Irish Property Market chat II - *read mod note post #1 before posting*

They closed because of peoples purchasing habits changed.

As for your comment about political parties in power during a recession they were the same parties in power during non recessionary periods. They were the only parties in power full stop.

And how can the government reduce rents. There is no magic bullet just more supply. We have a limited construction labour force. Yet I. All this demand house construction is starting to slow down especially on one off units, refurbishment's and extensions.

Builders providers reducing staff hours. Paint and tile shops starting to see less activity. This may reduce labour costs on these trades a bit, however will this be enough to keep activity going.

Or will the prices of supplies remain high. The reality is we have front loaded energy costs of houses into there construction stage.

Demands has increased as well because you have more single person households.

Is someone on an average wage better off with a house in which the government have 20-30% or are they better renting with no end in site.

It doesn't though? It just increases prices across the board, I doubt it changes who is actually buying the houses, it'll just change the prices.

Jesus wept, what exactly are you guys asking for?

You want the Government to help you buy a house, they introduce a scheme which helps people do that, but you are not happy for those people who avail of it. The Government are not going to hand you cash/cut the wages of all the people competing against you/stop companies investing in Ireland offering well paid jobs/going to build tens of thousands of houses so that prices fall and you can buy one. Residential property is built in all bar a minute number of cases by private developers, and as the cost of building/profits to be made are out of the control of the government, what exactly are you guys waiting for, and why wouldn’t you think it a good thing that those who do avail of this scheme, finally have an opportunity to buy a home.

Adam, what is it you think/want the next Government to do to help everyone who wants to buy a house?

Do you think the State is going to build them? Hopefully not, because if you do, then you are deluded.

No matter how much a Government helps, the houses are going to be built by private developers which means they are going to be expensive, and subject to market forces. So all those people with good, we’ll paid jobs are going to be bidding against those with an average wage. And as there will be no way hundreds of thousands of houses will be built at the same time, prices will stay high until demand falls. Supply is inadequate, everyone knows this, but you can’t magic up cheap housing.

So, tell me, what is it you think the next Government should, or could do.

It helps the people availing of it if they buy a home.

From the site:

“The scheme is making €400 million available, to facilitate the purchase of up to 8,000 homes over a 5-year period, subject to demand.”

How could anyone view this as the Government “heaping debt” on the buyers who avail of it, and how can they think such a limited number would have any affect on house prices?

What about the 270k employees and over 16bn in direct payroll the MNCs bring to the Irish economy? What about all the taxes the State takes in in corporate tax and taxation on employee income which pays for all the services?

You want unemployment to skyrocket, employees to default on their mortgages, and all the businesses/employees who indirectly benefit from those 16bn in wages to close/lose their jobs? So you can buy a house.

And all this while SF will be telling anyone who will listen that our robust economy will be able to to provide the billions necessary to support a United ireland and replace the UK subsidy paid yearly to NI. You need to give it a bit more thought.

As I said I own a house but I am not greedy and have a lot of empathy to hard working people who are giving up half their wage in rent or still living at home in their 30's. We are not providing with of just two essentials you need to live... shelter to so many irish people and it is a disgrace. Instead MNC are creating loads of jobs do they can make as much money as they can and are importing workers to fill these roles with zero consideration for the housing crises here.

We need a balance where taxation is raised enough so MNC's are not creating a surplus of jobs and therefore no net immigration is needed to cover the jobs.

The fact is 20k units is enough for Ireland's population with no net immigration. It is not enough units when MNC are creating loads of jobs and no restrictions on immigration. We can't put restrictions on immigration from EU but I dont see why we are giving work permits to non EU workers who are either not in construction or health. If google complain thst they get hire aload of Indians in IT to come here and keep their billion profits high wel let them leave. There is no room anymore for imported workers.

The country is putting MNC profits as a priority over providing one of the essentials needed to live which is an absolute disgrace.

As predicted by others here on this thread...

"The pace of reduction in housing activity accelerated sharply over the month"

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2022/0815/1315745-sharp-decline-in-irish-construction-activity-in-july/

I can't remember where I read it, could have been the FT, but an article stated that many investment/pension funds are selling their investments in property and moving elsewhere. Not sure what that's an indicator of if true, but 5%+ ROI (for rented property) is a ridiculously good return so there must be a serious reason.

In any case, not good news if relying solely on the private sector to provide social housing.

A large percentage of new builds never go on the market to the public. E.g. apartments bought by REITs.

Of the properties available to the lublic, 1600 probably represents 10 to 15%.

There in lies the issue. Market only caters for the top 20% of income earners (with subsidies) . All others pay much higher rents, those that can't afford rent are heavily subsidised by the taxpayer. All homes have services provided by the state, where the cost of same is not recouped in direct property charges.

In effect, all property is subsidised by the taxpayer. The more these subsidies increase, the price and rents increase.

This acts as a ball and chain around the ankles of the economy and its citizens whether you own a house or not, the costs grow. As they grow, the economy eventually crashes.

The state need measures that increase supply, reduce costs not stoking further demand. We need product for each income level that is affordable and potentially achieve a positive return for the state. I've detailed numerous ways this can be done, through cost neutral or revenue positive measures

Interesting, isn't it, that the same phenomenon - small LLs being pushed out of the market by government action - is happening simultaneously across several nations and legal jurisdictions?

Previously I posted a link on this thread showing that the same thing was happening in California, New York and New Jersey. Add London and the wider UK to that list.

Of course there is a wider trend of destruction of small businesses in general due to emergency health and safety legislation, regulation and inflation.