Crazy quotes for solar panels - can we do anything?

poker--addict · 07-08-2022 7:07pm #1

This is not a thread for quotes! Or to attempt to name and shame. So please don’t.

Over recent months more than one company name has appeared on “excessively priced” quotations.

A few people get saved from big financial errors thanks to boards.is and the Facebook PV community. I expect they are the rare in comparison to those who get, in my opinion, “conned”.

Some quotes I have seen I regard as deeply unethical, at best. I am not talking about 2-3,000 euro or 10% above average, where someone can claim they offer better tech or better customer service. There are quotes circulating which area circa 10,000 euros over market rate.

I suppose my query is whether there any angles to suggest operators charging huge prices are doing anything illegal? Some people could have money to burn, but others paying these may be vulnerable people….that angers me. Almost all must believe they will get a return on investment. Many people who can least afford must be getting duped, then there is the wider point that we all pay the price to reward these, in my opinion, unethical business practises and owners.

Some things I do know;

Businesses are generally free to set their own prices.
Sometimes products are protected from “price gouging” but it’s rare.
There are indirect traps some of these greedy operators may fall into like misleading adverts eg performance, ROI period, and aggressive sales tactics. as above. As above most of the buyers must believe their ROI will be about 10 years, not 25+, if the PV company has incorrectly suggested such a “fact” then they may be in trouble.
We are not talking about a free market product- a government funded grant is in play, can this change the rules of the game? The panels/large costs for the PV businesses are paid for by you and me, Irish tax payers, and I expect some rules or people are accountable to ensure value for our money does exist?

I also think find these bad operators a turn off for the wider industry. I approach all the companies with an unhealthy, rather than healthy, level of scepticism, that’s a toxic way for customers to engage with one’s industry.

Gerry · 07-08-2022 7:39pm

I'd definitely agree with what you are sayimg. the value for money for taxpayers angle needs to be pursued, but how can a complaint process come about.. what about the office of consumer affairs?

Still stihl waters 3 · 07-08-2022 7:47pm

Anytime the government supplements a product you'll have inflation of prices by some, its up to the clients to do their research and get quotes from different suppliers, vulnerable doesn't cut it I'm afraid, if that's the case used car salesmen should be in jail

MojoMaker · 07-08-2022 7:48pm

I got a quote last week for an 10-panel setup (380W panels) with inverter and hot water diverter, but without battery for 9000, or 6600 after grant. Strongly considering it.

Quote with 5kw battery jumped it up to 13,000 or 10,600 after grant.

Both above are final installed prices.

Was looking at the battery option for an EV solution and working the numbers at the moment.

allinthehead · 07-08-2022 8:23pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119442431#Comment_119442431

What would the payback period on a 4k battery be especially with fit in place?

poker--addict · 07-08-2022 9:10pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119442431#Comment_119442431

This is a strong argument. Possibly the final one? Albeit I am not sure a used car sales person is listed on an “approved list” by a government agency or government linked agency subsidising car garage profits.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119442389#Comment_119442389

possible! And to counter the used car garage comparison, a quick google establishes that courts have actually made rulings in the motor industry;

https://www.nationaltradingstandards.uk/news/car-dealership-fined-50k-for-consumer-breaches/

https://m.sundayworld.com/crime/courts/car-dealer-says-he-did-nothing-wrong-despite-pleading-guilty-to-misleading-consumer/41439162.html

3d4life · 07-08-2022 9:16pm

My I borrow this thread instead of starting a new one to ask how local pricing compares to

https://www.costco.co.uk/Home-Improvement/Solar-Panels/c/cos_20.3

?

Gerry · 07-08-2022 9:45pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119442431#Comment_119442431

no diverter here, but 3600 after grant for 8 415w panels, 3.3kw.

bullit_dodger · 07-08-2022 10:19pm

You and me poker = same page. It angers me greatly.

Sadly I think there is zero/little anyone can do other than perhaps what we've been doing here on the forums in helping educate people that there are "better" deals out there. The reality is, that it's a free market, and if a company "x" wants to sell gold plated panels for €20K and they find people willing to part their hard earned cash for that....we'll that's the market at work.

It certainly doesn't sit well with me - but at the risk of sounding defeat'ist, not sure there is a good way of calling out "the chancers".

graememk · 08-08-2022 12:03am

When I first started looking into panels, one of the people I contacted used German panels, double glass coated 30 yr warranty or something. Actually would be good if you were right on the sea..

The first array was for my dad, and even though he's just starting to get the pension, said : who's gonna guarantee that company will be there to honour it in 30 yrs, how much more will technology move in the same timeframe, and will I even see the end of the warranty.

We ended up working with a local company.. and have done 3 sets of panels for us so far. And putting in longi panels

unkel · 08-08-2022 12:29am

Panels are panels. Just get the ones that are cheapest per watt output. It will minimise your payback period. Unless you are extremely restricted in the number of panels you can install because of awkward roof angles and orientation, shading and the like

slave1 · 08-08-2022 6:34am

I agree on panels, my first install was JA Solar 410w, a reputable Canadian brand, they have since (I believe) stopped making panels.

Am I worried, no.

My currently in process install in Jinko brand 455w, not bothered by the brand at all, this is a hugely expanding market so there will be lots of entrants and the Chinese will quickly get up to a high standard and price challenge all others.

Regarding the price gouging, it's simple supply and demand and also lack of consumer knowledge, these are private companies and out to maximise their profits in a golden period of PV installs. There's no shotguns to heads here, to coin a phrase "shop around"

poker--addict · 08-08-2022 9:04am

Private companies yes but aren’t their margins highly dependent upon the exchequer?

bullit_dodger · 08-08-2022 4:55pm

Sure, they get some exchequer funds via the grant that SEAI award. I guess the logic there is that SEAI are reliant on the consumer (person receiving the grant) that they will get the best deal that they can - which as we know doesn't always happen due to lack of knowledge etc.

SEAI are doing their job, increasing the solar penetration in the country. Yeah, there's an argument that we could have a higher KW generation out there, but that's not really their problem just the market conditions that exist.

I mean if you were to do it "right", I'd means test people getting the solar grant of €2400, and I'd even go as far as to give free (or practically free) installations to people in energy poverty such as people on social welfare or very low incomes. Install a 3-4Kwp system for nought or next to nought......and then eliminate the fuel allowance etc.

I know that wouldn't sit well with many (incl me) who've spend €10K+ on systems, but can't see someone on the dole or some low income family forking out a fat wad of cash on a "shiny bauble".

unkel · 08-08-2022 6:07pm

Poor people can go for the solar as a service. Costs just €29.50 per month. Zero up front. Installer gets the grant. And I'd say the savings will easily cover that, so people will save from day 1 and own the system outright after 10 years. But unfortunately most people would be too ignorant to even know that's an option.

https://mysolar.ie/

Means testing my arse 😂

slave1 · 09-08-2022 5:29pm

We can't offer free to those on welfare, how is that fair to working folk, same as high earners should be entitled to same grants as everyone else. This is how fiscal policy is implemented, you don't see children's allowance or the electricity €200 payment means tested...

kabakuyu · 09-08-2022 6:30pm

If got give out free solar panels,you might as well give them an A rated house as well to put them on.

bullit_dodger · 09-08-2022 7:53pm

It's not as crazy as you would first think and believe me when I say I'm a capitalistic pig. LOL ! :-)

Currently many people on welfare get fuel allowances. Well that would be scrapped for starters for anyone who would avail of it. Same goes for any OAP's who get those extra fuel payments in winter. Can't be "free" of course. They'd have to pay something towards it.

As for comments like "sure we don't means test children's allowance". We don't but ....we should. Does it really make sense to be giving the likes of Michael O'Leary children allowance, with €850m in the bank? Does it? Could that money not be better spent elsewhere on people who need it? Sure he's entitled to it, but that idea is only because we've all grown up with that so it seems "wierd" to change it. Same story with the medical cards. Before everyone got one, then it became means tested. I wish we had the money for everyone to have one, but it makes sense to spend the limited resources on the people who need it most.

Would also massively increase solar adoption, which would help us reach and hopefully exceed our green targets. Every house in Ireland should have (some) solar installation. The grants are a decent start, but it doesn't go far enough in my view.

poker--addict · 09-08-2022 8:04pm

It would be a lot easier to supervise a few solar providers ethics than means test every home in Ireland 😃

Grumpypants · 09-08-2022 8:16pm

Lots of retired people are looking to do something for the next generation. Insulation, windows, solar panels etc. And saying buyer beware or do your research is not good enough. It's a topic that is very hard to research.

Id be pretty handy online and I find it hard to cut through all the adverts and buzz words when reading about solar.

My normal go to place for recommendations is boards, but that's not possible in this case due to the no naming rule. I'm sure there is a good reason for it but it seems odd as this isn't a boards policy.

The supplier list only made things worse and more confusing.

bullit_dodger · 09-08-2022 8:22pm

Ohh lots of holes you can shoot in a policy like that. Problem is, is that it's too forward thinking for Ireland. Too many people would shoot it down rather than look at improving/solving things. I've some others such as

"What happens if I availed of the scheme and i move house? Am I no longer entitled?"

Etc

Thing is, is that governments need to think outside the box. If people want to "get serious" about solving environmental issues, they need to start making serious sacrifices .... and not just doing token gestures like banning peat burning/sales in rural Ireland. What have we in Ireland, some 24,000 homes with solar in the last 10 years or so. What's that out of 2.4 million homes....1%. Is that good? I'd say no. Why is that? Part of it is down to the high capital investment that's required. People on here (you, me, etc) most of us are fortunate to be able to do that.....but for many out there, zero chance (zero!) that they'll ever get a solar installation as they don't have €3-4K.

DrPhilG · 10-08-2022 10:16am

The price gouging seen on the Irish PV Facebook page got so ludicrous that I started saving screenshots.

Company name removed of course but the majority of these were the same company although other gougers are becoming well known too.

Some of these are eye watering.

No regulation and no protection for the vulnerable.

unkel · 10-08-2022 12:58pm

I rarely even visit any of those Irish facebook pages. The rip off quotes some people get for solar while gloating and backslapping themselves and each other they got a good deal literally makes my sick. Violently so if I hear one more time from an active company with a double four. Ireland's biggest PV installer.

slave1 · 10-08-2022 6:10pm

I gave up on the Quotes thread, couldn't keep up with the PMs after posting costs.

€16k, for 18 410w panels, 18 455w panels, two Solis 6kW inverters, a Sofar battery inverter, 20kWh battery pack, EDDI, Zappi2, all cabling, two 3.7m ground mounts, custom shed mounts and both aspects of house roof installs, all labour, all materials.

I just need one day with electrician to finish it all off but he is just snowed

lawred2 · 10-08-2022 6:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119446428#Comment_119446428

What's the catch with them?

unkel · 10-08-2022 6:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119455616#Comment_119455616

No catch. They take the SEAI grant and they basically give you a loan over 10 years. The loan pays for the system, you don't need a cent up front. Then over 10 years, you pay them €29.50 per month (your savings should be a good bit more than that) and after 10 years you can stop paying them as the loan is paid off. Win-win for everyone (except the Irish tax payer - but that's the same with any subsidy)

bullit_dodger · 10-08-2022 6:55pm

Yeah, no catch.

But if your average punter has €3-4K...... spending it on solar (even though it will save them money long term) is like one of the LAST things they'll spend it on. They'll always upgrade the car, or spend it on a week in Ibiza, or do up the kitchen etc etc. It's the rare folk (reading this) who "get it".

That's why I think "something different" is needed to encourage adoption. That's why I'd heavily discount it for social welfare people or OAP's etc. If they aren't spending money on energy making Shell, Gazprom or Exxon money, then they are spending that money in the economy (hopefully). Spending money generates money. Helps people in energy poverty get out of that.

Or come up with an alternative......let's go clean slate, how would YOU (open question to everyone not specifically unkel) drive adoption if you had say €50m in the kitty? I'd be curious to see what people come up with.

lawred2 · 10-08-2022 7:25pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119455637#Comment_119455637

hah I see that their business address is literally 2 minutes from my house

Going to check them out. Thanks for that.

Would the possible savings likely eclipse the €30 a month repayment?

unkel · 10-08-2022 7:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119455912#Comment_119455912

I don't know the details of their cheapest system but let's presume it's something like 2.5kwp. South facing in a decent area in Ireland this will generate about 2500 kWh (units) per year. Let's take a worst case scenario where you consume just 40% of your production and send the rest to the grid. Let's say you will have a 30c day unit rate with a smart meter and they pay you 13.5c for export. Then you will make:

40% * 2500 * .30 = €300 saving from self consuming

60% * 2500 * .14 = €200 paid back for export (tax free)

So total saving €500, total cost €29.50 * 12 = €350 per year

Profit €150 or so per year. This is worst case scenario. If day rate goes to 50c, the saving is €350 per year. It's also likely that you self use more than 60% with such a small system

So yes, even very worst case scenario, the €30 a month is totally eclipsed by the savings and remember it doesn't cost a cent up front either. And after the 10 years, all the savings are for the home owner. So likely a figure approaching €1000 per year

DC999 · 10-08-2022 7:44pm

Not sure I agree that climate emergency / cost of energy being out of control for homeowners isn't on peoples minds, and they aren't interested in reducing that.

The neighbouring road close to me with the most solar close (in a very ordinary D12 area where I live) has the most house with solar on it cause guess what? Someone got solar, then another got it because they could understand it / likely talk to the person and see if it made sense...Then others followed. We're influenced by our peers (for good or bad). And someone I know who lives on that road say ours and said it's something on their list when they get their extension sorted.

So we're likely all very good ambassadors / advocates of solar for our own reasons.

Does it suck that only something like 1% of homes have it? Yep. Did we have a spare X grand to spend on it? No, but we moved priorities around to get it.

Tis an energy crisis - so I don't care if my system is 'devalued' if the State roll it out to heaps of homes. Every citizen is gonna pay a lot more if we don't nail Co2 reduction. Solar in Ireland is a '1% club' I don't want to be in. We need heaps more energy security - as people here are pushing in their own way.

I'm not into the debate that those who can afford to invest in energy security (who likely have had more access to education and better paid jobs) are somehow more enlightened than 'others'. My family spent close to 30k (but will get 3k grant back in time) in last few months on a 2nd hand EV (one car family) and solar panels so we can get 'free energy'. I've very aware not everyone can finance those loans. And that's a large amount of money to our 1 income family. So unless you own a house you can't get solar. That's a high bar for many and even then need to own the roof unlike some managed estates) - which rules our apartments and those renting. Even getting solar takes a wild amount of research for the most part - that means you need spare time.

Is there an education piece there that SAAS has no upfront cost so means it's accessible for the masses? 100%. Wasn't something I personally knew before I started getting install quotes and spent months researching solar.

Can the State do more to raise adopt? 100%, which @bullit_dodger poses above

bullit_dodger · 10-08-2022 8:02pm

Excellent points there DC999.

I don't profess to have any, excuse the pun :-) magic bullits here - other than being open to crazy ideas or least willing to thrash them out and then see what might stick.

I do think the grants help by the way with adoption. Not as much as I'd like and in some cases it drives up the average quote, but there are I think solutions to most problems out there. For example if you don't own a house, but your renting you could incentivize landlords to install solar with tax rebates on rent received, etc. not least of which is that the value of their property would increase with a lower BER if they had solar installed when they are selling it on.

SaaS is a great solution. I'd take it one step further and nearly have a government run scheme with sparks on the government payroll installing a "standard" 4kwp system (no battery) similar to the Saas program. Not that unemployment is an issue anymore (I saw we had one of our lowest every figure recently)

Where would all the money come from? Well some of it from existing things such as you can't get "free" €200 energy windfalls like we all got recently there in April if you have a system installed. You can always find the money if you want :-)

Crazy? Maybe - but simply hoping that our C02 problem goes away with a "Ahh shure it'll be grand" might not be the wisest.

unkel · 10-08-2022 9:01pm

Great post @DC999. Personally I do my best to persuade others to get PV (and get into EVs). Thankfully quite a few people have gone that road. I'm always happy to spend time to show people what I have and how things work.

The silver lining of the current energy crisis has brought the issue to a lot more people as they feel the pain directly in their pocket. Before this, people seemed to care very little about the far more pertinent issue of climate change or people's health. Left the diesel running while waiting for the kids to come out of the school.

slave1 · 11-08-2022 12:36pm

SaaS are bound to cop on on FIT very soon, anyone on the fence should strike now!

Great post Unkel, bang on

Gerry · 11-08-2022 2:57pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119456068#Comment_119456068

Yes, the government needs to move to capital expenditure here on fixing the core problems rather than throwing our own or borrowed money back at us. All new builds should have solar built in. If that needs to be subsidized then so be it.

unkel · 11-08-2022 4:10pm

All new builds have solar built in pretty much. And are well insulated. The only thing the government needs to do there is stipulate they require more and make sure they will not be fitted / suitable for any fossil fuel burning. And that there are adequate EV charging solutions in new estates.

And leave current buildings well alone. Far too expensive to retrofit, the money will just go towards labour and profits for the installers, very little will actually go to improvements. The government however can make itself useful by stimulating massive off shore wind generation. Ireland is ideal for that and we can export surplus and make tonnes of money that will pay back for that infrastructure in no time, while making the country independent of fossil fuels within a few decades

Gerry · 11-08-2022 4:21pm

Sorry I don't see it on most new builds. Loads of one offs going up around here in the past few years, very few with solar pv. Might be more prevalent in housing estates..

11-08-2022 9:01pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119459915#Comment_119459915

Same around me, midlands. No new builds have it. Only older builds adding it, what does your man above mean leave current buildings alone?????

munsterfan2 · 12-08-2022 6:58am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119455776#Comment_119455776

Govt to install 5kw panels, house owner gets the free electricity used, Govt gets the fit payments, @200 pa over 25year lifetime, pays 5k back towards install cost. Start with council houses, people on social welfare, oap pension and work up.

Grumpypants · 12-08-2022 7:33am

Had the SAS guy here, very nice. Their €29.99 a month system is small. 7 x 310 that gives 2.17kw. no battery, or hot water (although those options are available at a higher monthly cost, I think 39.99 for hot water)

But the thinking was, in terms of payback, that you are better off starting with a smaller system and using more of the production, than a bigger system and letting it go to the grid for free. And then in a year look at the use, if you think you could benefit from a bigger system chat to them to add more as they can clip on extra panels. For example if you started working from home or bought an EV.

But what I like us they have the price on the website. No rip off or haggling.

Turned out my roof is east west and a weird shape and he didn't think splitting a small system on it was worth it. Recommended a ground mount if possible. But I was building a shed at the time, now that's done I must get back onto them.

redlough · 12-08-2022 7:39am

The SEAI grant system needs to be fixed. I got the benefit of the grant as I had priced before and after grant

Last week I tried to upgrade insulation in attic. Was told 2k and was happy with this, they would install this week. They booked it in and I put onto SEAI website. Next thing company rang back saying they didn't realise it was SEAI. Was told I need to do survey etc and I would be put on a list. When I told them I already had a survey done by them years ago, they wouldn't accept and said I would have to wait for survey and the 2k price was no longer any good.

I have good money they will come up now and say the price is 3500 because of SEAI so the "grant" is nothing.

I did get a quote recently for the same work via an electricity company. 7-8k after grant was the price I got 🤬

DC999 · 12-08-2022 1:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119461993#Comment_119461993

If it were me I'd contact the SEAI and play the fool and ask if there is an additional charge to the installer as they suggest the cost will increase when you mentioned the grant. And could they give you something to contact the supplier with. Or ideally could ask Seai contact them on your behalf as there may be some cunfusion. We all know they are doing something they shouldn't to jack up the price. Which taxpayers then fund.

Then after that formal piece the supplier will 'realise they made a mistake, sorry about that admin mistake on our side..' And price goes back to original quote

Or I'd go direct to complaint process with Seai if supplier properly wound me up. But softly softly often works best.

unkel · 12-08-2022 1:59pm

The only way to fix the SEAI grant system is to get rid of it. Subsidies in this countries are just benefitting the installer. Terribly inefficient use of tax payer's money. And stifling competition between SEAI installers and non-registered installers. Get rid of it all and let the market work better, giving the subsidy (if needed) directly to the end user in the form of FIT / tax credits / net metering / whatever, no matter what way the install was done.

bullit_dodger · 12-08-2022 2:29pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119464131#Comment_119464131

Yeah, what your saying is the sad reality mate. My main issue though is, how can someone who's a low income earner or worse an unemployed ever expect to get the initial capital together to get an install on the cards? I'm hesitant to start giving away for "free" something that we all had to work hard for. The optics aren't great on that, but at the same time, I'm also keen to see Ireland "properly" tackle CO2 emmissions.

I think the upper middle class, white collar workers can put aside enough spare cash easy enough (we all did), but if your earning in the lower tax free allowances rate..... I'd imagine it's hard. I'd nearly give OAP's the choice on retiring....

give up your fuel allowances and get a 3-4Kwp system installed by the state
Continue to accept the fuel allowances, but no installation.

Thinking here on radical ideas. Effectively you'd "future load" the payments upfront for 10 years, but then at the same time also improve the renewable pentration. Doing this rather than rebates or giving "cash in hand" to someone to buy fuel/leccie so thinking long term solutions over short money in pocket ones.

unkel · 12-08-2022 2:43pm

Well, as I said, solar as a service is completely free, you do not need a cent to get it installed and you will save a few hundred a year. Win win for the poor homeowner with no cash. There's at least a million of these people in Ireland.

Should the grand disappear, there will be a lot less appetite from entrepreneurs to install systems for free but utility companies have the power to work some magic on the bill, they might be interested in taking over. In fact I think electric Ireland (or one of them anyway) was into installs in the past (way overpriced, but that wasn't my point)

The state installing hardware on people's homes is a recipe for inefficient disaster. Worse than any grant / subsidy.

slave1 · 12-08-2022 6:13pm

I get your point re Grant and subsequent price gouging but that's fiscal policy. It works from a macro level. People see the grants and it gives them the incentive to put in panels. Installers source materials from suppliers, suppliers source material and deliveries from wholesalers. All three of the above hire staff (or keep staff in employment), the staff pay taxes, the companies in the chain pay taxes and installers for sure are hiring. Win, win from a macro perspective albeit poor negoatiater end customer suffering.

DC999 · 12-08-2022 6:24pm

How you like these apples!!!! Rent a roof. Boom - energy crisis averted :) Anyone heard of anyone doing that already?

So like getting paid to put a billboard on side of your house. Companies 'rent' your roof and install solar and maintain your roof for a contract of X years. Kit gets removed at end of term or option to extend the term. Company has to put roof back to condition they got it. You get no access to power but they pay you a recurring fee for the roof space rental. They get the FIT on it which is how they make their margin. You don't get solar or discounted electricity but get paid for renting space on your house. Kit would sit outside the house up high away from prying hands.

Somehow (he says not having a clue) there would be an way for the solar to export back to grid on the companies 'meter' / MPRN / account. Wouldn't pass through hit the home owners meter. We said blue sky thinking, right :)

Ideally your rent / fee is not linked to production. As if it went down due to an issue with the kit, new shading happening like growing trees, extension, new building in front...the home owner would be impacted unfairly. It's just paid per sq meter used. Big roof = larger rent

I'm off to the companies registration office now to register that. Tell no one, sshh. I just need a heap of capital and can get some 'mates rates' loans here from Boardsies!!

slave1 · 13-08-2022 7:04am

Don’t need a heap of capital, if you have the space buy up all the old 200w panels used into used inverter and makeshift ground arrays, but as top rate tax folk the incentive dwindles. Early adopter friend sold 24 210w panels at €50 each

unkel · 13-08-2022 11:46am

I started like that. 3 ancient dirt cheap 250W poly panels on my knackered shed plus a £50 Mastervolt Soladin plug in inverter off eBay about 5 years ago. When I upgraded about a year later, I sold all that stuff for far more than it cost me. In other words, the pay back period turned out to be negative. As soon as I had the system plugged in, it started making me a pure profit.

dunworth1 · 13-08-2022 10:08pm

Out of Curiosity did you ask how much it would be to have a battery

i have put in an enquiry with them currently renovating a 100+ year old house so can’t justify the extra money for a pv system upfront but the monthly payment has enticed me to look into it now

silver_sky · 14-08-2022 8:32am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119459871#Comment_119459871

I bought a new build in an estate last year. 4x375W panels (1.5kWp) and a 1.2kW microinverter. It wasn't hooked up when I moved in so I had to get them back out. No monitoring or even a meter on it. I only got the actual spec of the panels & inverter after months of hounding the developer.

I spoke with an installer that had been to another estate in a neighbouring area for quotes. He said many weren't connected and some didn't even have an inverter. Most people don't know enough to check and the snagger (at least in my case) wasn't able to test it.

For the most part, it's for show and a tick the box exercise for the BER rating. That needs to change. At a minimum there needs to be a requirement for a generation meter if not some other form of monitoring. I've been trying to make my neighbours aware and many have been appreciative of the information. Some others have also added additional panels. At least one or two mentioned that they switched off their PV because they didn't want to send free power out. Yeah, have a think on that.

Simply put, it's broken and needs serious changes and most importantly controls.

graememk · 14-08-2022 8:49am

>"At least one or two mentioned that they switched off their PV because they didn't want to send free power out. Yeah, have a think on that."

Urgh. Just goes to show how some people can't see the wood from the trees, and the token 4 panel systems needed for a ber lift, there isn't gonna be much exported anyway... But a quick "your mad, your stopping yourself from saving money just because you don't want to export 10% (if any)

And it's poor show for the snagger not being able to test it. Normally there is a meter or even the display of some sort on the inverter. They are the ones that are supposed to catch this stuff. It's their job.

Although that Welsh guy, the amount of **** and corners cut he finds is unreal

Crazy quotes for solar panels - can we do anything?

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