"Green" policies are destroying this country

We’ve been over this before.

The percentage risk would be much lower if we had an LNG terminal and gas storage but the CRU knows that, Eirgrid knows that, everyone knows that- bar you, your dear leader and the your little cohort on here.

But carry on.

@Mebuntu

Hardly surprising. They are essentially selling into a glut and buying from shortage.

Lets introduce massive sources of intermittent power into the European electricity grid, concurrent with a reluctance to produce own fossil fuels, an over reliance on cheap steady pipeline sourced natural gas from Russia in the case of the continent and Norway & UK in the case of Ireland, then refuse to consider nuclear, while simultaneously attacking baseload power, in parallel drive up the demand for electricity for heat exchangers, transport and commerce (data centers in particular)

The policies governing the grid in Ireland are such that the grid operators cannot guarantee availability of power and blackout conditions are the inevitable trajectory. How do you put a probability on political risk?

"If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to be a horrible warning."

Here is a discussion on the European energy crisis. Germanys Energiewende is going to be that horrible warning as they take down their domestic chemical industry, their production output depends on this and destroys the value of their enterprises.

I think we have a record for the number of straw men arguments anyone has fit into a single post

This really says it all ...

The poster knows right well that Ireland's emissions reductions efforts will save 0.0°C of warming. It won't stop any Greenland ice melting. None. When this is pointed out to him he switches to "we have to get off fossil fuels because ... reasons". How can you argue with this level of illogic? I'm starting to agree with the previous poster who said you can't have a reasoned argument with Greens because they're not coming from a place of reason. But maybe there's still value in exposing their dangerous obsessions before they wreck the economy beyond repair.

Because they are driven by ideology and not reason. You can't have a discussion with Greenies because they're driven by idealogy. Rational thinking, reasoning and logic goes out the window.

No.

They will be switched off or redirected by country which will need electricity without any regard to anyone at the end of the line.

If you think that if French for example will have to stop couple reactors and will be faced with shortages that they would keep sending power out then you need to have a look to find out what is happening in the real world like right now.

Not to mention that in current economic climate there is no way your dreamed super interconnectors will be built any time soon. EU would need schitt ton of gas coal and oil to get all of that copper and steel to build your dream.

I can't keep track, but are you one of the people who thinks Ireland can\should build a nuclear power plant?

Yes it does say it all. You want Ireland to become a free rider and screw future generations. I want us to act responsibly and live up to our commitments and responsibilities to future generations

I thought you climate change deniers were against hypocrisy? You love pointing it out every time a Hollywood actor takes a flight, but you collectively come on here to demand that Ireland engage in mass national hypocrisy

Or do you want us to get on board the denial train and pretend we're not acting because climate change isn't real?

It's, 506 pages and there's still no firm solution... so running a few (admittedly very rough numbers)...

As things stand:

• Between 8AM-8PM our demand is in excess of 5GW - 600k heatpumps will add up to 1GW onto this during winter as they run 24/7.
• Between 8PM-8AM our demand is in excess of 3GW - 1m EV's will add ~2.5GW onto this assuming average mileage, night time charging, plus another up to 1GW for heatpumps as they'll run through the night just as much as the day (if not moreso at night).

So we now go from a situation of having daytime peaks and night time troughs to an almost sustained 6.5GW demand on the grid, night and day, just under 2030 plans. There's no longer any "quiet" period to charge up batteries on cheap electricity or pump Turlough Hill on "spare" power anymore or produce hydrogen on any scale.

To continue towards 2050 and transition 100% to renewables we need storage...

Let's assume hydrogen storage is cracked and round trip efficiencies of about 30-40% seems to be most commonly reported (I've seen figures into the low teens and also seen figures much higher - the joys of no-one actually having done this at the scale required!).

This figure does NOT account for energy costs associated with water treatment (e.g. desalination) nor for the cost of treating by-products from the process nor the energy consumed in pumping fresh water into the plant and then transporting the produced hydrogen product to the point of use.

30-40% efficiency means for every 10MW of energy in we only get back 3-4MW when we use it. Put another way and assume worst case, 30%, then we need 3.33 units of energy generated for every usable unit of electricity we want back out to the grid.

If we want to build up 90 days of storage, we now need 4.3 times our grid demand - over 25GW - sustained for 90 days, to be able to meet realtime demand and produce the same demand again in the form of hydrogen storage for future use. Thereafter for every day of storage we consume we need another day, within a rolling 90 day window, where we have 4.33 times our demand to replenish the storage again.

If, as I've seen reported here on this thread and on related threads elsewhere on boards, that typical capacity factor of offshore wind is 40-50%, which is generally better than onshore so I'll leave existing onshore out for simplicity, then we need an absolute bare minimum of 50-65GW of distributed offshore nameplate capacity (or onshore adjusted equivalent) installed to meet our needs.

OK - granted - we could carpet the place in solar and build up our reserves during the summer months when electricity demand tends to be slightly lower but solar output is far higher - but wind output also tends to be somewhat lower too so it may only balance out.

Then we also have to consider:

All these new houses that are going to be built to solve the housing crises - they all pile even more new load onto the grid.

As we surpass 1m EV's and 600k heat pumps and head towards 100% carbon free transport and heating - more new load onto the grid again.

Industry growth from manufacturing, datacentres, tech industry - more new load on the grid.

And somewhere we have to factor in the ancilliary services that hydrogen storage will require - water treatment plants, pumping stations, transport of the produced product to the point of use.

You could easily see 100GW or more of total nameplate renewable generation capacity being required to give us sufficient safety and headroom to keep our own needs going year round.

Which brings the real clincher - all these wonderful notions of being able to be sending GW of energy off down the interconnector for days/weeks/months on end, producing vast quantities of hydrogen for export as "Ireland's oil" - that will require additional generation above and beyond that 100GW nameplate...

So - how are we going to deliver that 100GW of generation and how much is it all going to cost?

• Who will build those hydrolisis plants that will only operate when there's wind capacity to power them?
• Who will build hydrogen plants that will only generate electricity when there is a deficit in wind generation?
• Who will buy hydrogen in the dribs and drabs that become available only after we've fully stocked our 90-day storage?

None of yours are reliable and many are fantastical and don't exist. A proven technology versus fantasy unreliable tech that needs backup anyway. You're ideology is blinding you. 🤣

Did they not do that a few years ago only to open them back up again ....