Dublin - Metrolink (Swords to Charlemont only)

crushproof · 22-08-2022 12:11pm

Is there any reason why it can't all just be known as the DART? Rather than having multiple brand names? Always bugged me.

Ronald Binge Redux · 22-08-2022 12:39pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119504822#Comment_119504822

It’s a tribute to just how many times Official Ireland has reinvented the (broken) wheel…

N64 · 14-09-2022 2:00am

Taking this project is dead as a dodo now that the cost of living crisis is happening? Any general timeline that the government and relevant parties published back in July?

Podge_irl · 14-09-2022 10:25am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119615467#Comment_119615467

No it is not.

cgcsb · 14-09-2022 11:25am

Official timetable is an RO submission by the end of September. This is now highly unlikely.

Hotblack Desiato · 14-09-2022 2:11pm

Cue endless "They're spendin' billins up in Dublin when Rural Ireland™ is dyin'" whinging in the Dail. Government to kick for touch until next election, then SF will say it'd be nice but we have eleventy trillion euro of election promises to fund.

timmyntc · 14-09-2022 2:53pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119617328#Comment_119617328

Aside from NIMBYs in the Dublin area, Metrolink has been generally well received by the public.

Theres also some cranks complaining about no rail in Donegal or no Luas in Galway but these people are always complaining - hardly representative of the public at large. If ML gets canned it will be due to Dept of Finance putting the brakes on, not due to public opinion or protests

Podge_irl · 14-09-2022 3:16pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119617328#Comment_119617328

I can't see how getting Metrolink started is anything but good news for the incumbent government.

CatInABox · 14-09-2022 3:38pm

At some point we'll have to acknowledge the 50% cut in transport emission isn't going to come from just switching our vehicles to EVs, and any government that's shut down the Metrolink project is going to have to explain just what, exactly, is their plan to hit that target.

I'd say that this project is pretty safe, at least in my opinion.

Sierra Oscar · 16-09-2022 6:56pm

Railway Order application to go in on the 30th of September or there abouts. Documents to be made available to the public in advance of the application going in. Great news.

https://www.independent.ie/news/environment/progress-for-metrolink-as-planning-application-for-new-dublin-rail-line-to-be-lodged-by-end-of-month-41995149.html

Official notices to be published tomorrow say full details of the application for the mainly underground rail line in Dublin will be made public online from September 29.

The documents will then be submitted directly to An Bord Pleanála (ABP) September 30 or soon after.

cgcsb · 16-09-2022 6:58pm

Did the Independent really post a pic of Metro North? There will be no metrolink station on Westmoreland St

spacetweek · 16-09-2022 10:02pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119627703#Comment_119627703

Nothing they do shocks me now. Photo seems to show a station called ".... Bridge" which I think was the old Metro North O'Connell Bridge stop.

Hotblack Desiato · 17-09-2022 4:16pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119617859#Comment_119617859

Hope you're right.

snowstorm445 · 17-09-2022 4:43pm

Can't imagine the upcoming economic downturn bodes well for a project on the scale of Metrolink unfortunately. Didn't Metro North get planning permission back in the day only to be postponed indefinitely after the crash (by Leo no less)?

prunudo · 17-09-2022 9:07pm

The worst thing we do as a nation is roll back on infrastructure and housing during any future potential down turn. We are still feeling the consequences of doing that the last time.

bennyineire · 17-09-2022 11:36pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119631118#Comment_119631118

Let me see this magic crystal ball you have and show me this "upcoming recession" you seem certain of and how it will be comparable to 2008 even though we as a country will have a projected surplus of €6 billion this year

snowstorm445 · 17-09-2022 11:49pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119632521#Comment_119632521

I'm not trying to scaremonger, but the vast majority of analysts agree that some sort of recession is on the way for Europe later in the year/into next year. And I never said it would be an exact repeat of 2008 either. I'm just making the point that projects like these unfortunately always seem to be destined for the chopping block in those situations.

If it still gets the go ahead, fantastic.

bennyineire · 18-09-2022 12:09am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119632553#Comment_119632553

Near cert that it will IMHO, it'll actually be a money spinner in around about way for the government due to employment and tax generated from the project

spacetweek · 18-09-2022 3:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119632583#Comment_119632583

That's how we, and economists, and anyone rational, would see it, but it's often not how the government see it. I do think the need to meet climate goals will push it over the line though (not that you should need that).

Podge_irl · 18-09-2022 4:09pm

Ireland had no access to debt markets in 08, even in a general upcoming recession there is no sign that that will be an issue. If anything, a recession would have the possibility of making it cheaper.

blanch152 · 19-09-2022 10:14am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119634262#Comment_119634262

I agree, the Greens presence in government is crucial to the public transport policies in the pipeline. You worry if they lose seats in 2025 and drop out of government that other parties will believe public transport is not a vote-winner and will drop projects at that time.

loyatemu · 19-09-2022 10:47am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119636588#Comment_119636588

the greens are toast at the next GE, and even if they do hold onto a few seats I can't see them going in with the inevitable SF-led next govt.

My concern is that SF will be throwing money around and Metrolink is unlikely to be a priority for them - it's a FF/FG project that won't even be open until after the following general election. If they need to find some cash for their budget priorities, they'll drop Metrolink like a stone.

cgcsb · 19-09-2022 12:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119636588#Comment_119636588

I don't see that in practice. The GP haven't done much of anything for PT. All current projects predate their stint in government

Sam Russell · 19-09-2022 12:35pm

The problem with the Greens is that their leader is more interested in the perfect Green projects and priorities than the practical good-enough policies. Delays could be fatal for many of these projects.

He should be pushing for Metrolink, the M20, and the Cork-LJ-Limerick railway project. All three are needed now, and there is no sign of a single shovel even being on order to be ready to go into action. He needs the Tunnel Boring to be commenced prior to the next GE, or the whole project could be in jeopardy.

As we all know, the perfect is the enemy of the good.

bk · 19-09-2022 1:18pm

"I'm not trying to scaremonger, but the vast majority of analysts agree that some sort of recession is on the way for Europe later in the year/into next year."

Well first of all, even if there is a recession in some European countries or even across the EU, it doesn't necessarily mean there will be one in Ireland. In 2008 when we were in deep recession, there was actually no recession in Poland and other Eastern European countries. That isn't to say we will or won't be hit by a recession, but it is far from a guarantee.

Second, recession isn't something to be feared, it is a normal part of a healthy economy and can even be an opportunity for a country to develop.

What happened in 2008 wasn't a normal recession, it was almost a complete collapse of our economy. It was Great Depression level stuff. A normal recession isn't that dire and normally doesn't require the aggressive cut backs on infrastructure spending that we saw in 2008.

On the contrary, many more mature economies actually increase public infrastructure spending during recessions, as it can help keep the economy going, employs people who might have been working in the private sector and usually means projects can be delivered cheaper, so more bang for your buck and the new infrastructure can help as the economy comes out of recession. Check out the concept of counter cyclical economic policy.

Recessions happen roughly every 10 years or so. Major infrastructure projects like Metro's often take more then 10 years. If every country cancelled Metro projects every time there was a recession, there would be no Metro's in the world!

spacetweek · 19-09-2022 9:18pm

You would think that public transport projects are predicated on having Greens in government, but that hasn't been the case. I'm very disappointed with Eamon Ryan's lackadaisical attitude to the endless delays that DART/Metrolink/Luas/BusConnects have been experiencing. He is very tolerant of the extremely long lead in times (e.g. if Metrolink, a rehash of an old project, starts in 2025 it will have taken 10 years to get from project commencement to construction. This is crazy stuff) and should be trying to change laws to speed up infrastructure development.

donvito99 · 20-09-2022 9:17am

Ryan was more interested in proposing fantasy/vapourware Metro South projects than he was driving this project on.

CatInABox · 20-09-2022 9:37am

Not a massive fan of him, but I think Ryan is getting a bad rap on here. To be honest, I just don't see what he could have done to push this project, or any other major PT project through faster.

The problems facing our planning and legal systems are not something that can be fixed easily, and the steps that most of us on here would support don't actually have widespread support.

While he made some Metrolink clangers before he was minister, he's been solidly supporting it since taking on the role, even resisting calls for it to be altered.

cgcsb · 20-09-2022 9:48am

I'd say they're more/less neutral on PT. The GP haven't improved the situation, their leader has however damaged metrolink with all his metro South pontificating.

It's energy where the gp have done real damage to our national interests. Exploration for new gas reserves is now banned in Irish territory. Natural gas was Ireland's only hope of transitioning to a low carbon economy, fueled by electricity generated by our winning combination of wind and natural gas. The policy change meant we have to import gas, ultimately from Russia, which is now not an option for political reasons. Even before the Ukraine thing kicked off, technical advice was that there is no existing technology that can replace natural gas in our energy mix but still they ploughed on.

AlmightyCushion · 20-09-2022 12:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119640551#Comment_119640551

We don't get any gas from Russia. It all comes from either Corrib or the UK. However, I agree. I don't think banning oil and gas exploration is a good idea.

Dublin - Metrolink (Swords to Charlemont only)

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