Retrofitting

If it is anything like the old warmer homes scheme that SEAI managed, it'll just be lining the pockets of the approved contractors.

These grants don't cover direct labour work, it has to be approved contractors. So they will just put up their prices in tune with the grant and it ends up costing the homeowner the same money, grant or no grant. Plus they have to have the largely meaningless BER surveys done before and after.

Listened to Eamon Ryan going on about 'special 'home loans to help people fund the balance if a retrofit.

My first thought was people are already to the pin of their collars paying rising costs of everything without an additional homeloan.

Then Eco Eye was discussing the same issue albeit a programme dated about a year ago. A home energy consultant was talking about a home owner of a 3 bed semi with a mortgage outstanding of 200 k(!) and energy bills monthly of 173 per month getting a retrofit of 35 k with a grant of 35% of this and taking out a green mortgage top up to cover the cost of the balance . By her reckoning with energy bills cut in half the homeowner now has repayments which are only 1 euro more expensive .... ! Cue presenter saying " wow, and they live in a much warmer , more energy efficient home for only 1 Euro a month!

The completely inadequate assumptions and glaring unreality of this scenario for most people at this present time struck me and all I could think is how much some of these energy experts or consultants stand to gain by the governments announcements over the last couple of days. And the only other people who will gain are those who were about to take the plunge and have been waiting for this announcement ..more power to them if they have the money ready to go and at least some will benefit .

But for many others mortgages vary , energy bills are usually higher or those that need to do more can afford a major retrofit less .

Also as pointed out previously costs of work and labour have gone up so much that even though the grants have gone up now to 50% most people will find the work has gone up so much it is still unaffordable .

I think it is a good thing that people are being incentivised to upgrade to more efficient homes but there needs to be more realism about how people will be able to afford to access these grants without taking on more debt .

It would be good if the cost of green mortgages or top up loans were made and kept affordable so that people who are in the less- well -off- with - families - to- look- after bracket could afford to get essential work done and genuinely keep costs down.

Just looking at the SEAI website.

Does it look like the latest scheme has moved from a grant system of “up to 35%” to one where the grant is a nominal capped sum for items.

so EWI grant is capped at €6K for a semi-d and so on.

I know it’s more nuanced than that but it appears the % basis is gone.

The gov wants 500,000 homes done by 2030. The pace of tis work would need to increase to increase to 75,000 per year. We did 5000 last year according to the media. How many a year do you all consider is feasible per a year with current workforce?

I still dont really see how they want this to work, other than the one-stop-shop idea, but I dont understand how that fits into a larger plan you might have if you are renovating your house or putting on an extension. Does the one-stop-shop guy also have to do this work or would they be a sub-contractor for your main builder?

It should be open to any builder and the work should be checked and certified by some sort of building control process, like the rest of the world. (with accountability if something thats signed off turns out to be defective/inadequate)

This is Ireland, building control sign off on nothing.

I think it will cost a fair chunk of change grant or no grant. I personally do not want to take more debt. It wasn't too long ago houses were being repossessed in this country because people couldn't pay. It will always be warmer in your own home no matter the BER rating than on the street.

I wonder should they be driving air to air instead of air to water for retrofitting. They could speed through huge amounts of houses much cheaper that way.

@GreeBo

You asked "Does the one-stop-shop guy also have to do this work or would they be a sub-contractor for your main builder?"

What I'm saying is no they don't have to do that. They don't have to do any work unrelated to the SEAI grant. In fact, as far as I can see, they don't have to do any actual work at all apart from collating multiple grant applications into a combined package and submitting all the forms and data. You can choose your own contractors if you like and agree prices with them. But the one stop shop will still get their fee.

If you find a builder who employs contractors who are registered with SEAI who can do this work then you might be able to achieve the efficiencies you mention.

I think we are at cross purposes :) I know the SEAI guy doesnt have to do anything else.

I'm getting major renovations done part of which will be insulation/heatpump/airtightness/windows etc etc

I dont want the one-stop-shop guy to be also doing my extension but I cant have my main contractor doing the thermal stuff as they (most likely) wont be SEAI registered. That leaves all the people like me having to probably pay two separate contractors and makes a mess of a job, with each side blaming each other for stuff.

The Green Party approach seems to be only targeting people who are just getting the grant work done in isolation.

/edit

If you are saying that the one-stop-shop can just be a middle man who does no actual work, then I'm even more confused as to what the point of them is, other than to raise prices for the consumer! :(

Why do you think that would be faster? Putting ducting to every room wont be any faster than replacing a boiler with a heat pump?

Or are you thinking about some other aspect?

Hi Phirstclass,

Can you send a link to that, i checked the SEAI website yesterday perhaps it wasn't updated.

Cheers, Don't have facebook but i'll go back to my supplier.

I ordered new windows and doors before xmas... they are to be delivered and installed in the next week or two.. Do I have any options with the grant? I'm not planning on doing the one stop shop

unless you undertake other improvement measures along with the windows and doors you won't qualify

They're fixed. If you've a detached 50sqm house then the grant will go a hell of a long way. Massive advantage for you. I've a large awkward shaped detached and when I got the external insulation done previously the grant paid one sixth of the cost.

Thanks. I was thinking it would go a long way on a small bungalow like this. But could it also be a case that the one stop shops thinks that too and says let's inflate the prices further, sure he's getting a great deal!

I'll be adding an extension at the same time. My cavity is pumped with loose white bead, so I'd imagine external is probably a good idea?

I wonder what the best approach would be with the extension, external also, or a different approach?

Also I only have an open fire and storage heaters at present. I'm thinking heat pump with underfloor (digging up floors and insulating) might be the best approach?

Yeah suspect that will be the case in many instances.

What style/size house. What measures does that include?

Might be better to go with the individual grants and look after the other aspects yourself instead of a one stop shop?

The 50% was pure spin. They moved away from a % grant so that they could control the cost.

Hi, looking to replace all windows/doors in house with triple glazing. Can anyone recommend a decent company (PM me please)? Was looking at a southern province company, but seems to be quite a few negay reviews.

From what I understand you contact a One Stop Shop, pay them to do an assessment and the present you with a list of improvements to get to B2 along with (estimated?) costs and you have to do all of the recommended steps to get the grant.

Obviously there would be various ways of getting from say a C3 to a B3 (e.g. new windows + Solar PV + Heat Pump vs. Heating Controls + EWI + attic insulation (just making these up as examples)). Anyone know, based on existing retrofitting scheme, whether the home owners can influence the list of recommended upgrades. So that if you want to get new windows anyway say, they get included?