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Tree choosing advice, please

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  • Registered Users Posts: 562 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    That's great, thanks for sharing! All of the leaves on it are green at the moment so I'm happy we will catch its full autumn showing this year (we just missed the flowers on the prunus in its first year, and its third year - this year - the wind knocked off most of the buds). Do you know how tall yours would be now?



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,429 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    I think its about 5 to 6ft, quite bushy. If I remember I will take a pic tomorrow.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    LIquidamber like many Eastern N. American trees is not particularly strong in our Irish winds and often suffers from branch break. I've seen Liriodendron in the US lose huge boughs in 40mph winds.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,429 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    This is the sweet gum/liquidamber I mentioned. It was planted as a whip in about February 2020 and promptly lost its top/leader. There is a main stem in there and I am hoping it will send up a new leader in due course.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,722 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


    I used to have boss (horticultural) who made a habit of cutting some trees like that quite hard every year. The effect was very good and it was often hard to guess what the very large shrubs he had were. Norway maple for example hard pruned each year gives a very interesting display of winged seeds that you wouldn't normally notice.

    Wake me up when it's all over.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 28,429 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    A lot of the now mature trees in the garden were topped I think when they were young as most of the trees have a low division in the trunk. The problem is that they are now weak at that point, one very large sweet chestnut on top of a bank very close to the house has a divided trunk and now has a hole developing for rot to form in the v of the trunk. I must get round to filling it with mastic or something as water runs into it. I think I have seen expanding foam recommended, any suggestions would be welcome. The tree is showing no signs of splitting so far. Would a wood glue and sawdust mix work?





  • I kept a Japanese Maple in a large pot in my small north facing front garden (when living in a house) and it did very nicely there for years.



  • Registered Users Posts: 562 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    Wow @looksee! Yours has grown really well. Here is the one I planted




  • Registered Users Posts: 28,429 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    It looks like a nice tree. I think once it is established - next early summer maybe - I would gradually take off some of the lower branches and make it be a tree.



  • Registered Users Posts: 562 ✭✭✭DylanQuestion


    Yup! That's the plan. They originally went the whole way to the base, but I cut up to around 10 inches off the floor. I just want to maximise the red colour this autumn since it is so small so left a lot on, but will do some pruning next year to make it a tree. There is a lot of new growth on it that I hope explode next summer :)



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,102 ✭✭✭10-10-20


    I wouldn't use wood-glue and saw-dust - it might be porous or retain moisture. Expanding foam... mmm... it's polyurethane so might bond well to the bark, but some of it isn't UV stabilised and tends to go brown and weaken, so look for stuff which is for outdoor use.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,722 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


    As an ex tree surgeon I can tell you doing anything is a waste of time (cosmetic at best) and often makes the problem worse in the long term.

    Wake me up when it's all over.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,429 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    Thanks for the replies, I will take this discussion to a new topic though as I have taken the thread off topic.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,429 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    Meanwhile an object lesson in not paying enough attention to what you are planting. The tree in the pic below was planted as a bare root 4-5ft sapling in spring 2020. The wall in the pic is 5ft high, I propped a 14ft + pole into the tree to demonstrate how much it has grown in two seasons. Its a Robinia pseudoacacia - Black Locust.

    I had one in a previous garden and it only grew to a large shrub size, about 2 or 3 m tall. Anyway this one evidently likes the situation and is already at 4m high and wide after 2 seasons, it can get to 40ft / 12m, and about 9m across, Sadly far too big for that situation, much too close to the wall and to the house next door, I have already taken off two large branches that were heading over the wall. Also it is toxic, all parts of the tree are poisonous and it has vicious thorns which are also toxic. So it will have to be cut down. It was hardly a big investment at €7 but it has lovely flowers and attractive leaves, it will have to be removed now before it gets too big to manage.




  • Registered Users Posts: 6,722 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


    My seed grown one took about 6-7 years to get to 5ft then died :-( It was in the open in spot where it could have grown to 50ft. At least I didn't have to deal with the expected suckers when it died. If you cut yours down bare that in mind.

    If they get big they make good burning wood (estate in UK I worked on had some big ones come down) and it can be a nice hard well figured wood for wood turning - also superb wood for furniture + floors.

    Wake me up when it's all over.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,429 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    That's interesting, the one I grew in the previous garden that didn't get big was grown from seed.



  • Registered Users Posts: 797 ✭✭✭bored_newbie


    But apart from it being

    • far too big
    • much too close to the wall
    • much too close to the house next door
    • toxic
    • all parts of the tree being poisonous and
    • the vicious thorns which are also toxic

    ….apart from that, would you say it was a good choice? 😀



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,722 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


    Great trees to plant on reclaimed land, root system holds the ground together and any vandalism normally results in new trees suckering up from the old roots + good timber and looks nice.

    Wake me up when it's all over.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,102 ✭✭✭10-10-20


    😁 I'd love to know what benefits the label portrayed at the point of sale. "Awarded an ASBO by the horticultural society"



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,429 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    That made me laugh!

    I get what you are saying 😀, but in fact it is a very handsome tree with racemes of creamy white flowers in spring, good foliage and good autumn colour. Really the only problem was me putting it in the wrong place. There are lots of toxic plants in gardens and we manage to survive them, but hanging over a wall into a garden where there are young children playing is not a desirable situation, quite apart from the potential size. If I had planted it elsewhere in the garden I would have left it.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,722 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


     quite apart from the potential size.

    I've had them to 60 ft those would have been big specimens and I've no idea how old they were. Trunks weren't that thick maybe a around a foot.

    Wake me up when it's all over.



  • Registered Users Posts: 797 ✭✭✭bored_newbie


    I made a mistake when planting a magnolia tree.

    It is only small but I planted a weigela about a metre away from it and a climbing rose about half a metre away.

    I realise now those are too close for comfort and the recommendation is to give them lots of space.

    Any thoughts? Will I get away with it if I keep the rose pruned away from the tree?



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,429 ✭✭✭✭looksee


    Move the weigela and the rose, both will be more accepting of being moved than the magnolia. Dig them up with maximum soil and rootball (though the rose will really not mind being moved with or without soil) and drop into their new places immediately, firm in and cover with a good layer of woodchip or similar mulch.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,722 ✭✭✭The Continental Op


    You sometimes have to accept the lose of one plant as another grows.

    I always suggest planting specimen plants that you will keep like you magnolia at good spacing so they will hardly if at all interfere with each other. Then you can infill with cheaper possibly faster growing plants that are "expendable".

    Wake me up when it's all over.



  • Registered Users Posts: 797 ✭✭✭bored_newbie


    Thanks for the replies. The climbing rose is one of a dozen I grew from cutting so I’d class it as expendable. When planting, I think I was relying on the rose to give the colour for the next few years as I read it can take the magnolia a while to get going with flowering.

    Likewise the weigela is from cutting and I have others. If leaving them doesn’t negatively affect the magnolia I might just leave them. The ground was so difficult that I really don’t want to dig them up.



  • Registered Users Posts: 193 ✭✭galaxy12


    Amalancier wil be good choice and may be easy to control at least initially.you may be able to get a semi mature amalancier at this time of the year in curragh or in tullys at a decent price.

    An orange variety which you are after may be dogwood or cornus alba .

    Another option would be rhus typhina which are stunning multistema with orange leaves in autumn but it's a suckering tree so may be difficult to control depending on the space in the front .



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,180 ✭✭✭Kaybaykwah


    Yes, I love rhus typhina, the vinegar tree. It is native to my part of the world. I snatched some near a railway ditch years ago and replanted in my backyard, near a patio, which made a superb sunshade. It is highly invasive though, as you say. It will grow far from the original planting.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Leave the branches for up to 5 years. They help the stem to thicken. You can prune after that.



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