Lord of the Rings - [Amazon] *Spoilers*
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Just watched the 2nd episode there. What's the lore on Galadrials ability to swim, wielding a sword was one thing but being able to swim too ? was it ever explicitly stated that she was both lady of the lake and Lothlorien 😋.
In all seriousness tho I'm not really feeling the Galadriel stuff at all , it's all a bit one note. The rest of the episode I thought was pretty good. I enjoyed them exploring the different concepts of time the Elves and Dwarfs have by having Durin chew his friend Elrond out for missing 20 years of his life. Arondirs exploration of the Tunnel and the orc attack in Bronwyn House was suitably tense. Then there's the mystery man Nori has found. Lots of intriguing set ups to be explored down the road .
Post edited by PhiloCypher on2 -
I was trying to put my finger on what it was about the Elrond/Dwarves and Arondir/Men storylines that interested me above all else in the first 2 episodes, and someone hit on it quite well a few pages back; it's the mundane within the fantastical, exactly what Tolkien did so well.
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Two episodes in and I'm just kind of, well meh on it.
It's not as offensively bad as people are making it out to be, but it's certainly not as groundbreaking as others make it out to be.
Visually it's great, like it's absolutely fantastic looking. Galadrial is interesting, but not really getting the whole "tom boy" claim people are making about her, so I'd love if someone can expand on that for me.
The timeline and skips are just confusing, and honestly I'm having a hard time staying focused on it. Still, it's only 2 episodes in and 6 more to go so maybe it will turn it all around.
Still not as bad as The Hobbit was.
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See, I can't say I always agree with it.
By all means, if I'm not enjoying a show then I'll turn it off and be done with it. But that doesn't mean you can't have criticism for it.
Obi-Wan for example was overall, just fine. It focused on the wrong things and while there was a **** load of out of place criticism, much like the Rings of Power, there was a lot of valid criticism too.
Where people fall foul in their criticism is where they just start linking to what are effectively shock jocks of YouTube who shove WOKE and FORCED DIVERSITY in caps across the blurb of their videos in a desperate attempt to get clicks and spout of a load of nonsense.
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On the Elves, while Galadriel and Elrond were perfectly cast in the Jackson films, as a whole I would say the Elves were just....not exactly a riveting part of the trilogy. I recall Legolas getting plenty of **** as well.
So if there is an issue with the Elves in RoP, perhaps it's an issue translating from the literature to film. The difference being that Jackson tried to make them work as they were, whereas these lads running RoP are ripping up the script so to speak (to so far disappointing results).
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Where people fall foul in their criticism is where they just start linking to what are effectively shock jocks of YouTube who shove WOKE and FORCED DIVERSITY in caps across the blurb of their videos in a desperate attempt to get clicks and spout of a load of nonsense.
Genuinely interested in your thoughts on the narrative which currently surrounds this show. I gave it 3/10 myself on my boards review last week. I would be hoping for a dramatic surge in quality, and i am pessimistic on that front.
But the backlash is currently very much under way.
- The show is being review bombed by racists
- Racists are attempting to destroy the show
- Dozens of press releases about this, yet none show any evidence to support these claims
Just to back up what i claim
Btw this is also being used as the excuse for Amazon and IMDB preventing people from writing low star reviews
Therefore the narrative - 'This is a great show which critics love; Anyone criticizing is doing so for racist reasons'
As someone who is lukewarm on the show what do you think (not putting words in your mouth btw, but just taking Meh as lukewarm)
Respectfully
Sic semper tyrannis - thus always to Tyrants
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A fair question, I can answer it but I won't promise it will be a full thing. I try and steer clear of online drama around these things, but for context, I've been a huge Tolkein fan since I was a wee lad in the 80's. Hell, my mam used to read me the Hobbit and the Lord of the Rings was the first "proper" book I ever read, albeit taking me several months to do so. With that said, I'm no lore master. I also believe it's far, far too early to leave a review on this show.
For example, the first 3-4 episodes of Breaking Bad were not well received way back, but over time became one of the biggest shows ever (I'm not saying that will happen here, just that you need to watch the full thing before reviewing)
- You are absolutely right that Amazon and others are using the racist comments as a reason to dismiss the genuine feedback. But studios will often find the easiest way to ignore feedback.
- However, I do not believe that is the complete narrative, I think that's more like a bias confirmation that we all are victim of, especially when it comes to looking things up on Google, which gives a very skewed result depending on you. It may be the narrative being pushed by Amazon and IMDB, but looking around you can also see a **** load of genuine reviews.
Frankly, I don't care about some Elves and so on being black in the Rings of Power, as it has no impact on characters themselves. Personally, I believe that unless the race of a character is an implicit point of the characters background, personality and history, then it doesn't matter. For example, Ronald Weasely is from Harry Potter comes from a big ol ginger, freckle faced family and it is a defining trait of their family, so changing him to Asian would be kinda weird, same can be said for the Black Panther and even Derek Vinyard from American History X. These are examples of characters were their skin colour is a direct part of the written character.
However, Princess Disa (the wife of Durin) being a black woman, literally zero bearing on the character and doesn't matter. But there are people upset about this and calling it woke. What does bother me is that the Dwarf women don't have **** beards god damn that is so damn stupid.
Now, while you can link to sites like Sky and CBR (Daily Mail will just **** stir no matter what for clicks), we can also link to /r/kotakuinaction where you can find dozens of threads from the last week or two going on about "forced diversity" "woke agenda" and for some reason "the great reset" because there is a sadly vocal subset (yes, it is a minority) of insanely racist people out there (who honestly I don't even think would be that big a fan of Tolkein) who absolutely losing it over the "woke changes.". And there's a number of threads on that same page with people having a conversation about it, discussing the issues with the Silmarillion and why the Amazon version of characters is so different (apparently a rights issue which is **** dumb), quickly followed by another thread which is little more than fanboys begging for a taste of Elon Musks taint
But like I said, it's so easy to find thread and articles filled with super valid, constructive and accurate feedback on the flaws of the show, but it gets filled up really quickly with the assholes who ruin it.
But even on this thread, we have posters here getting really damn upset over Galadrial taking on an Ice Troll in a matter of seconds, but I doubt they had an issue with Legolas taking down a freaking Oliphaunt while counting how many people he killed.
Again, constructive criticism is always good and needed for both good and bad shows, but there's no denying a massive level of sexism when it comes to comparison here. Man can do yes, woman can do no.
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Frankly, I don't care about some Elves and so on being black in the Rings of Power, as it has no impact on characters themselves. Personally, I believe that unless the race of a character is an implicit point of the characters background, personality and history, then it doesn't matter. For example, Ronald Weasely is from Harry Potter comes from a big ol ginger, freckle faced family and it is a defining trait of their family, so changing him to Asian would be kinda weird, same can be said for the Black Panther and even Derek Vinyard from American History X. These are examples of characters were their skin colour is a direct part of the written character.
The problem is that Tolkien, himself, was quite strict on what his races looked like. Elves were "fair skinned". There weren't any black elves. Dwarves were short, rotund, and had beards. Even the women who were rarely, if ever, seen had beards. They were practically indistinguishable from the males, except when viewed close up. I can understand why some people will get their knickers in a twist when this is abandoned. Also, Tolkien's races were distinct and separate. They were often at war or at least at odds with the other races of Middle Earth, which is why the Fellowship was important. An Elf, a dwarf, a hobbit, a human, etc overcoming their differences and working to eradicate a threat to them all. Even in 'The Hobbit', the dwarves don't want Bilbo anywhere near them. Frankly, Dwarves are arseholes from an arsehole culture. Tolkien wrote them that way, stubborn and hardnosed, from a strictly patriarchal society that's closed off to outsiders.
Now, personally, I don't really give a toss because, while I liked 'The Hobbit' and 'Lord of the Rings', I was never that invested in the lore of it all and I'm probably not going to be a fan of this show anyway because from what I've seen of it so far, it's only been (and going to be) a very mild curiosity piece. But I can understand why some people would have genuine misgivings about the portrayal of Tolkien's races in Amazon's show. No doubt there's a lot of mouth breathing knuckle draggers out there too stirring the shit, who will taint everything they touch. But I'm sure there are others for whom they find the idea of a black elf as irksome as they would a 7ft 6 dwarf with no beard, simply because it goes against what the author of their favourite world wrote.
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It would be great if we could all move on the which youtube reviewer is racist debate and actually discuss the episodes themselves.
Respectfully
Things like what was in the box Durins Dad showed him .
Is the the scepter looking thing Bronwyns child found under the floor actually the hilt of Saurons sword.
While it seems odd for the Elves to still hold a grudge against the humans who allied with Morgoth a thousand years ago, does the fact one of them had this buried under his floorboards suggest they were right to.
How amazing did Kazadhum look . Was this what Gimli was expecting to show the fellowship when they went through the moon door.
In the first episode Galadriel said that their torches would hold no warmth where evil tread or some such, are we then the assume Nori not being burned in the burning crater is significant.
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I very much respect and appreciate your response.
- Firstly i agree RE the ethnicity of the characters. I do understand some people are annoyed as it is a fairly stark detour away from the lore. But i dont care - i have said so a few times on this thread.
- id agree too on the fact we have to give it time. I have decided to give it a season. Considering the source material is phenomenal quality, if Amazon cannot convert me to a fan, in one season - then i will retire from it. (Fan of their specific adaption i mean - obviously i remain a Tolkien Fan)
I would differ in my opinion of the backlash. Im a bit of a leftie myself, and while i only say that for context, i almost feel i have to do so. Otherwise someone will undoubtedly refer to me as a member of the Alt Right. I can genuinely understand the backlash against the Amazon Adaption
- The Character of Galadriel has been warped out of all reason. Tolkien did create her as a powerful being - absolutely no denying that. Possibly one of the most powerful elves in Middle Earth. However her power was fairly magical - her role was to protect her kingdom. I also felt that she was an inspirational character. Her turning down of the ring, in Fellowship (both the book and the film) - is a monumental moment. She turned down the object that could have elevated her to god like stature. She is one of the few people that fans speculate, could actually have wielded the ring. (another being Gandalf, there is a series of videos which il happily provide links for if anyone is interested)
- To see her running around with a sword, wearing BODY ARMOR!!! leading a company of Elvish warriors, arguing with people - and shouting that without her sword, what would she be - is frankly beneath her. It would be like Eisenhower rocking up in the first boat on Omaha beach - it is a travesty IMHO. 'Without my sword, what would i be?' - THE REAL GALADRIEL, AS SHE WAS WRITTEN, ME THINKS
- Im using the example of Galadriel here- The problem is that when discussing this, the above opinion will be conflated with my having an 'unwillingness to accept a female character in a lead role' - Literally the opinion is being consider bordering on misogynistic - and certainly 'ultra conservative' - as opposed to what it really is - a genuine dissatisfaction with what they have done to a fabulous character, described in many of Tolkiens books.
Now you mentioned the obvious Far Right racists - the great replacement theory, and other garbage Fascistic things which people are talking about on Reddit. Ok fine, i accept this is happening, and it disgusts me to my core. But there is a long distance between 'Great Replacement' Nut Jobs, and people annoyed by Black Elves and Dwarfs
(Like i said i dont care, but Tolkien Fanatics are annoyed, and their dissatisfaction is based on the explicit description of Elves in the book - born under starlight - pale and angelic beings)
While i dont share these concerns, i think it foul to accuse nerdish Tolkien geeks of being closeted Racist, and bigots, and incels
Likewise, criticism of Galadriel, as stated, is being spun as an attack on Female Lead characters - its nonsense.
I also believe you are downplaying the sheer amount of Spin - as of now the 'Official Narrative' of 'Toxic Misogynistic Racist Tolkien Fans' - is being carried far and wide by reputable News carriers incl BBC, Sky, CNN, MSNBC, RTE, to name but a few. And the reports make no mention of a sad shower of nutjobs on Reddit - they specifically reference Tolkien Fans as a group.. Hence the roll-out of the LOTR Trilogy stars last night. Apparently Whoopi Goldberg ranted about how its just more obvious Racism from White people - (I would have thought her comments on Nazism, and the ensuing backlash, would have been lesson enough not to dive in before knowing the facts, but seemingly not)
But look - i appreciate your response - if you are interested in Galadriel, you should check out the videos about her on NerdOfTheRings - the one of what she would do had she taken the ring is class!
Sic semper tyrannis - thus always to Tyrants
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Things like what was in the box Durins Dad showed him . - Mithril i expect, hence the subtle glow
Is the the scepter looking thing Bronwyns child found under the floor actually the hilt of Saurons sword - I dont recall any specific artifacts being found RE Sauron in the second age - I suspect its an original concept for the show - my suspicion is that its a morgul blade (canon doesnt line up but its amazon so) - they may say it was wielded by one of Morgoths lieutenants - possibly sauron, possibly a balrog - the effect of it catching fire matches exactly the Witchkings sword in Return of the King, extended edition
While it seems odd for the Elves to still hold a grudge against the humans who allied with Morgoth a thousand years ago, does the fact one of them had this buried under his floorboards suggest they were right to. - This is the one non canon part of the episode i liked - The vast majority of Morgoths allies were Orcs - Balrogs (technically the same species as Sauron himself) were also present - Its been years but i dont recall many humans being involved - the ones that went on to fight for Sauron in the trilogy were actually Black Numinoreans - who dont exist yet as they emerge after the fall - But yes this is an interesting part for me too - im not an expert so someone else might answer
In the first episode Galadriel said that their torches would hold no warmth where evil tread or some such, are we then the assume Nori not being burned in the burning crater is significant. I Said before IMHO - i cannot see the meteor man being Sauron - I doubt it is significant. Sauron would be able to speak. And he would show no interest in lowly fireflies. Also amazon seem to be sticking with the idea that Sauron is somewhere in Middle Earth so - he wouldnt be arriving on middle earth. I suspect this is a trick to make audiences think Mystery Man is Sauron
Sic semper tyrannis - thus always to Tyrants
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And there was no need for them to be pissed off, she had the advantage of not appearing to be a threat. I liked sword Gladriel, two good episodes so far but nothing great as the series doesn't have a clear story yet and I'm not really invested. Most of the criticism of the first 2 episodes is more than fair but their is also some Tolkien fans that need to accept that some changes are allowed.
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I have watched the first episode only. The visuals are very, very good but the characters so far are one-dimensional, sullen, unlikeable and boring. The Harfoots are annoying; the whole bogtrotting country bumpkin feasting on blackberries trope is wearisome and unendearing.
Now, I don't hold the LOTR trilogy to be the pinnacle of cinema. Aspects of the movies are repetitive, and some of the characters in that are one-dimensional, too, but that was a feature of Tolkien's world. I also think that the movies should not have been filmed in New Zealand. It's very jarring to me that the plant and landscape life is very obviously australasian (and barren) rather than verdant and redolent of Dark Age Europe, and as the LOTR is based on Nordic, Germanic and Celtic mythology, that irks me no end. For me, this also means there shouldn't be any black elves, Harfoots or dwarves either, sorry.
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Episode 3 - Much better I think.
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Actually received two messages on WHATSAPP saying the same thing. Looking forward to later on and watching it for myself -
- Im interested in the Elvish Occupation of Morgoth Aligned Lands - hoping this is covered
- Curious to see the the young lad with the presumed Morgal Blade
- Would really be hoping that the plot evolves and we dont just have more introductions etc
Anyway - im looking forward to it so!
Sic semper tyrannis - thus always to Tyrants
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Are you sure you dont have cognitive dissonance? I just gave a reasonable example of why this isnt the case, and you just said no, and then appealed to your mind reading skills
I note House of the Dragon is kicking this shows ass in viewership, ratings and consumer appeal and most youtubers are saying nice things about the show.
A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer
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well said, this show has managed to hire mediocre actors at best, led by a couple of no names from Bad Reboot, my wife said after the first one, "was it written by 8 year olds?" and hearing episode 3 is no improvement, I wonder will Amazon go through the 5 stages of grief, they seem to be in the denial phase now? ha ha!
A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer
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Honestly silverharp, I'm just not a fan of seeing the views of folk like The Quartering (in particular) being laundered as being reasonable, when their content is heavily targeted at whipping up outrage about women and minorities being featured in pop culture (or, often in The Quartering's case, just random people he picks on from social media channels). Like here's the headline and thumbnail from a video he posted about House of the Dragon several weeks before the show premiered (an inane 12-minute video about how it's 'woke trash' before anyone had even seen an episode of the damn thing!) - not much ambiguity in the message being communicated here IMO with that particular thumbnail choice. The video itself is just him reading a random article about its diverse casting.
Anyway, that's my last response on this particular topic as I think episode 3 of Rings of Power deserves some discussion space :) I'm personally looking forward to watching it this evening.
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Wayne Che Yip directed “Adar,” as he will the next three installments, and succeeded in doling out new pieces of crucial information (such as the fact that Halbrand may be a kind of rogue royal à la Aragorn) while also hinting at future developments (Adar’s identity is obviously a huge deal). “The Rings of Power” is thus far more notable for its production values — it’s a genuinely gorgeous show, one that brings previously unseen areas of Middle-earth to life as strikingly as you could possibly hope — and performances than it is for its standalone plot, but it is moving in the right narrative direction. “Adar” feels more like a stepping stone than a destination unto itself, but you have to walk before you can stride.
Got the same vibe from Halbrand's story as well.
Arondir's story progressed as did the Harwood migration and 'The Stranger' proves useful.
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I think Adar will be this seasons villain.
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Episode 3 - Better than 1 and 2 - but thats not a high bar - id stretch to 5/10 myself
THE GOOD
- Halbrand - yes he is a very interesting character - he is thus far my favorite character for the show, by a country mile
- Númenor - yea its an interesting place for sure. It looked great - kinda highlighted the idea that the survivors of these people will eventually found Gondor
- The Orcs tunneling around Mordor is pretty cool - certainly .. The revelation of the mark as being a map - yes, i had heard as much. But the delivery was good. what was good also was the two plots interwoven, between the Orcs/Elvish Prisoners - and Galadriel making the connection to the map.
The Bad
- Galadriel as a character is still very hard to like. It is not just the canon violations - this new Galadriel is annoying, and incredibly rude. The real Galadriel (as written) would have handled the scene with the Queen entirely differently - she would have been diplomatic, courteous, and clever. Ignore if you wish but i visualize her laying praise on the queen, her people, and the Captain who saved her life. She would have stated that, although the Numinorians no longer care for the Elves, her people still hold them in the highest regard. She would have praised the entire Kingdom of Numenor, as having the right to do as it pleases, having earned that right. Then she would have begged their leave, and undoubtedly been granted a small ship and safe passage - Instead she basically insults them, they only exist because her people said so. And she will do as she wishes, because..... whatever
- I cannot understand the decision to have Galadriel shown riding a horse in slow motion. It knocked me out of the story. You can relate this to the above Galadriel specific criticism, but its entirely different. This is a fault of the show runners and directors - The episode was doing VERY well (by its own below par standards) up until this moment - then i genuine let out a WTF?? I get they have to pad the story out quite a bit - but this is a Joke. Slow motion smiling. Followed by Slow Motion cloaks - followed by slow motion IMPOSSIBLY WHITE HORSE - Cringe inducing
- The Hobbits - OMG the hobbits - their accents. Their behavior. Their very existence - VERY VERY poor
- Mystery Man - His plot didnt advance at all - again, yes they have to pad it out. I know that. But i think its obvious who (or at least what) he is - just get on with it. Or if you must, skip a few episodes and then have your revelation -
- I personally find it VERY annoying that Isildur et al, are alive BEFORE the Rings of Power, and more importantly the One Ring- this is purely my own issue, so i wont assume others have this same gripe.
- The Pacing in general is poor. Again when you look at what they got right (Halbrand, the orcs, the map) - The purposeful padding is horrendous. They should have been content to have shorter seasons, in order to keep the pace up to speed.
Thats it for this week for me - 5/10 seems overly fair by my reckoning - its an improvement.
In relation to the series as a hole (supposed spoilers for the season)
- The fact im liking Halbrand will collapse entirely if he turns out to be Sauron - even watching this episode, you can see elements pointing in numerous directions. so i am HOPING this rumor is incorrect. A conflicted character, with a horrid past is a good character. And one i will enjoy watching. Finding out that Sauron GOT INTO A BAR FIGHT, and tried to ROB A CREST - (to say nothing about saving Galadriel last week) - its the pits if its true
- They need to fix Galadriel - fast. She needs to come out of this season, resembling more the Character we know and love. This constant bickering, arguing, and insulting those around her is insane. I cannot understand the direction. Taking Galadriel and putting her in bod armor, is annoying. But rewriting her character into an angry, insulting arrogant asshole - entirely unnecessary - it is beneath her as a character. She is better than this, or at least she should be
- Improve the pacing in general.
Anyway, happy to discuss, and looking forward to seeing what we reckon :)
Sic semper tyrannis - thus always to Tyrants
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—- potential spoilers ——
I think Halbrand will eventually become a wraith but we will see him be the leader to unite the little southland towns.
I think we will see a whole courropted theodan story with the queen regents father also and maybe a plantir? Since he forsaw the elf coming, sick in the bed and the way the people are all suspicious of the elf?
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id be entirely ok with Halbrand being a wraith - and i could see his character accepting one of the nine rings - absolutely - i am hoping that is what they do with him.
I just dont think we can count on it. One of the big criticisms of this show, is that the writers are overtly giving us hints in many different directions. I dont have a gripe with foreshadowing - that can be interesting and enjoyable if done properly. But the writers of this show have actually set out to confuse people - its not a mystery, its deliberate, overt misdirection.
- Halbrand - First Line 'Looks can be deceiving' - HUM,, maybe -
- Saves Galdriel - Ok he is a good one -
- has a keen interest in the forge, claiming he can create things like nothing you have seen before - OOOOH MAYBE - Annatar??
- If the Smith helps him, he 'wont forget it' - ANNATAR THE LORD OF GIFTS
- Looks malevolent as he is mocked - Yep its Annatar, its Sauron
- Buys the entire table rounds of drinks and celebrates - eh.. what? no.. guess he is just a man
- Tries to steal a badge, and gets into a bar fight - OK Not Sauron - beneath him, and pathetic for a demigod
- He is a King who's ancestors fought for Morgoth - ok i dont know WTF is going on -
- and since when are kings interested in metallurgy?
We are only 3 eps in and its so obvious that half of what we are being shown is misdirection - Its not good story telling, to say nothing of it being Tolkien.
That said, my point stands, if this is Sauron - Il be quitting the show tbh
Sic semper tyrannis - thus always to Tyrants
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A theory been sprouted online is the 'Halbrand' could become the
His precise identity is unknown, but he could be one of three noble lords of Númenor, who were corrupted by the Nine Rings of Power and thus became the undying Wraiths at the servitude of Sauron.
But the theory of him been Sauron is also considered because:-
- Wants To Stay in Númenor
- Immediate Interest in the Forge
- Has the Charm To Win Anyone Over
- His Name Is a Tricky Subject
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Really enjoying this so far. Looks so beautiful and get the sense that multiple different character arcs will play out and combine over time. Wish there was more like this on tv.
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Thinking out loud but wonder if there would be a benefit in splitting discussion into two threads as has been done for other shows - one for book-readers/Tolkien aficionados and another for show followers / newbies?
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Being the Witchking would be decent IMHO - I would genuinely accept that, and i think it would fit
Being Sauron would ruin it for me - for all the reasons specifically mentioned - Having Galadriel Dead to rights in ep 2 - alone, at sea - and not simply let her die - no he RESCUES her - madness
Sic semper tyrannis - thus always to Tyrants
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Its madness
This is being used as the excuse for not allowing you review the show on IMDB and AMAZON btw - Its a great show, which racists hate - therefore no one is permitted to give it a lower than 6 score -
A few points. I find it baffling that many extreme left wing (arguably SJW types) are defending a show - made by one of the Largest most capitalistic companies in the world. That treats its employees like serfs. But this issue is corrected perfectly by the narrative. Said commentators are not 'supporting global corporation' - they are fighting racism
I know too, that despite what anyone suggests - The world of Middle Earth (having been written by a Catholic Englishman in the early mid 20th century) - it is predominantly white - the elves especially are white, which is explained time and again - born in star light, children of Valar etc etc etc -
But i dont care about the ethnicities of the actors and actresses - honestly it doesnt matter to me at least. If it were a fantastic show, where the vast majority of characters were portrayed by people of color, i would be here -talking about how fantastic it is!!!!!!!! - but the spin invariably means i need to state the following:
- I am not a racist. I dont CARE about the ethnicity of the actors - despite the Tolkien lore, i am happy to accept the cast as they are. I just want a GOOD SOLID SHOW
This is a spin, that is what we are witnessing. If a show is being attacked for being poorly written, or not true to canon, or lousily put together, - the studio will invariably attack the critical fans - in order to detract criticism. The fact that some ACTUAL RACISTS will invariably attack the show - allows producers to smear large portions of fandom, and claim white toxicity and racism as reason for the shows poor reception. We have seen this phenomena time and time again. Star Trek, Star Wars, Doctor Who, Cowboy Bebop, Marvel MCU, etc etc -
- Lousily written stories with no appreciation or respect for the franchises
- horrendous decisions made behind closed doors RE where the story should go, and what its 'message' needs to be
- Decisions to change canon or lore, portrayed as the writer, IMPROVING on the original, and 'bringing modern sensibilities' to a franchise
- followed by countless articles, and press releases talking about a 'backlash by toxic fans'
- While professional critics swarm all over the production, talking about how wonderful it is
Its horrendous - if anything, its damaging to an already floundering show
im happy to debate this with any, and all. We can do so on a separate thread if needs be. And i am genuinely open to your POV. All i ask is that you not smear me personally, and make any claims about my character. I am not a perfect human being, i know that. But i am not a racist, or a misogynist, etc etc etc -
Sic semper tyrannis - thus always to Tyrants
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Yes it does seem they are using this to cover for the poor ratings, there has been a coordinated “response” to this “racisim” which far outweighs the actual racist commentary out there - I can’t actually find many examples of people down right saying they hate it because of casting. I see some saying that they don’t agree with the casting as it doesn’t stay true to Tolkien, the elves being fair skinned being the most I see. The most hate I see is for Galadrials character being butchered along with the very wooden performance which I tend to agree with.
To be honest, the best actors for me so far in this are the non white cast. my favorite is Arondir, he’s the most convincing hero for me. Least favorite, for the record, is Elrond - so lame.
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