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Westmeath school gets temporary injunction banning a suspended teacher from it's premises

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,247 ✭✭✭Greaney


    Apparently, he doesn't even teach the student so he would never have had the opportunity to compromise his values on this matter

    For more on the Burkes see their own channel, where they tried to be victims in the past but didn't quiet capture the headlines

    https://www.youtube.com/c/BurkeBroadcast



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Even better than lost, the judge threw it out because she and her mother wouldn't just STFU and the judge said that the case couldn't be heard (literally). I think they just like the attention, which they deliberately attempt to disguise as "persecution".



  • Registered Users Posts: 41,062 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    It seems that Mr Burke will stay in jail despite possible criminal prosecution, seizure of assets, indefinite detention, even if he falls foul of a much online wished for degradation at the hands of other inmates. His only frame of reference for this situation is Christian martyrdom. “Here I stand. I can do no other.”

    Some advice be it legal or theological must be found to reach him in his own self understanding to persuade him to end this imprisonment. For the sake of the deeply vulnerable student first and yes, even for Mr Burke.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,489 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    I very much doubt he has any consideration for the student.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,913 ✭✭✭Danno


    Or just have some basic f*cking manners and call the student what they and their parents ask you to call them.

    Or just respect your elders and stop being a spoilt brat in class demanding how those folks (who are older and usually wiser too) teaching you, address you (within reason).



  • Registered Users Posts: 41,062 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    This really is an absolute farce and joke. Enoch Burke didnt ever teach the young person in question so didnt ever have to call the child by their name or their pronoun.

    All the posters here and newspapers look like completely feckin eejits and gobshites claiming he was compelled or forced to use a name and a pronoun. He wasnt. He didnt ever teach the child.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Administrators, Social & Fun Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 76,141 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭Beasty


    john123470 threadbanned



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I've seen no evidence that Enoch is remotely wiser... He can't even follow the basic instructions of a court... It's a bit predictable which posters are managing to twist this back on the student though.



  • Registered Users Posts: 30,513 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    Well Enoch clearly didn't respect the principal, other staff, board of management, the schools students, parents, the Gardai, the Judge,(He's wasting there time also) etc.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 333 ✭✭Fishdoodle


    Had a look at that article -thanks 👍

    Any sources out there to verify that he didn’t teach the student with the gender transition?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,297 ✭✭✭walterking


    The burke family need to be called out for what they are - a dangerous religious cult.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    I think you are correct in that. But there have to be others above the situation capable of reaching him in his own self understanding and bringing him to end the imprisonment. The decline in attention to the case can only benefit the student: It may not be a consequence of any worth to Mr Burke but it will nonetheless be a consequence and a great one for the student.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,489 ✭✭✭✭Dav010


    For most of us, that would be when a family member of close friend would give us guidance. Given what has gone before, I think it unlikely that a Burke family member would be the voice of reason. I am certain the Burke sees himself not only as a victim, but the only victim of this charade, so again, I very much doubt he had given any consideration to the affects on the child.



  • Registered Users Posts: 41,062 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    What a clown.

    No mention of his own behaviour towards the principal at a public event, commending himself for his actions, and now it turns out he doesn't even have reason to have any contact with this student? FFS.

    Its pretty obvious Enoch has been waiting on some "higher cause" to present itself that he could martyr himself too, and this was it.

    Its actually quite disturbing to think someone like this was in a position where they were teaching children in the first place.

    He should be made pay all costs, including the cost of hosting him in a cell in Mountjoy for however long he decides to stay, as punishment for this utter waste of the Court's time. case

    There should also be no further reporting on the case. Shut it down, deprive it of oxygen. The media attention is what they're looking for.



  • Site Banned Posts: 12,341 ✭✭✭✭Faugheen


    Your best response to this is ‘respect your elders’?

    Nobody is being a spoilt brat. They’re going through a tough time in their lives and they’re asking to be treated with respect and dignity.

    You should be ashamed of yourself. Disgraceful attitude and completely out of touch that you think cruelty to children in a classroom is appropriate.

    Scumbag behaviour wanting to pick on vulnerable children like this.



  • Registered Users Posts: 333 ✭✭Fishdoodle


    Fair plé- see it there alright 👍 Puts the sideshow in a clearer context.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,913 ✭✭✭Danno


    Your best response to this is ‘respect your elders’?

    Respecting your elders is always a good starting position.

    Nobody is being a spoilt brat. They’re going through a tough time in their lives and they’re asking to be treated with respect and dignity.

    Many people go through tough times in their lives and don't go to teachers/schools making absurd demands.

    You should be ashamed of yourself. Disgraceful attitude and completely out of touch that you think cruelty to children in a classroom is appropriate. Scumbag behaviour wanting to pick on vulnerable children like this.

    Ah the typical personal attack response from ones who demands tolerance and acceptance. Well @Faugheen - tolerate what I've said and accept it. ;)



  • Registered Users Posts: 41,062 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    I'm confused by this post.

    What exactly are you saying is cruelty to children in this post? Addressing them by preferred pronouns or not addressing them by preferred pronouns.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,913 ✭✭✭Danno


    In a rush to stick the boot in to the poster of a contrary post they read, they forgot to make much sense! ☺️



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,913 ✭✭✭Danno


    From what I've read of this case, I'd agree that Enoch is not being very wise here. Seems like a hot-head and has over-reacted to being asked to address a student using a pronoun.

    There is nothing much wrong with a student being asked to be addressed by a pronoun, equally there is nothing much wrong with the teacher saying no.

    That's about as far as this should have went really, but it seems Burke wanted this to blow up into a sh1tstorm and to copy Jordan Peterson - who handled a similar situation waaay better.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    That is I believe undoubtedly true. But it is not the end point. It is the starting point.

    Others have pointed out that according to media reports he does not teach the student. Rather than ending there in further reinforcement of points about his character it does offer something: his motives seem at least in part directed to the institution and his perception that it has abandoned its foundational charism. (I know how out of date the language sounds, but it is the language of religious institutions). Perhaps there exists someone of theological weight from the CoI who could begin to explore the personal journey of the founder and bring that into play with Mr Burke. That too will sound bizarre to many. But those whose psychology and self understanding is shaped by institutional religion will recognize it. If I understand Mr Burke’s outlook correctly punishment and suffering will only reinforce his martyrdom. What might reach him is very different.

    He did say of his own classes: “I love my students”. There is a foothold there. I really hope that at a senior level beyond the school and perhaps beyond the state there are others who might pick a way to what they would call the road to Damascus. “We are saved in hope”.



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,365 ✭✭✭✭Princess Consuela Bananahammock


    Respect has to be earnt, and ranting about how your religion makes you a moral person is not going to earn respect or make you look wise.

    This isn't the 70s any more

    Everything I don't like is either woke or fascist - possibly both - pick one.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,811 ✭✭✭joe40


    You need to work on your classroom management, if something like that would break down discipline in your class.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,913 ✭✭✭Danno


    I disagree on some of this - Respect should be a given not earned. If everyone has respect as a given they should be fearful of losing respect, therefore they become more mindful about their words and actions for fear of losing respect. With regards to religion, I oft find those ranting in favour of or against religion are two sides of the one coin, quite a streak of nastiness under the cover.

    As for the 70s, wasn't alive then - but am reliably told it was a good ol' decade in many ways too.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,479 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    From Enoch Burkes own mouth , from the above linked article.

    "he said the student at the centre of the request was not in any of his classes, nor had he had any direct dealings with that particular student."

    So he doesn't teach the kid , nor does he have any dealings with them anywhere else in the school context yet he's going through all of this on the vague off chance that he might have to say they/them instead of "he" at some indeterminate time in the future??

    I didn't think I could consider him any more of a thundering bigoted, intolerant arsehole than I did before I read that.

    Turns out I was wrong , I absolutely can.



  • Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,264 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    The only people who come out with one are people who are being disrespectful and trying to justify it. If you fail to be respectful towards others then you can be sure you are in the process of loosing the respect of those around you.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,422 ✭✭✭Snooker Loopy


    According to your logic if a teacher decides to only address a cis boy as "she" or "her" - as a girl, in other words, that's fine.

    That would also constitute wanton humiliation and bullying of a student by a teacher.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 8,913 ✭✭✭Danno


    In Post #998 I said: "Or just respect your elders and stop being a spoilt brat in class demanding how those folks (who are older and usually wiser too) teaching you, address you (within reason)."

    I think the last highlighted bit addresses your concerns there? Right?



This discussion has been closed.
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