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Civil Service - Post Lockdown - Blended Working?

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,085 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    It depends on the section/division. Borders, customs, etc., are hands on so fully rostered on site (but I don't think they recruit from the open panels, anyway).

    I'll post up a new survey at the weekend to try and get a comprehensive read available for everyone on what departments/offices/local authorities are doing. I think the official blended working trial should be kicking in for most departments from 1st October.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 555 ✭✭✭laoisgem




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,069 ✭✭✭nhg


    The portal for applying for blended in Revenue opened at beginning of September…

    Blended due to start next Monday but no communication about it, could see it being on put back again…

    Our Dept was originally to be 1 day per month but will now be 1 day per week in the office



  • Registered Users Posts: 766 ✭✭✭Foggy Jew


    We in Ag had to sign up to a blended working charter. We, in our small unit, have committed to working in the office every Tuesday & Thursday and wfh the other 3 days. We are only allowed to work up flexi-leave on Tuesday & Thursdays. We still need to clock in & out whilst working from home, but as we can’t make up time, every single team member clocks in at 8.00, half hour lunch, and is gone at 4.00. PQ’s, Press Queries, Leaders Questions - all the urgent stuff -has to wait, or be done by the AP. I cant see this being allowed to continue, but my view is we are either on Flexi-time or we’re not.

    It's the bally ballyness of it that makes it all seem so bally bally.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 259 ✭✭maneno


    Out of interest, are you not able to do the PQs etc between 8-4? Or do you have to have flexi for that to happen ?



  • Registered Users Posts: 330 ✭✭rostalof


    I think what was meant is, if any of those issues arise at 4 or after, they have to wait until the next morning or if they're extremely urgent and need to be dealt with immediately, an AP, who isn't on the clock will have to deal with them.

    My question to the original poster is this, why are you working 8 to 4 and taking a half hour break. That's a 7hr 30min day? Either take an hour break or start at 8.30. The working day was reduced to 7hrs at the beginning of July.



  • Registered Users Posts: 97 ✭✭Ahshurlookit


    Very short sighted, if the AP gets sick of this nonsense and decides flexi time isn't working for business needs and makes you all work until 5.30 every evening there will be plenty of time to crack on with PQs and press queries while those who are prepared to be flexible when required are out the gap 90 minutes before you most days.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    That flexi pattern was one of the trial patterns put forward by DPER. Remember, this is still a trial period for flexi across all departments.

    Your department's policy is not set in stone yet, so I wouldn't be too inflexible or uncooperative during the trial period.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,576 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    @maneno Why should anyone be made to work later if they're not getting paid and not going to get time off in lieu for that work?

    If shortsighted management policies are causing problems, then those policies need to be changed.

    @Foggy Jew

    How does the flexi system permit you to clock in and out on wfh days without affecting the balance?

    If you worked less than 7 hours on a wfh day would it reduce your balance?

    Why is everyone doing themselves out of 30 mins a day? 0800-1600 with only a half hour lunch is 7:30.

    Scrap the cap!



  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 18,693 Mod ✭✭✭✭Kimbot


    its 7:30 with 30 mins banked to your flexi time. And in some cases there are Civil Servants still working 39 hours per week as their hours werent reduced with the rest.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,576 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    OP said that they are not allowed to accumulate flexitime on wfh days.

    Which civil servants? It's reasonable to assume the OP is a general service grade unless they say otherwise.

    Scrap the cap!



  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 18,693 Mod ✭✭✭✭Kimbot


    Sorry didnt see the WFH part :D


    I know the prison admin grades (CO/EO/HEO) are still contracted to 39 hours as the grade came in after the increase in hours therefore they cant reduce hours.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,085 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    I'd argue the opposite? The time to set out the consequences of a regressive, rigid policy to senior management is surely right now, in the trial period. Compromise and precedent now will bite staff in the ass in the longer term. Admittedly, though, this will be somewhat dependent on the AP and PO too, I'd say.

    * "So the no-flexi-on-WFH-days isn't working out - bizarrely, people won't work past their 7 hours for free. This is effecting PQ response times, etc. We therefore need to make everyone work set hours where their 7 hours a day keeps them there until later in the evening, 9:15 to 13:00 and 14:15 to 17:30"

    versus

    * "So the no-flexi-on-WFH-days isn't working out - bizarrely, people won't work past their 7 hours for free. This is effecting PQ response times, etc. We therefore need to let people work up their flexi on WFH days, too - if they can work up until 7pm and get credit for it, and don't have to commute home after, either, then we get flexibility from them. They'll happily work late when needed, say when we're on oral PQs - and I won't have to work until 11pm again!"



  • Registered Users Posts: 22 is that a button




  • Registered Users Posts: 61 ✭✭D n G


    Some of Revenue are to be in the office 1 day a week from Monday. It was originally mooted as 1 day a month but someone higher up the chain didn't like that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 180 ✭✭andydurnin


    Hi. Anyone know if there is any WFH / Blended working in any department in the Drogheda Area ?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5 LouLousharoo


    Hi! Long time lurker, first time poster. Our dept are looking for a minimum of 2 days in the office. Flexi is in a trial, we are only allowed to work up flexi hours on days in the office. A new clockwise system was installed in September that separates out wfh hours and flexi hours.



  • Moderators, Regional Abroad Moderators Posts: 2,291 Mod ✭✭✭✭Nigel Fairservice


    I think the overarching WFH guidelines for all departments state one day per week?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 408 ✭✭skidmarkoner


    I think this blended working is turning quickly into a tool that will actually demotivate people who work in the civil service. That the adding of hot desks it's gonna be a **** show.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,680 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    Why?

    It should be personal choice and a privilege that can be withdrawn if abused.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,023 ✭✭✭adelcrowsmel


    The threat of it being withdrawn is already being thrown about in our department if we don't do this, that or the other and we are only a few weeks into our blended contracts. It's going to be used as a stick to beat people with!



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    yeah the majority of depts and people ive spoken to seem to be implementing it reasonably well and people are quite satisfied?


    im as surprised as anyone about that, if im honest.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,680 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,312 ✭✭✭Ninthlife


    Revenue Audit & Compliance is 2 days office based with one of those days being an 'anchor' day agreed by each section. 3 days WFH. This is all subject to business needs.



  • Registered Users Posts: 288 ✭✭BhoyRayzor


    As someone who hasn't had the time to read it in full is that specifically stated or just given as an example? I have heard of cases of 2 or 3 days a month being applied for and approved.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 288 ✭✭BhoyRayzor


    Not everywhere. Maybe just for new staff to facilitate training and onboarding.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,312 ✭✭✭Ninthlife


    I should have maybe been more specific in that my Division, audit are required back 2 days per week regardless of being new or old staff and again its dependent on business needs



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,085 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    I finally got around to it - but as 1st October seems to be a kick-off date for official Blended Working for some departments, maybe better that I was lazy 😀

    The link to the new survey is https://forms.gle/55tQJ3FcP68Zn2KA7

    For those who hadn't come across it before (I also ran a survey in June) this basically collects some data on what each government department and some of the bigger agencies are doing around Blended Working. The framework came out on 31st March, so most places should have their own policy in place by now.

    No personal info is collected, don't include any identifying info in answers, please. The last question is free-form text and I'll post up some of the interesting responses here unless asked not to. Or they're defamatory. 🤣



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,085 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    87 responses to date. I'll leave it open until the weekend and post results here.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18 WonderWall78


    Does anyone know what they mean on the blended working guidebook about not being allowed to work outside of the state except in circumstances where someone resides in Northern Ireland? If I were to move to Northern Ireland or even just go up that way for a few days and work in a family members house would that be ok?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,023 ✭✭✭adelcrowsmel


    If it's just for a few days would you not just let your manager know that you'll be working from another location for the few days and once they know then you are covered? If it's a long term thing and you are going to move then you'd have to look into it officially. I imagine there are alot of people who live across the border and work in the civil service in towns near like Dundalk etc and they had to be covered in the document/policy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18 WonderWall78


    True I probably should let them know. Not sure I’d move there but who knows with property prices and rent prices it might make sense to. Thank you for the reply.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,680 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    You might want to check the IT policy. Many places geo lock any access from out side the state except though secure channels like the organizations own VPN.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18 WonderWall78


    That is mainly what I was concerned about and also being tracked. Not sure where I would find the IT policy, but I’ll try looking for it. Thank you.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,680 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    Could you not just ask IT.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,576 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    They should be doing that (VPN) for all access from outside their own network whether from within the state or not. Assuming bad actors won't appear to be using an Irish IP is just stupid tbh.

    Scrap the cap!



  • Registered Users Posts: 18 WonderWall78




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,680 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    There may not be that limitation for customers (users) only staff. They might provide services for people outside the state.

    Depending on your role you might need a VPN or you might not.

    No idea what the op role or the systems they use. But it's something someone should check if they are planning to work outside the state.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18 WonderWall78


    I guess maybe I’ll find out someday, I wouldn’t work outside of the island of Ireland but I guess it’s the same difference really as Northern Ireland is a different jurisdiction, my main worry was setting off a trigger warning by logging in through a Northern Ireland internet connection but probably wouldn’t be worth it just for the sake of three days. Don’t fancy losing my job.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5 LouLousharoo


    Just got a FAQ doc. Any hours built up from WFH will be wiped when it goes into the next flexi period. I have 4 hours built up because it is a busy time of year so they are going to vanish and it's 4 hours down the drain. Where the heck is our union on this



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  • Registered Users Posts: 18 WonderWall78


    Is that just your department? As I’ve got 5 hours built up, don’t fancy losing them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,085 ✭✭✭TaurenDruid


    Your employer's ICT policy will be on their intranet and you probably have a hard copy you signed on your first day there. There's every possibility it doesn't mention remote access at all if it's not been updated since 2020. Why wouldn't you just mail your ICT unit or HR unit (depending on who issues your usage policy), and ask them if you can connect remotely from NI for 3 days? It's not like civil servants don't bring laptops to Brussels or Strasbourg.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,023 ✭✭✭adelcrowsmel


    We reverted back to what time was on your clock pre covid...so some lost and some gained!



  • Registered Users Posts: 5 LouLousharoo


    Not sure if it is civil service wide, but it covers my whole organisation as it came from central HR. Could be different in other departments depending on what kind of flexi trial they are doing



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,680 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    That's quite a common Flexi time condition, so people don't build up massive hours then all take them at the same busy time. Surprised CS didn't have this before.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,311 ✭✭✭✭Dodge


    There’s plenty of people in border areas that might live in NI, but work in ROI (office based). So it sounds like the policy specifically mentioning NI is to ensure those people aren’t excluded

    Realistically no one is checking to see where someone is for a ‘few days’



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,680 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    Usually find out when they contact IT because they can't connect.



  • Registered Users Posts: 861 ✭✭✭crinkley


    I have worked from NI for short periods with zero problems, and I’m sure there are many more. I took the policy as you can’t be out in an apartment in Spain for 6 months “working from home”



  • Registered Users Posts: 5 LouLousharoo


    The WFH hours are separate from flexi. With flexi 10:30 can be carried forward into the next flexi period. Going by this FAQ doc any WFH hours in surplus, be it 1 hour or 10 hours will revert to 0 once we go into the next flexi period. If someone ends up working extra hours and is unable to take them within that flexi period they vanish. Over the year this would be quite alot of hours. The flexi system allows for the 10: 30 to carry over until they are used up.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 861 ✭✭✭crinkley


    I should also add people in my team have used their work laptops in America, Asia and across Europe. The only issue may be with the Wi-Fi available requiring a sign in page and the vpn set up doesn’t like that



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