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"Green" policies are destroying this country

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    So why the fear mongering about Ireland then ? Most of these places will disappear due to erosion regardless. Some are so low could happen pretty fast.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,717 ✭✭✭YFlyer




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,717 ✭✭✭YFlyer




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    You must have a calculation is it not all melted yet as were being told it's melting at unprecedented rates.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,913 ✭✭✭Danno


    In Ireland, we have a peak demand of about 7gw...

    You haven't plugged in all the EVs, heat pumps and rapidly increasing population into your considerations. 7GW peak demand will be a distant memory by 2030 and your wind turbines will be struggling.

    We're being frogmarched into darkness.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    What's tom. I did not make a claim when pulled up randomly post up Islands that are sinking anyway and will errode. When will Ireland be underwater back that up please.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    You have given no context What is or who is tom.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭ps200306


    Don't you agree it's absolutely amazing that 120 metres of sea level rise since the last glaciation just magically happened to stop a few centimetres short of inundating all these islands? I mean, imagine it had been 121 metres instead of 120. They'd all have disappeared! Unless, of course, there's something that automatically adjusts to sea level rise, including rates that were much faster in the past than they are today. Now what could that be, I wonder?

    Somewhere like the Maldives might want to make sure they are not wrecking this natural adaptation with their industrial levels of tourism, at 1.7 million passengers (for a population of 0.5 million) and growing at 15% per year pre-pandemic. Apart from that, what about the CO2 footprint of all those plane journeys?

    Well, the poor threatened Maldivians have obviously factored that in -- they have a new 78,000 square metre passenger terminal opening at their main airport next year, which can cater for 7.5 million passengers per year! (A quick check on calculator.carbonfootprint.com tells me that if they hit those levels it would equal about half of Ireland's total emissions reductions target, just from the additional plane journeys. If it was counted against the Maldivians it would give them the highest per capita emissions on planet Earth).

    Oh yeah, did I mention that it's being paid for by the climate-friendly development funds of Saudi Arabia, Abu Dhabi and Kuwait? It'll help funnel passengers to the new Madivaru Airport opened on Lhaviyani Atoll a few months ago, adding to the existing four international and eight domestic airports on the islands.

    the leaders of many of these nations have been highlighting this threat for years and they are terrified.

    Yeah, terrified that Antonio Guterres will stop hanging out the begging bowl for them at the UN.

    Post edited by ps200306 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    true true.. Don't tell them off the coast of Japan fairly deep down they have Neolithic monuments. Sea goes up sea goes down. 🤔



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    It's really weird how some of you pro-pollution folks love to **** on others less fortunate.

    I shouldn't be surprised though, many come from the anti-vax, anti-science, far-right crowd, not exactly known for their compassion towards their fellow human.

    But hey if your outlook on the world means that a nation deserves to disappear because you don't like they built an airport, well, that's a bit special.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl


    No most of those Island are on borrowed time nothing can actually be done no matter how much money you toss around. They were places like hawaii 1 million years ago. There sinking on their own. What do you suggest we do ? And don't say but Climate change. Real answer to this.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    You already have the answer, Tom can assist you further



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,518 ✭✭✭paddyisreal


    The mask slips, when you can't argue against valid points the poster is anti Vax, right wing etc etc. Are you sure your not John gibbons ? Speaking of **** on people less fortunate is that not exactly what you greens are at with your mining of rare elements in China, Chad etc leaving uninhabitable villages with fucked up water supplies.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,330 ✭✭✭✭namloc1980


    Says the guy advocating for people to get into massive debt to pay for useless heat pumps. You and the greenies couldn't give a hoot about others less fortunate in your pursuit of your idealogy of "zero carbon".

    Massive environmental damage around the world for battery technology mining is perfectly fine in the greenie world view. It seems to me you and other greenies are extremely "pro-pollution" in pursuit of your idealogy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,603 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Very few people will charge their EV during the most expensive times for electricity.

    You're anxiety about this is not justified.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,603 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,785 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Ya know the Bahamas used to be under water.

    In fact Bahamas in Spanish means shallow sea.

    Point being things change naturally. Sea levels rise- sea levels fall- continents drift into other continents.

    Humans have no control over this process.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,636 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    Nuclear is only 1% of electrical power consumed in Ireland per annum, this is through the inter-connector to the UK. Ireland also use a much higher % of energy sourced via LG and fracked gas imported to the UK and piped via Moffat into this country.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,785 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,636 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    They were supposed to be underwater decades ago. NZ research shows Pacific islands not shrinking

    Those islands have another problem, they can't go green, they don't have the land area to devote to solar panels and wind turbines.

    In addition, islands in the Caribbean are also subject to hurricanes, the infrastructure gets destroyed. In a world where the Greens impose their targets with scarce fossil fuels, their standard of living reduces quickly to subsistence level being the end of the supply chain and not able to pay the price. Any mass migration will be driven by lack of access to reliable energy bought about by climate change policies not by climate change.


    For reference the poster child for random energy is El Hierro, despite millions of Euros invested it still depends on diesel generators. There is no proof of concept anywhere where wind and solar deliver constant and reliable power. When they can't get it to work on a small scale, what do you thing the chances to get it running in a large scale industrialised economy are? Yet that is the lab experiment we are being subjected to.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,513 ✭✭✭KildareP


    No, most will charge them at night, but:

    • 1mn EV's will add about 1-1.5GW of additional demand to what was traditionally the overnight low of (currently) about 3GW which will bring us close to our present evening peak of about 5GW, assuming you average out everything in an ideal world scenario (i.e. the real world will be more difficult)
    • 600k heatpumps will add up to another 1GW of power on top again which will be weather driven (i.e. the coldest weather often coincides with periods of calm, windless periods, when heating demand peaks and heat pumps tend to be at their least efficient)

    And that's all based on our present day population and housing stock which needs to drastically increase in the years ahead.

    And that's all before we even consider all these wonderful new opportunites the green promise us like producing hydrogen in vast quantities, being able to export green energy via interconnectors, and storing power at scale to cover extended periods where demand exceeds supply.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,033 ✭✭✭spaceHopper


    The problems is we have changes the climate, we have unintentionally changed it.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,785 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Yes but the climate will change anyway based on history.

    I understand the idea of reducing pollution and the circle economy and trying to use renewable energy as much as possible.

    However driving people into massive debt to reduce CO2 emissions is just crazy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,214 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    The problem is that in Ireland we have a a group of ideological fanatics who keep falling over themselves making excuses and ignoring the real major polluters while somehow believing if we follow their ideology it will make a difference to the climate.

    It would not. Not by one iota. All it would do is totally wreck our economy.

    They are even clueless as to what they are advocating for renewables alone would cost, never mind what the rest of their agenda would cost, not just the economy, but individual households.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,603 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    If the water is not available for cooling, as happened in France this year, then it doesn't matter how many nuclear reactors are there, the whole facility is compromised

    But you did ignore almost my entire post. What do we do for the next 14-30 years while we wait for the plant to come online?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,603 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    These were all addressed in the independent reviews

    The whole 'Climate Gate' thing was a bunch of stolen emails, being trawled for snippets that can be taken out of context by climate change deniers and conspiracy theorists



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭ps200306


    It's not at all weird how you Greenies love to sh1t on anyone who doesn't agree with you. Ideological rants are all you've got, and moral grandstanding about imagined uncompassionate anti-science opponents. You know nothing about me or my attitudes. Not that it's any of your business, but I have three science degrees to master's level (hard physical sciences, not nebulous humanities), and I work 100% for vulnerable people's charities for zero pay. Maybe that's why I understand the real-world impact on vulnerable people of Green policies. The people pushing those policies are mainly pampered suburbanites with an irrational fear that the world is about to burst into flames. They're led by dangerous goons like Eamon Ryan who -- literally yesterday -- trotted out the "world on fire" catchphrase in interview, and by old world socialists dressed in new green outfits like Guterres. If there was any common sense around these days they'd be done for false advertising.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,603 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    There was a study in Nature in 2020 that investigated how wind speeds will change due to climate change and they concluded that the changes will be small, but that in the North Atlantic, the amount of wind energy available for electricity generation may slightly increase

    "Global climate non-stationarity is likely to change the resources wind turbine harness and/or the conditions in which they operate, at least in some regions of the world. Research to date has largely focused on potential changes in regions with high WT penetration. Generally, any change in regional wind resources over the course of the current century is smaller than contemporary interannual variability (Table 2 and 3). The uncertainty envelope encompassing projections made using different model tools includes zero (Table 3). In Europe there is some evidence for emerging consensus that the mean annual energy density will increase in the north (for example over Denmark and the United Kingdom) and slightly decrease over the south (including the Mediterranean). In North America there is some evidence of regional declines in the wind resource over much of the western USA, but increases in the region of highest penetration (the southern Great Plains). "

    https://www.nature.com/articles/s43017-020-0101-7

    (full text from pre-print below)

    https://www.osti.gov/servlets/purl/1678722



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,603 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia



    When you say 'Most' of those islands were sinking on their own, do you have a number for this, eg, is that 50.01% of them? Is it 50.01% by population, or by number of islands, or by land area?. Do you have a source for this?

    of the <50% of the islands that according to you, weren't doomed naturally, but are being swamped by rising oceans, what do you have to say to these people? Sorry, we couldn't be bothered to make changes necessary to stop the pollution we're emitting that's causing your entire civilisation to be washed away?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,603 ✭✭✭✭Akrasia


    Whats your point? We do use Nuclear, it is part of our grid. We use it via the 2 interconnectors with the UK, and we will use it as part of our Interconnector with France. We'll have the capacity to use 1.7gw worth of Nuclear power by the time the Celtic interconnector is completed if we need it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭ps200306


    What do we do for the next 14-30 years while we wait for the plant to come online?

    Well, apparently we're going to sit around twiddling our thumbs waiting for Eamon Ryan's green hydrogen to come online. Though I suppose we won't be doing literally nothing -- we'll be actively sabotaging our remaining options for keeping the country running by banning LNG, refusing to develop our indigenous resources, and hypocritically depending on the UK and France to keep sending us their fracked gas and nuclear while also begging data centre operators to fire up their diesel-powered backups. And I guess we'll be killing off the surplus population by hypothermia, which will suit the Malthusian Green agenda to a tee.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,214 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    With you latest pigeon-holing everyone who doesn`t agree with your ideology as climate deniers, anti-vax, anti-science and right wing you remind me of a character Frankie Howerd played in the BBC sit-com Up Pompeii.

    His character was a bit paranoid and one of his catch-phrases was "Infamy, infamy, they all have it in for me."



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,456 ✭✭✭✭ednwireland




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,513 ✭✭✭KildareP


    Only if they have 1.7GW to give us when we need it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,033 ✭✭✭spaceHopper


    When it happens over 1000's of years there is time to adapt to it and well, one species dies out or back and another does better. This is more like a climate car crash it will all happen quickly.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,774 ✭✭✭donaghs


    Looks like China is forging ahead with as much fossil fuel burning as they are capable of doing.

    China doubles down on coal burning in bid to battle energy crunch (thejournal.ie)

    Does this negate the efforts of small countries like us to reduce carbon emissions? Should we put up carbon taxes to compensate? :)

    I guess they did agree to "peak" their carbon emissions by 2030.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,716 ✭✭✭✭maccored


    the big issue I have is that none of the solutions are real solutions. Wind turbines harm the envionrment in their creation, their blades have to be buried, electric cars and their batteries damage the environment in their creation, solar cells cant be disposed of properly etc etc. Governments arent giving us solutions - they're blagging us and creating industries rich people can get richer from.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,270 ✭✭✭jj880




  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 27,325 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    The UK is not going to be producing fracked gas anytime soon, if ever. It is both insanely unpopular and historically ineffective.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Germany buys out Uniper, which was on track to bankruptcy due to having to purchase LNG gas

    Does LNG still look like a good solution? You'd have to wonder, especially given the fact that LNG is more expensive by default.

    I can't see the Germans paying billions in taxes to keep it afloat for very low. If anything its only going to motivate them to further increase the speed of the transition of their grid to renewables.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,214 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    Uniper was in trouble because it bought around half its gas from Russia and is now in trouble because of contracts it signed to supply gas at prices much lower than they can buy it now. It`s about contract commitments not LNG.

    At least Germany are concerned enough to take action on their energy security unlike here, and they do not seem to share your worries on LNG. They are building two LNG terminals, have already leased 4 floating LNG terminal with a capacity of 5 million cubic meters a year, and are planning on leasing another capable of a further 5 million cubic meters per year on it`s own.

    They had set aside 15 billion euro in credit lines according to Bloomberg, and now that the first 1.5 billion has been nearly exhausted, they have set aside a further 2.5 billion euro for LNG. Seems the Germans look on LNG as a good solution and I haven`t heard of any Germans on the streets protesting.

    The Germans know the value of a strong economy. Shame some of our headcases didn`t learn that from them when they were wetting themselves over the agenda that Germany has since kicked into touch as soon as it was looking like effecting their economy

    Post edited by charlie14 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 15,214 ✭✭✭✭charlie14


    You are probably right.

    I see that Carry On Cleo was made 5 years before Up Pompeii, so Frankie Howerd probably stole "Infamy, infamy, they all have it in for me." I cannot recall ever seeing Carry On Cleo, but I do recall Howerd using it as one of his catch-phrases in Up Pompeii.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,636 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    The inquiry was a whitewash in the Sir Humphrey sense. What ClimateGate did was expose academics pettiness, turf protection, manipulation, defiance of freedom of information, lost or destroyed data and attempts to blacklist critics or skeptics of the catastrophic anthropogenic global warming narrative.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,913 ✭✭✭Danno


    If anything its only going to motivate them to further increase the speed of the transition of their grid to renewables.

    Yup, can see the giants of German manufacturing and engineering being motivated by this all right! 🙄



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,636 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    As the spiel from the renewables charlatans from the wind industry might say "beautiful plumage".

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭ps200306


    From the Biz Post:

    Vast majority of Irish people believe the energy crisis is harming EU economy, poll finds

    More than three quarters of Irish people believe the cost of living crisis is harming the EU economy while 58 per cent of people say member states should be allowed to delay meeting their EU climate change targets in order to tackle the energy crisis.

    The findings are part of a Red C/European Movement Ireland opinion poll, which reflects the growing impact of Russia’s invasion of Ukraine on Irish attitudes to Europe, defence spending and enlargement. 

    As reported by RTÉ, the survey, entitled Ireland and the EU, was carried out over two periods in March and August this year, using a representative sample of 1,001 people over the age of 18 across the country.

    Of those surveyed, 86 per cent believe the cost-of-living crisis is harming the EU economy while 7 per cent disagree. A total of 58 per cent of people agreed that member states should be allowed to delay meeting EU environmental targets in order to deal with the current energy crisis, with 28 per cent opposed.




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,630 ✭✭✭ps200306


    In the same Biz Post briefing, the IDA states the obvious:

    IDA issues warning over Ireland’s ‘expensive and high-risk’ energy system

    Ireland’s energy system is “increasingly viewed as expensive, unpredictable and relatively high risk”, IDA Ireland has warned.

    The inward investment agency made the claim in a hard-hitting submission to the energy regulator, in which it said “unprecedented” plans to introduce €100 million in emergency tariffs on certain large businesses would also undermine Ireland’s cost-competitiveness and damage the country’s reputation for foreign direct investment.

    In a submission to the Commission for the Regulation of Utilities (CRU), the IDA also warned that international investors would be “cautious” about investing in a country with such energy issues. It said the plans by the CRU to introduce the new emergency tariffs would make a bad situation worse and it also argued the move would be “unfairly and disproportionately” targeted at a “relatively small group of very significant companies” that make a large contribution to the exchequer.

    As reported by the Business Post, the letter from the IDA, led by chief executive Martin Shanahan, was sent in response to proposals put forward by the CRU earlier this month in a bid to tackle the emerging power supply crisis in the country. The CRU wants to raise €100 million in additional charges from about 2,000 energy-intensive firms in the form of peak demand tariffs, high block tariffs and extremely high system alert tariffs.

    “The [CRU’s] proposals are very significant and potentially damaging to Ireland’s reputation as a location for energy-intensive investment. There is a clear sense in which a small group of strategically important international companies are being targeted in response to the jurisdiction’s failure to adequately match electricity supply with demand,” the IDA wrote.




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