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Budget 2023

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  • Registered Users Posts: 18,520 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    There is a huge difference between delivery of static services and medical delivery. Doctors are expensive to train and are expensive to pay. We already have an A&E charge to encourage people to go to a doctor first if it's appropriate.

    People on medical card or free GP are 3-4 times more likely to visit a doctor than a person paying for the service.

    Slava Ukrainii



  • Registered Users Posts: 24,026 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    A friend of mine is a GP and partner in a large practice in West Dublin and I'm quoting him directly.

    Wait time for a surgery appointment in their practice is gone from 24 hours to 3 or 4 days. Thats with the same number of Doctors and a closed patient list. Ask yourself what the variable is?



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,913 ✭✭✭Danno


    That's a grand road for cycling that you showed. If you're finding it difficult to share the road with other legal road users, maybe you need some extra driving lessons or something.

    Okay, you're either on a wind-up/pisstake or you're a few cans short of a six-pack...

    You're suggesting OAPs can get up on an electric bike and travel between Mountmellick and Portlaoise along the N80, safely!!!

    They'd be safer using the inside of the yellow line along the M50.





  • I’m familiar with traffic but the fact remains also that you can plan with reasonable accuracy a road route and leave at the most consistent time that ensures punctual arrival.

    this is the benefit of your own private car or other transport. Public Transport, as I said & is hardly a secret is very unreliable in Ireland & in my aforementioned years of experience using public transport I’ve only seen inconsistencies in arrival and departure times and very scarcely adhering to the schedule.

    if you’re seriously trying to suggest that commuting to work privately would be on par or even below public transport in terms of reliability in arriving to your chosen destination on time.

    There’s resources available to any car or whatever it is owner that can give them a heads up about any obstructions or delays on their usual route to [destination] and therefore an opportunity to take an alternative, albeit perhaps slightly slower route, but still save time over driving down the dual carriageway that just had an RTC.

    Fair enough you want to basically simp for Public Transport, but the fact remains it is not reliable when compared to public transport. Which, by the way, seeing as it runs very late in almost all cases I can think of (from my own exp YMMW), wouldn’t even then more late as a result of your scenarios of traffic delays and diversions. So either way you still benefit from the private vehicle.

    The thing is I absolutely agree that we should try and use public transport more for our journeys when possible, my grandparents in fact use it to travel to town for shopping rather than take the car. But if they have an appointment or need to be here or there by X and not Y, they’ll take the car.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,781 ✭✭✭mohawk


    It’s not just parents taking the under 6’s to the GP especially working parents aren’t going bringing kids to GP for a sniffle. There are other factors at play too population is ageing and it’s no secret older people have more health problems. Then there is the shambles of the waiting lists where thousands are waiting for procedures and are going to need ongoing care from GP’s to help manage symptoms or pain while they are waiting for the procedure.

    It’s probably not the best time to give out more GP cards at the moment because the resources aren’t there for it. I imagine that there are many that put off GP visits purely because they can’t afford to go. I will admit to being a GP time waster in past by going to GP with a virus purely because I needed a sick note for work to get paid.



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  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Choose? 17 years of government policy forcing people into commuter belt is NOT a choice



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,994 ✭✭✭c.p.w.g.w


    There price cap is a cap per unit, not total bill I thought



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    im not sure what public transport you're taking or how far back you're going but (for instance) i commute via train and reliability and punctuality are both excellent.


    bus eireann, generally also excellent on both.

    private coaches a little bit less reliable alright.

    dublin bus isnt something id use with a view to "i must be at my destination at 9 on the dot" or whatever, but then neither would driving be through the city.


    id question your slant on things tbh, that doesn't match my experience over the years in any way



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,913 ✭✭✭Danno


    Translation: Public services are great when you've got to get somewhere inside the M50 - but if there is a time on that, well tough luck. We got you there, but you're fifteen minutes late - so what. No wonder the country is so dependent on private cars when that is their attitude.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    if i thought my posts needed translating, rest assured id ask someone with better ability in it than youve demonstrated here



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  • Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭Moragle


    No his friend isn't. I'm in the same boat, after tax my hours work out at approx 240 per day. If I do an extra day the wages are not much over 100. I'd prefer to take it in lieu and get holidays than pay more tax



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    Why would you work extra hours for half your normal rate? My previous place of employment, most people woulnt take additional hours, losing an insane amount, over a pittance, makes no sense. This is rampant! Before you say, you should have paid more BS, while knowing nothing about the business, paying E40-50 an hour, was very generous. The amount of people on this thread, with not a bulls notion of what is actually going on, is laughable. Hitting low income with extreme rate of taxation that is the higher level of income tax, is total lunacy. FFG talking about SF potential damage to the economy is laughable, given they have presided over this lunacy for decades!



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    of course they are! one group get absolutely hammered here, so a huge cohort dont have to pay their fair share or get way more benefits than they would in any other country, the OAP and welfare brigade! Met up with a group of mates, most of whom I had not seen in years yesterday, of course the government and budget come up, like me, they are sick of having a choice between left wing and more left wing. 50% of your income thieved off over a pittance to pay for JSA and JSB increases at a time of full employment? LOL! They had 11 billion to send up in smoke this budget, they can easily afford to abolish USC! FFG are addicted to insane spending, like addicts! How about starting to get value for money for the taxpayer? Yeah right!



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,520 ✭✭✭✭Bass Reeves


    Not really it was a second job his friend had. Probably 15-20/ hour and Saturday/ evening work. If half goes on tax and you also have work expenses ( travel clothes etc) then you are often working for less than 10/ hour.

    Friend worked as an enumerator for the census. He is semi retired so be had some tax allowance. However he said there was working people doing it. He is a fairly efficient worker but he calculated he was working for 10-11 euro/ hour. He taught there was some people these that ended up doing it for 4-5/ hour take home.

    He said he will not do it again and he thinks the census will have an issue recruiting next time. They had a huge amount of first time workers this time

    The high rate is grand if you are doing OT in structured employment and with structured OT rates. But it's a cruifier if you get a 500-1kk bonus at Christmas and only get half of it or you work 4-6 hours OT a week at time and quarter as well as time and half and you end up working for 10-11/ hour when your normal rate is 14-15/ hour take home.

    Even retirees on Lowe wages who qualify for the OAP are reluctant to work more than 2-3 days a week as tax crucify them

    Slava Ukrainii





  • So you’re in Dublin? i already said outside of major cities, it’s rubbish. I live in Wexford.

    the train is absolutely much better punctuality wise, but the buses on the number 2 bus route are shocking.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,488 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    I would much rather everyone, and I mean everyone, got charged about €20 to visit a doctor or a&e. In the UK GP surgeries are out the door with people presenting themselves with a short term cough or cold looking for anti biotics. In Ireland our a&e departments are full of junkies every night using their medical cards just to cause trouble. People need to think twice about using free services.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,488 ✭✭✭cgcsb


    We have toll roads for the most expensive type of roads, maintaining public spaces costs about 0.1% of what it costs to provide patient specific helathcare and medication



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,805 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    Would net €240 a day not be €385 gross a day (~100k a year)? And working another day €385 gross nets you only €100 (74% effective tax on the extra day instead of ~52%)



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,383 ✭✭✭✭Geuze


    Yes, a GP told me that people go to get a prescription for Calpol.

    I replied - sure it's available OTC.

    She said it's on the GMS / medical card list of reimbursable items.


    Such massive waste.

    The French system means people pay 30% of the fee.

    A GP in France charges 26, so the patient pays 7.50 approx.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 68,693 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Allow pharmacists to prescribe certain basic medicines. Solves that issue. GP unions were historically against that as it would also get rid of the quickest easiest private consultations





  • or one other one from when I used medical card, if I got a hospital script, I needed to make a doctors app to have it transferred to gms. Such a stupid waste of time for both of us. The pharmacist could do nothing about it & hospitals apparently don’t carry GMS scripts!



  • Registered Users Posts: 68,693 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Generally done by the receptionist and signed en masses with the repeat scripts, but it's still a waste of time for everyone involved. Could have been fixed at the stroke of a pen decades ago!







  • Registered Users Posts: 68,693 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    Most pharmacists will give you a 'loan' of the drugs. But that's not guaranteed and not required.

    They could make hospital scripts automatically qualify with a tiny legislative change, if it even needs legislation





  • There’s so many simple things they could change, that would have a big impact, but it’s like they’re afraid.

    Most likely, just too lazy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,111 ✭✭✭✭Goldengirl


    Yes, a waste of time.

    Pharmacists should be allowed assess people and prescribe simple treatments and antibiotics with appropriate instructions and to apply GMS /medical card reductions to those entitled. This would stop the line of people queing outside GPs looking for these prescriptions.

    Or people going to A&E for minor ailnents.



  • Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭Moragle


    Calpols not covered on the medical card it's non gms. And with hospital scripts, legally a pharmacy can dispense a weeks supply until the patient gets a gp prescription



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,939 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko




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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,975 ✭✭✭Deeec


    Dartdude is right though Andrew. I don't have a medical or gp card so I have to pay 65 euro every time I visit my gp - so I don't go unless I'm really really sick and I feel I really really need to see a GP. If it was free I would go alot more often.

    The fact is GPS are booked out with card holders with very little wrong with them because they don't have to pay. I see it even with my own parents who have a medical card - they go see the gp for very small issues that could be dealt with common sense and perhaps a visit to the pharmacy. A charge of even 10 euro per visit would make free gp users consider if they really need to visit their doctor.

    When something is free it's going to be exploited.



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