thoughts.....

Going back to 2003 when Toyota started cheating. Wow, that must have been many years before VW. I wonder did they sell any of those cars / trucks in the USA? If so, VW paid a $15 billion fine over there, Toyota could be next up on the block. I'd say at this stage it is more likely than not that Toyota will not survive long term as a major car company unless they are rescued somehow.

In a generation or two people will laugh at us, silly people who thought they could make dirty combustion engines clean. We certainly did try every trick in the book, invented ludicrous systems like start stopping of the engine all the time, exhaust gas recirculation, tiny engines with turbo chargers, catalytic converters, particulate filters and when none of it really worked, we had no option but to cheat.

Hino has an annual production of 130000 units, VW 8 million or so, fines per rata probably will be small change for the largest car maker in the world.

Honestly, I do not think that Toyota is going to lose out that much given the perceived reliability of the brand, their successful self-charging gimmicks, while on the other hand, nearly every EV brand has battery replacements ( 4 OMG I cannot believe that.) or degradation of some sort.

I heard some commentators saying that emissions cheating was basically standard practice in the industry. Could be just hearsay but I imagine the mistake VW made was getting caught

Even for the ones that play by the rules, the test cycles are hopelessly open to abuse

4 battery replacements, is that true? That’s one to avoid…….

That was one very early tesla and is not representative of cars that are 10 years newer.

I'm likely to get some flak for this comment but IMO those early Model S were test vehicles that were sold as commercial products

The implied contract was that Tesla were still figuring out the whole EV thing, so the car would probably have some issues which Tesla would have to figure out as they go

The flip side of this was that the customer got a very cool, high tech EV that goes fast, has free charging, autopilot features and knowledge that if the car broke then Tesla would probably fix it under warranty

If as a customer you were willing to take the risk that you'd have to drop the car in for repairs a bit then it worked out quite well

If you wanted a car that just worked all the time, then those early Tesla's were perhaps not for you

Same as any early adopter technology really

That's exactly what they did.

They did the same with the MX too. Look at Bjorn's model X trips vs his ones in a 3 or nowadays. Shutting down with 14km left, doors not functioning, bits breaking off etc. It's pretty common knowledge that if you buy a year 1 tesla product (and even the 3 was similar to this) that you're getting a beta test product at best.

Have they gotten a bit less generous recently? I seem to remember the old unlimited mileage warranty now has a limit on it? And some of the updates of older hardware weren't being covered under warranty?

Still way better than most cars, I'm fairly sure that BMW or Mercedes haven't ever given free upgrades to the infotainment systems in their top end models

Almost all the perks of ownership from the early days are gone. Unlimited supercharging and premium connectivity were retired years ago and there was a recent announcement about standard connectivity being limited to 8 years. The referral programme is also gone. The terms of the replacement car during warranty work have also tightened up. The CPO programme was downgraded to just used car sales (arguably worse for the customer than other brands). The battery warranty has a mileage limit which is generous but not unlimited and the definition of ‘god working orderI’ for the battery warranty has changed repeatedly.

They allowed the MCUv1 issue to fester for a ridiculous amount of time before acknowledging it at all so even their willingness to accept work under warranty has been reduced.

Possibly the only major differentiator (of service) is the mobile ranger programme which, to be fair, is still around because it allows them to keep their physical presence minimal.

Audi could learn from it for sure

I can never understand why dealers don't offer day long test drives every time any car is in the workshop. I know many people who have gone in for annual service in dealers and walked through the showroom twice and in the end bought a new or nearly new car just from looking around. The cleverer dealers use a salesperson for service bookings, particularly when quiet, rather than a dedicated service person who has no interest in sales. I have been regularly to dealers with EV and ICE and even getting a test drive is hard. I know supply of cars us hard now and sales people tend to push buyers to what they have in stock or can get, but even before this the procedure should be:

-I would like to book an annual service

-Wouid you like a day long test drive of our newest model with all bells and whistles or to be dropped to work by the salesperson?

-Here is our already determined trade in value for your car, and here is the cost to change for model A,B,C including used stock.

Smaller dealers outside cities seem to handle this better. In Dublin it seems like a cattle mart where all staff are too busy to talk.

All the ads on TV are not half as good as good customer service and a friendly upsell when you are already in the dealership.

Oh I agree they are not. In fact I said in my last post that they now offer vouchers as standard and only if you insist will they give you a loaner - and chances are your job will be postponed until a later date to wait for a loaner to become available. And I always say if the work will take 2-3 hours at most, I will just wait in the area and not need any loaner or taxi vouchers. They never seem to be able to commit to that though, which to me shows their service isn't as organised as it should be.

They were ultimately forced to recall & repair/replace by the NHTSA in the US. Up to then, they happily refused to fix many customer cars & charged well for those they did fix.