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"Sportswashing" in Football - 2022

  • 06-07-2022 02:48PM
    #1
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,724 Mod ✭✭✭✭


    The question of sportswashing and moral issues with footballs relationship with certain states and entities arose today in the General Premier League Thread today so I am setting this thread up to allow for discussion of such issues.

    One of the items mentioned was that Mainz fans protested about playing Newcastle:

    Last week we saw Watford announce (on a Friday evening) they would have a friendly in Qatar but that was cancelled by Monday following their own fans protesting.



    Personally I have found the growth of state involvement in football clubs troubling, FIFA don't even allow it at International level but in club football the PSG president can also be president of European Club Association, on the UEFA executive committee while also chairman of Bein Sports who buy tv rights.

    Sponsorship is another type of sportswashing in my view and over the years one troubling area or sponsorship is replaced by another as brands seek to become more acceptable. As pressure is growing to so something about betting companies we are seeing relationships with new types of sponsors appears such as potentially unstable crypto and NFT's.



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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,128 ✭✭✭Fattybojangles


    Crypto and NFT's are out and out scams pyramid schemes basically the arse is falling out of them now and they'll be gone bust and hundreds/thousands will lose it all. They are far worse than betting companies who are legit and pay taxes etc these are essentially scams and criminal networks.

    As for sportswashing unless you have a time machine to go back to 2003 and stop the then Russian governor of the Chukotka Autonomous Oblast Roman Abramovich from buying Chelsea, you can't stop it as the old saying goes money talks and clubs and leagues will always welcome that kind of investment.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,724 Mod ✭✭✭✭DM_7


    Regulations can be brought in to change future agreements from ownership and governance models to sponsorship.

    Ownership rules in England, Germany (50+1 and long term investors) and Spain (two groups Plcs and Socio Owned) all vary.

    Fans can protest, can withdraw their support from clubs. I am not saying they should or that I expect them to but the conversation can't only be 'you can't stop it' so should just look away.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,773 ✭✭✭jacool


    Shrewsbury Town vs Qatar SC, scheduled for today, has been cancelled, after fan protests.

    It has now been turned into an "open" training session for all the fans who are in Spain at the moment.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,643 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    The ship has sailed. Numerous clubs are owned in this way, including some of the elite clubs in the game. Newcastle won't be the last either.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,999 ✭✭✭irelandrover


    I'm probably going to be alone on this but I have much more of an issue with the new Burnley owners.

    Yes Saudi Arabia is a horrible country with horrible leaders, but they aren't going to destroy a local club. They have to spend their money somehow and investing money in a team and the local area like at man City seems like a good use of the money.

    Burnley on the other hand are going to fall down the league as their owner asset strips them after a leveraged takeover.



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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,724 Mod ✭✭✭✭DM_7


    Not disagreeing with the issue of how they acheieved a buy out or the loans that became repayable but what assest stripping is going on?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,306 ✭✭✭✭Drumpot


    Sport-washing has been normalised and it’s hard to see how uefa or fifa (themselves filthy from the top down) can be expected to govern or regulate it in any meaningful way.

    I’d rather United was mismanaged by the incompetent yanks then was coked up on blood money, but I get that some fans don’t really have any morals (or understanding) on this topic.

    I don’t think it’s too late to change things round , look at how quickly they got Roman out of Chelsea. But bigger clubs in the EPL, means bigger players , means more Sponcorship and more money for the tv rights. The issue there is no will or incentives to make the changes , doing the right thing is costly. The EPL refusing cash injections is like FIFA rewarding the World Cup to the country that doesn’t bribe the most amount of voters.

    It’s really sad how corrupted the entire sport is from the top down…



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,999 ✭✭✭irelandrover


    I know woods was let go because his release clause was met.

    But mcneil, cornet and Collins are on their way for huge money with replacements from league one being lined up. High earners such as mee, and tarkowski are being let go.

    Weghorst been sent out on loan

    Now if those players don't go, or are sufficiently replaced then I'll admit I was wrong. Otherwise assets from Burnley are being sold to cover loans the owners used to buy the club.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,456 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    Football was rotten to the core long before the likes of the Qataris or Saudis appeared.

    Just new players on the scene.

    Fans won't care too much about where the money comes from, if it allows them to compete and brings them good times.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 927 ✭✭✭Icaras


    Nail on the head here. Sportwashing is part of the overall corruption issue within football.

    If it's making the guys at the top money they don't give a f*ck about what the fans think.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,456 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    The biggest lie in football has been "for the fans".

    Fans are an after thought, and have been for years.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,280 ✭✭✭✭event


    Barca and Madrid give out about sports washing and the big oil clubs.

    Yet as recently as January, they faced each other in the spanish cup semi final in Riyadh.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 61,272 ✭✭✭✭Agent Coulson


    I've been wondering over the last few days how the average fans of Newcatle & Man City two cub with huge major foodbanks collections outside their staduims on match days will view there owners this winter.

    Now with their owners backing Russia and the other OPEC Countries in slowing down oil production which will mean for many of the struggling fans who this winter will more than likely struggle even more to heat their homes and fill their cars with petrol as prices rise and line the pockets of their owners will that even effect their thoughts on the ownership of their clubs.


    Or will they just blame the Tories and keep cheering their Middle East owners because they buy them new players.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,456 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    I'm going to go with Option B.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,913 ✭✭✭✭thebaz


    or will the average fan watch the WC this winter - dont think I have been so under-whelmed for a WC ever - was it 8 years ago FIFA delivered the WC to Russia and Qatar , corruption and greed is not just at City and Newcastle its widespread , except at the grass roots local level. Gary Neville is still virtue signalling about football, and yet is going to be a pundit from Qatar this winter. Total hypocracy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 927 ✭✭✭Icaras


    What is your expectation of these fans? What do you expect of the peson who has a season ticket for the past 20 years? The person who goes to one or two games a season and the person who just watches on the TV? Do you want a stadium boycot, protests, support the team but dont buy the merch?

    Which alternative bidder do you think the clubs should have been sold to?

    As a Newcastle fan I feel the issue is beyond me, the people who run English football think this ownership is fine (because £££), the people who oversee them (UK goverment, FIFA, UEFA) think the ownership is fine (because £$€) so what can I realy do - why does the moral responsibility fall to the fans?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,456 ✭✭✭✭NIMAN


    And don't forget Mr Nice Guy David Beckham, already worth a reported 400 million, feels he needs another few million so badly that he will promote the Qataris too.

    Football has stunk for the last decade or more. Its all about money now. And for that reason, the ESL will happen some day. Fact.



  • Posts: 274 ✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Ah yeah but David Beckham queued for 12 hours to see the Queen's coffin so he has a great PR team.


    Sports washing works no question about that and City and Newcastle fans are only a small part of it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 464 ✭✭northknife


    When Infantino took over as President, there should have been a complete sweep out of all the National Associations Fifa delegates and new ones appointed.

    They should have also rid the organisation of its major sponsors like Adidas, Coca-Cola etc as they had to have been complicit in the fraudulent goings-on in the sport.


    https://www.theguardian.com/football/2022/oct/08/blatter-to-beckham-who-was-in-the-room-when-qatar-got-the-world-cup



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 216 ✭✭BobDole22


    This the best one yet City and Newcastle fans are responsible for oil prices now.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,979 ✭✭✭✭~Rebel~


    ?

    The post you quoted doesn't say anything even remotely like that...

    It says their owners (Saudi Arabia, and Abu Dhabi) are major contributors to it, which is pretty undeniable ...



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 216 ✭✭BobDole22


    It's the same tired rubbish putting the blame on fans asking snide questions questioning how they can follow their clubs etc



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,983 ✭✭✭El Gato De Negocios


    Is it not a topic that can be discussed ie the complete ease people can overlook morally abhorrent behaviours because the team they support might win some trophies.



  • Moderators, Regional East Moderators Posts: 23,251 Mod ✭✭✭✭GLaDOS


    Cake, and grief counseling, will be available at the conclusion of the test



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 61,272 ✭✭✭✭Agent Coulson


    Absolutely come into a discussion change people's comments accuses them of things they never said do the upmost to shut down an open discussion and use as much whataboutery as they possibly can to kill those discussions.

    That is the trend and proof sportswashing for genocidal murderous regimes works.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 216 ✭✭BobDole22


    You are attaching an awful lot of importance to your own comments I'll give you that. You're entitled to discuss what ever you like but you don't want a discussion you want seal clapping for your righteousness. You are trying to suggest fans shouldn't follow the clubs they've followed all their lives because of who the owners are you are trying to suggest that fans of Man City Newcastle Chelsea are somehow morally inferior to fans of other clubs. It's all very transparent and boring.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 216 ✭✭BobDole22


    You can discuss what ever you like I don't see anyone stopping you?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 927 ✭✭✭Icaras


    What is your expectation of these fans? What do you expect of the peson who has a season ticket for the past 20 years? The person who goes to one or two games a season and the person who just watches on the TV? Do you want a stadium boycot, protests, support the team but dont buy the merch?

    Which alternative bidder do you think the clubs should have been sold to?

    As a Newcastle fan I feel the issue is beyond me, the people who run English football think this ownership is fine (because £££), the people who oversee them (UK goverment, FIFA, UEFA) think the ownership is fine (because £$€) so what can I realy do - why does the moral responsibility fall to the fans?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,979 ✭✭✭✭~Rebel~


    I wouldn't necessarily expect someone to turn their back on their club - I would've expected to see more discourse about it from fans though, and more of a grudging acceptance rather than the predominantly total embrace of it. I'd have expected something more similar to the reaction of Utd fans towards the Glazers, or Liverpool fans towards Hicks and Gillette back in the day - still supporting your team, but you make your displeasure at the ownership known. Protests, marches, online campaigns etc.

    The total lack of any meaningful critical reaction from fans of these clubs has been really surprising to me - especially with Newcastle and the Saudi's. It really goes to show that as long as you simply throw in the money, the obvious broader concerns of having an owner who is guilty of genocide, state sponsored murder, who had 81 people put to death earlier this year, who routinely orders the death penalty for child offenders (not to mention having state policies that are outright misogynist and homophobic)... all these things just don't even seem to raise a peep out of the fanbase.

    So where I wouldn't have expected someone to turn their back on their club, I would've at least expected some more meaningfully expressed discomfort at their new owner. The most depressing aspect is that we all know if they were to tighten the purse strings, the protests wouldn't be long coming (which we know they're well capable of organising after Mike Ashley - and of course UEFA and the PL bodies totally accepted him as an owner too, so by your rationale so too should the fans supposedly?).

    Post edited by ~Rebel~ on


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 216 ✭✭BobDole22


    Well said! It's just another reason to have a go at rival fans dressed up as moral outrage. We all know that OT and Anfield etc would still be full if they had a nation state sovereign fund as owner.



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