Retention of Lean-to garage

Joe_mccffrty · 27-09-2022 1:27pm #1

Hi all,

I've just built a 22m square lean-to garage to the side of my semi detached house (end of terrace). Having read the guidelines on the citizens advice website I believed didn't require planning permission to add a garage to the side as long as I complied with simple rules, ie not forward of the front of the house etc. But its clear now that I do.

My questions are, what are likely reasons for refusing retention of the garage? Emergency services access...?

And what can I do ahead of contacting the local authority to request retention?

Thanks in advance.

Mellor · 27-09-2022 1:44pm

Why is it now clear that you needed permission? There are regulations to follow, you is it possible to do as you say.

Nothing in your post stricts me as an issue.

See Class three below, condense to relevant parts.

CLASS 3

The construction...within the curtilage of a house of any...garage...or other similar structure.

1. No such structure shall be constructed...forward of the front wall of a house.

2. The total area of such structures...shall not, taken together with any other such structures previously constructed...exceed 25 square metres.

3. The construction...shall not reduce the amount of private open space...to the rear or to the side of the house to less than 25 square metres.

4. The external finishes of any garage...to the side of a house, and the roof covering where any such structure has a tiled or slated roof, shall conform with those of the house.

5. The height of any such structure shall not exceed, in the case of a building with a tiled or slated pitched roof, 4 metres or, in any other case, 3 metres.

6. The structure shall not be used for human habitation or for the keeping of pigs, poultry, pigeons, ponies or horses, or for any other purpose other than a purpose incidental to the enjoyment of the house as such.

Full text here https://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2001/si/600/made/en/print#sched2

Joe_mccffrty · 27-09-2022 1:55pm

Hi Mellor,

Yes, those are the rules that I have based my garage on. However, local authorities can set their own rules in terms of what is allowed as I understandit. I contacted them with a simple query the aesthetic but before we got too far into that conversation I was told that a garage to the side of a semi detached NEEDS planning permission, no exceptions.

muffler · 27-09-2022 2:07pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119671073#Comment_119671073

Still vague. Garages to the side of houses are exempt subject to certain conditions so how or why someone in planning told you the opposite is beyond me. Was there a planning condition attached to the permission for the house that would restrict exempted development?

Joe_mccffrty · 27-09-2022 2:21pm

Very vague. I'm not sure how local authorities can interpret it any different. Class 1 rule about 2m from any boundary, would that apply in this case?

muffler · 27-09-2022 3:07pm

Where did class 1 come into it? Are you talking about the distance from wall or windows to the boundary?

Also would you mind answering my previous question. Thanks.

Joe_mccffrty · 27-09-2022 3:18pm

Apologies, nothing attached. I wouldn't have thought that any class 1 rule would apply.

I've just contacted an architect, they said they are too busy to assist me but I would need planning permission.

That's all they've said. I'll try to find out that exactly is the issue.

Padre_Pio · 27-09-2022 3:20pm

Planning permission on what grounds exactly?

Seems you contacted the council and architect. Neither has told you why exactly you need planning.

Joe_mccffrty · 27-09-2022 4:10pm

Hi Padre,

They said I need to planning permission without saying what the issue is. They said send in the forms and they'll review.

I don't want to prod the planning office too much until I know how I could possibly be in breach.

Do local authorities have additional powers to refuse a development that complies with class 3 rules?

I'd like to understand possible grounds for refusal before I contact them again in case it leads to some sort of enforcement action.

Joe_mccffrty · 27-09-2022 4:15pm

The garage is up to the side boundary of my property BTW. The other side is a very small wooded green owned by the council. Beyond that is a side road.

None of this formed part of my conversation with the planning office.

Mellor · 28-09-2022 12:55pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119671073#Comment_119671073

Those are not just rules. They are the law. Local authorities can apply conditions to planning approvals to limit those exemptions, as they have they legal power. However that cannot just make up their own rules or choose to ignore the law. They simply do not have that power.

Class 1 does not apply. It is not an extension. It is class 3. Based on what you've said it is exempt. Their could be a aspect that breaches the requirements of class 3, however both the architect and the council should have been able to point to that breach in order to claim it required planning permission.

Best course of action would be to lodge a section 5 enquiry;

In accordance with Section 5 of the Planning and Development Act 2000 as amended any person may request a declaration as to whether development is exempt. An application should be made in writing to the planning authority, to determine whether a proposal requires permission or is considered exempted development.

https://www.dublincity.ie/residential/planning/planning-applications/find-planning-application/exempt-development/exempted-development-section-5#:~:text=In%20accordance%20with%20Section%205,or%20is%20considered%20exempted%20development.

muffler · 28-09-2022 1:51pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119671839#Comment_119671839

So you checked the exempted development criteria and built accordingly but why did you contact the council afterwards?

This is all very strange and I suspect we aren't getting the full story here.

Mellor · 28-09-2022 3:05pm

What is the external finish of the garage, and of the house?

Gumbo · 29-09-2022 10:49pm

Show us a picture.

Retention of Lean-to garage

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