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N24 - Cahir to Limerick Junction [design and planning underway]

  • 04-07-2017 11:38pm
    #1
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭


    Due to the dearth of "pipeline" national road schemes, TII & DTTAS are planning on developing a series of schemes to be advanced when the current funded schemes are completed in the next 5-7 years.

    Bar the three Donegal schemes, we got first mention of one scheme today when Alan Kelly asked Shane Ross about any prospective N24 upgrade plans.

    Ross mentions that DTTAS are planning on advancing a 27km upgrade of the N24 from Limerick Junction to Cahir, which includes a bypass of Tipp Town, Bansha and the deplorable bends near Cahir. If advanced, this will be the first section of N24 to be upgraded, given the fact that all other schemes are suspended.

    Welcome news.

    https://www.kildarestreet.com/debates/?id=2017-07-04a.411
    Tagged:


«1345678

Comments

  • #2
    road_high
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,679 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    Definitely the worst section of the road. To what standard are they thinking?


  • #3
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    road_high wrote: »
    Definitely the worst section of the road. To what standard are they thinking?
    That hasn't been decided yet but most likely 2+2/Type 2 DC.


  • #4
    boardsuser1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,196 ✭✭✭boardsuser1


    From the Cahir exit on the M8 to Tipperary town is a pretty poor road, Bansha needs resurfacing in some places as well.

    Been 18 months since i was passing through but can't imagine it has changed very much.


  • #5
    JCX BXC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,373 ✭✭✭✭JCX BXC


    KC161 wrote: »
    From the Cahir exit on the M8 to Tipperary town is a pretty poor road, Bansha needs resurfacing in some places as well.

    Been 18 months since i was passing through but can't imagine it has changed very much.

    It most certainly hasn't changed at all, hasn't changed in years.


  • #6
    Harry Palmr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 40,061 ✭✭✭✭Harry Palmr


    I used to use that road as a delivery driver until 2007 then last year for the first time since I was on it and indeed I'm sure nothing had changed beyond the Cahir bypass having been completed. The N24 is a ghost road.


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  • #7
    pigtown
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,333 ✭✭✭pigtown


    A bypass of Tipp town will give it vital space to breathe. It has great potential but the constant traffic and dirt really prevent it from improving.


  • #8
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    This planned scheme will do wonders for the N24 at peak times. Will remove Tipp Town, the ****e stretch both sides of Bansha and Bansha itself from the equation.

    Will be decent road with no slowdowns from Oola to Rathkeevin.


  • #9
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    The N24 is one of the few national roads that's terrible along its length.

    * Several towns along the route (Tipp Town, Clonmel, Carrick on Suir)
    * Long stretches of legacy terrible twisty narrow road
    * Several dangerous railway bridges
    * A disaster of a 2+1 road that made the road more dangerous (Piltown)
    * A "bypass" of Clonmel that's a glorified car park at peak times
    * A rake of villages (Boher, Dromkeen, Oola, Pallasgreen, Limerick Junction, Bansha, Rathkeevin, Kilsheelan, Mooncoin)

    What's worse is that it has received little attention over the last few decades bar the failed Clonmel bypass, and the 2 2+1 schemes. There's a few bits of hard shouldered road in Co. Limerick but that's about it.

    There were plans for several schemes progressed through 2000-2010s (Ballysimon-Pallasgreen, Pallasgreen-Bansha, Bansha-Cahir, Cahir-Rathkeevin, Rathkeevin-Kilsheelan, Kilsheelan-Piltown, Mooncoin-Waterford). All have been scrapped so we have to start from scratch.

    The Limerick Junction-Cahir planned scheme is the first scheme to be born out of the ashes. If approved it could be open for 2025/2026. Post-Brexit pressure on Rosslare could create an impetus to improve the N24 given its current unsuitability to heavy traffic.


  • #10
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Scheme has been reactivated, along with the entire stretch from Cahir to Waterford.

    Other scheme discussed here: https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=105742900#post105742900


  • #11
    pigtown
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,333 ✭✭✭pigtown


    Limerick City and County Council have been allocated 25 thousand towards this project. Will any of it be in their territory?


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  • #12
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    pigtown wrote: »
    Limerick City and County Council have been allocated 25 thousand towards this project. Will any of it be in their territory?
    It's being done by Midwest RDO most likely, part of Limerick council. All of it is in Co. Tipperary


  • #13
    JCX BXC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,373 ✭✭✭✭JCX BXC


    The sooner Tipperary is bypassed the better, some of the delays I've experienced passing through that kip are best forgotten.


  • #14
    pigtown
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,333 ✭✭✭pigtown


    JCX BXC wrote: »
    The sooner Tipperary is bypassed the better, some of the delays I've experienced passing through that kip are best forgotten.

    It is a kip but if you look beyond the traffic and the dirt it has a lot of really beautiful buildings and with a bypass has the potential to become a very attractive town.


  • #15
    JCX BXC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,373 ✭✭✭✭JCX BXC


    pigtown wrote: »
    It is a kip but if you look beyond the traffic and the dirt it has a lot of really beautiful buildings and with a bypass has the potential to become a very attractive town.

    Possibly, and I'd agree it has some nice architecture but alot needs to be done, hopefully minds would be set once the bypass is built.


  • #16
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Article on this project from the Star.

    https://www.tipperarystar.ie/news/home/309484/progress-on-proposed-tipp-town-bypass.html

    Nothing new, scheme will go through pre-appraisal in 2018 and if it ticks the boxes it will be prioritised for funding as per the National Development Plna.


  • #17
    pigtown
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,333 ✭✭✭pigtown


    Marno, sorry this is off topic but you seem very knowledgeable about roads. A lot of the Caherconlish to Mitchelstown road has land set aside for widening, and judging by the ditches and railings it seems to have been set aside quite a while ago. Do you know if there was a road widening plan that was abandoned?


  • #18
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    pigtown wrote: »
    Marno, sorry this is off topic but you seem very knowledgeable about roads. A lot of the Caherconlish to Mitchelstown road has land set aside for widening, and judging by the ditches and railings it seems to have been set aside quite a while ago. Do you know if there was a road widening plan that was abandoned?

    There are a lot of instances of land being bought by the council for widening but funding never came for the actual works so it was left there with nothing done. There's about 3km of a similar case north of Buttevant where the road is windy before Buttevant. It would be nice with the NDP if these sections could be realigned given the land is there and there would be no CPO issues.

    I know the stretches you're on about and yes I would imagine they were for widening. Theres a lot of it there just north of Hospital


  • #19
    neiljung
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41 ✭neiljung


    marno21 wrote: »
    There are a lot of instances of land being bought by the council for widening but funding never came for the actual works so it was left there with nothing done. There's about 3km of a similar case north of Buttevant where the road is windy before Buttevant. It would be nice with the NDP if these sections could be realigned given the land is there and there would be no CPO issues.


    Where is the section North of Buttevant? A good 5k or so of that was resurfaced about 2 years ago. It does get very wide alright before the junction with the Doneraile road is this the section?


  • #20
    Kermit.de.frog
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,482 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    Will this be a motorway?


  • #21
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    Will this be a motorway?

    Likely the approach into Waterford will be. The rest will be 2+2

    The approach into Waterford will require an alteration of the Grannagh Interchange if ao


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  • #22
    fricatus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,081 ✭✭✭fricatus


    marno21 wrote: »
    The approach into Waterford will require an alteration of the Grannagh Interchange if so

    I wouldn't think so. The M24 could terminate at the same roundabout (Quarry) as the M9 does easily enough, as long as the start of it was built just north of the current N24. That connects to the short stretch of N9 between the Quarry roundabout and the Grannagh interchange


  • #23
    AugustusMinimus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,564 ✭✭✭AugustusMinimus


    The end of the M9 is a right cluster****. What were they thinking?


  • #24
    Chris_5339762
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,067 ✭✭✭Chris_5339762


    Yeah that one is an utter and complete mess, no other way to put it.


  • #25
    Kermit.de.frog
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,482 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    459448.jpg


    The less said the better I think...


  • #26
    JCX BXC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,373 ✭✭✭✭JCX BXC


    It is a truly bizzare layout. Haven't gone on that road much but everytime I do I think what sort of layout is this.


  • #27
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    The design of that junction may have predated the plans for an M9. The plan for the N9 back in the Road Needs Study 1998 was WS2. WS2 N9 and WS2 N24 meeting at that roundabout wouldn't have been the worst idea.

    Of course, in hindsight it does look stupid. If the old plan for Type 1 DC from Mooncoin to Grannagh is ploughed on then there will have to be something done there. That whole area around Grannagh is a total mess between the M9, N24, N25, old N9, link road to old N9, and old N24.


  • #28
    Pete_Cavan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,243 ✭✭✭Pete_Cavan


    Imo the optimal solution is to extend the new N/M24 due east from COS to meet the western end of the New Ross bypass with a proper junction with the M9 south of Mullinavat. A single east - west road linking the M11, M9, M8 and eventually M20 replacing the existing N24 and N25 would really improve connectivity in the southern third of the island.


  • #29
    spacetweek
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,239 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    Pete_Cavan wrote: »
    Imo the optimal solution is to extend the new N/M24 due east from COS to meet the western end of the New Ross bypass with a proper junction with the M9 south of Mullinavat. A single east - west road linking the M11, M9, M8 and eventually M20 replacing the existing N24 and N25 would really improve connectivity in the southern third of the island.

    That's quite a radical idea but I like it.


  • #30
    steeler j
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 318 ✭✭steeler j


    any word on this lately ?


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  • #31
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    steeler j wrote: »
    any word on this lately ?
    Initial planning and route selection should start in early 2019, from Limerick Junction to Waterford.


  • #32
    steeler j
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 318 ✭✭steeler j


    thanks ,how long to select a route ,it is a pity the government didn't have started the early phase in 2014 or 2015 a lot of these projects would be ready to start soon


  • #33
    Bards
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,824 ✭✭✭Bards


    Another fatal collision on this road earlier today...RIP to the young woman


  • #34
    steeler j
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 318 ✭✭steeler j


    yes ,lovely girl and a great family rip....when is shane ross going to do something about the the terrible roads in Ireland,shane ross is talk


  • #35
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    steeler j wrote: »
    yes ,lovely girl and a great family rip....when is shane ross going to do something about the the terrible roads in Ireland,shane ross is talk

    Should be open around 2029-2032 based on current projections


  • #36
    davidk1394
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,224 ✭✭✭davidk1394


    marno21 wrote: »
    Should be open around 2029-2032 based on current projections


    Big delay at the Piltown turn-off. Kilkenny county council want to put in an overly fancy turnoff and the farmer isn’t letting him in without a deal being struck. Once that junction is complete they will start on the road.


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  • #37
    steeler j
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 318 ✭✭steeler j


    I was thinking that would be the timeline because of the back log ,I won't believe anything is getting done until diggers are breaking ground ,so many cities and big towns that are connected by sub standard roads like Cork to limerick ,Cork to Waterford and limerick to Waterford .There is a lot of big towns on the roads as well


  • #38
    road_high
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,679 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    marno21 wrote: »
    Should be open around 2029-2032 based on current projections

    What a depressing timeline....


  • #39
    steeler j
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 318 ✭✭steeler j


    boardsuser1 wrote: »
    From the Cahir exit on the M8 to Tipperary town is a pretty poor road, Bansha needs resurfacing in some places as well.

    Been 18 months since i was passing through but can't imagine it has changed very much.

    started work in Bansha


  • #40
    piuswal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,785 ✭✭✭piuswal


    marno21 wrote: »
    Due to the dearth of "pipeline" national road schemes, TII & DTTAS are planning on developing a series of schemes to be advanced when the current funded schemes are completed in the next 5-7 years.

    Bar the three Donegal schemes, we got first mention of one scheme today when AK47 asked Shane Ross about any prospective N24 upgrade plans.

    Ross mentions that DTTAS are planning on advancing a 27km upgrade of the N24 from Limerick Junction to Cahir, which includes a bypass of Tipp Town, Bansha and the deplorable bends near Cahir. If advanced, this will be the first section of N24 to be upgraded, given the fact that all other schemes are suspended.

    Welcome news.

    https://www.kildarestreet.com/debates/?id=2017-07-04a.411


    Drove Limerick to Rosslare and back evey 10 days in 1971 and 72 , long left the area but it seems as if not much has changed in some parts.


  • #41
    road_high
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,679 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    piuswal wrote: »
    Drove Limerick to Rosslare and back evey 10 days in 1971 and 72 , long left the area but it seems as if not much has changed in some parts.

    Parts in co Tipperary are the very worst and haven’t changed much I’d think, especially from Cahir to Oola. Rest has seen some realignments and upgrades in that time


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  • #42
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    In addition to starting planning on the 27km Limerick Junction-Cahir dual carraigeway, TII seem to be pushing ahead with realignment schemes at Brookes Bridge north of Oola and at the Ballydrehid Bends where there was a fatal accident this past week. Both these stretches are totally unacceptable for a national primary road. These will likely be progressed in parallel with the DC scheme and open before it, as TII are aware that these stretches need removing and it would be foolish to rely on definite progression of the DC because it's politically vulnerable.


  • #43
    steeler j
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 318 ✭✭steeler j


    marno21 wrote: »
    In addition to starting planning on the 27km Limerick Junction-Cahir dual carraigeway, TII seem to be pushing ahead with realignment schemes at Brookes Bridge north of Oola and at the Ballydrehid Bends where there was a fatal accident this past week. Both these stretches are totally unacceptable for a national primary road. These will likely be progressed in parallel with the DC scheme and open before it, as TII are aware that these stretches need removing and it would be foolish to rely on definite progression of the DC because it's politically vulnerable.

    any news on what their hoping to do at Ballydrehid bends ,the railway bridge is very narrow with a tight bend on the Cahir side


  • #44
    Ultimate Seduction
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,464 ✭✭✭Ultimate Seduction


    Tipperary town roads getting done the last few days. Massive delays


  • #45
    steeler j
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 318 ✭✭steeler j


    Ultimate Seduction wrote: »
    Tipperary town roads getting done the last few days. Massive delays

    yes until September this year and then starting on the main street


  • #46
    Christy Browne
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,168 ✭✭✭Christy Browne


    steeler j wrote: »
    yes until September this year and then starting on the main street

    Is this prep work for the dual carriageway?


  • #47
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    Christy Browne wrote: »
    Is this prep work for the dual carriageway?
    Not at all. We'll be 10 years older at least when the dual carraigeway comes. The route isn't even chosen yet.

    Design & planning work are to begin on this in 2019.


  • #48
    steeler j
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 318 ✭✭steeler j


    marno21 wrote: »
    Not at all. We'll be 10 years older at least when the dual carraigeway comes. The route isn't even chosen yet.

    Design & planning work are to begin on this in 2019.

    in your experience when u think a route would be selected


  • #49
    steeler j
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 318 ✭✭steeler j


    Christy Browne wrote: »
    Is this prep work for the dual carriageway?

    just road works


  • #50
    marno21
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 14,540 Mod ✭✭✭✭marno21


    steeler j wrote: »
    in your experience when u think a route would be selected
    I would be thinking 2021 as a realistic hope for it.


  • #51
    Christy Browne
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,168 ✭✭✭Christy Browne


    marno21 wrote: »
    Not at all. We'll be 10 years older at least when the dual carraigeway comes. The route isn't even chosen yet.

    Design & planning work are to begin on this in 2019.

    Oh okay fair enough.

    In an ideal situation how long will it take to get from Waterford to Limerick when both the Waterford to Cahir and Cahir to Limerick Junction dual carriageways are done?

    It's pretty much 2 hours on the nose at the moment


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