Ukrainian refugees in Ireland - Megathread

Where do you get 1 in 4 from?

Total in Augiust: 47,962 Ukrainians. 36,917 welfare claims Adults/children. 6,546 employed. So, 1k left welfare last month and became employed.

Which is interesting because:

• As of 10 July 2022, of the arrivals that attended employment support events arranged by Intreo Public Employment Services, 66% were noted with English language proficiency being a challenge in securing employment.

So, it questionable how many more would become employed to the extent of living without welfare supports. In fact, I don't see anything on the CSO stats to show that any grouping has stopped receiving the provided supports promised by the government. Do you?

Lose the biases remarks... as you could be accused of showing biases yourself. Prove your claim that 1 in 4 is a fact. Cause from I can see it's 1 in 6.. no?

I wouldn't see them as lazy scroungers. As you say the majority are in low-paid employment, which means that they're likely still receiving supplementary welfare, similar to the JS that is given to part-time workers. We've no idea how many have left provided accommodation, and are renting on their own steam.

They're simply ill-equipped to settle in a English speaking first world nation. The lack of English ability is important, as is the corruption within Ukrainian education systems. Their qualifications acquired shouldn't be considered on par with those in the EU, because they're not faced with the same standards.

I get your point with 1 in 4 being employed, although it's not a fact. It's an estimate.

You can't acquire decent English quickly. I've taught it as part of TEFL/ESL, and it's hard to get students to the level where they are comfortable with the nuances that crop up in general employment (never mind professional level employment), especially when that employment success rests on communication itself. It's fine with menial labour jobs but there's a limited number of them available, considering that the Irish economy is quite advanced in most respects. Added to which the costs of living independently, tend to require people to be earning well, and for Irish people who aren't, usually they can draw upon familial supports which aren't available to Ukrainians.

English is definitely a problem. Oh, I grant you that people can be forgiving, patient and sympathetic to Ukrainians due to their situation, but that's going to dry up over time, especially when Ukrainians have been in Ireland for extended periods..

However, the most important aspect is that we're facing a recession. It's coming, and it will affect employment in a big way, driving up the requirements for that employment due to increased competition, with many industries struggling. That's going to happen.. and having substandard English will impact greatly on those competing with others (native or foreign) who have decent English already.

Top of the CSO page. Have a look at the notice about the methodologies used, and the problems they face regarding accurate statistics. It's an estimate that could easily be quite different from what they've published, which is why I'm against people throwing these reports around as facts.

And your slant on what was stated isn't questionable? Whereas your interpretation is that if there was a single rocket attack in an area, then the whole province is under threat, even when further attacks have been few . (considering that Ukraine is a rather large country)

Do you even remember what I said originally? Which was in relation to a question you posed: "But why the need to put "war" and "refugees" in scare quotes? It's a real war. They are real refugees"

"Probably because after 6 months of the war, the majority of Ukraine is completely untouched by the war. So the feeling by many is that these refugees could have remained in western Ukraine."

The point was that there was a rather large chunk of Ukraine untouched by the war where refugees could have ended up rather than going abroad. And while a few rocket attacks or such have landed in various provinces, that's not the same as concentrated bombardment, or assault vehicles in the streets etc leading to the idea of war being on their doorstep, with them being exposed to it daily. The majority of Ukraine still hasn't been touched by the war..

[And no, the comparison with Co. Dublin isn't really remotely accurate considering how much larger Ukraine is than Ireland... and the distances involved)