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Tesla Model 3 - V3.0

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,155 ✭✭✭reni10


    I basically would like the car that was advertised to me which is the one that can do 491km at 118wh/100km from 100% to 0%.

    Mine cannot do this without going below 0% which means it is not as advertised and I should be able to get a refund or replacement.

    This is a case of false advertising on a €50k+ purchase and I am not one bit happy with it!



  • Registered Users Posts: 435 ✭✭mc2022B2TF


    And of the day the usable battery is generally the full pack minus a buffer

    All the wltp figures for this car assume a usable battery of 57.5kWh

    Early 2022 models clearly show this.

    Tesla can mess about with buffers and definitions etc. to suit their narrative. But it's disingenuous and dishonest.

    Basically they are learning about the lfp and realise they should probably tweak the BMS to protect it. Fine.

    But if u are going to do that then you have to reduce range displayed in the car accordingly and be honest with your customer.

    But they cannot face admitting a backward step when it comes to range.



  • Registered Users Posts: 124 ✭✭Josieg


    This "missing" range makes it harder to plan longer journeys since the Tesla navigation is working off the battery % so means it recommends a charge sooner than required or in some cases recommends one when it shouldn't be required at all.



  • Registered Users Posts: 435 ✭✭mc2022B2TF




  • Registered Users Posts: 787 ✭✭✭Zurbaran


    You were never getting those figures regardless and if you went by any brands official numbers and decided to wait for one to be accurate you’d be on a push bike since none are achievable.

    There is an issue here because of the buffer but you unfortunately can’t rely on wltp to be accurate on any vehicle.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,155 ✭✭✭reni10


    I know very well that I cannot achieve the WLTP figure but that is the only figure that Tesla publishes and stands over for their range estimates so it is all we can use to debunk the newer deliveries being able to achieve this figure with a much smaller usable battery pack.



  • Registered Users Posts: 787 ✭✭✭Zurbaran


    Its not the best way to approach it imo since everyone does it so there isn’t a leg to stand on. Arguing the buffer and how it affects trip calcs is a far better way.

    Personally I won’t let this bother me too much but understand that people aren’t happy about it. I might make a call to them to say I’m not particularly happy that cars with the same battery are allowing a larger range to zero. As I say though I’ll not be getting worked up over it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 787 ✭✭✭Zurbaran


    Just remembering this did actually affect one of my journeys. Was in Donegal with around 80% the car said it would be -4% to get home. Had my car been from earlier in the year I would have been able to make the trip with out stopping, Ha.



  • Registered Users Posts: 435 ✭✭mc2022B2TF


    491km range is calculated off a 57.5kwh usable pack at a consumption rate of 117 wh/km so to say that is not achievable is simply not true. It is. Very much so; both mathematically and in real world given the right driving pattern.

    What is NOT achievable is 491km at a consumption rate of 117 wh/km off a usable battery of 52kWh. Its mathematically impossible yet this is what has been hard coded to the in-car settings.

    I feel like I need to do a video presentation on this for people to actually understand the issue lol



  • Registered Users Posts: 787 ✭✭✭Zurbaran


    How do you get 117 wh/km consistently? It is impossible under normal driving throughout the year. The poster above says he expects it and this is the problem with these figures.


    Cant wait for the presentation. Bet it will be a cracker.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 435 ✭✭mc2022B2TF


    Simple math. I could get 100 wh/km under the right conditions. However under wltp testing the tesla m3 lfp 60kwh pack with a usable battery of 57.5kWh achieved a consumption rating of 117 wh/km. Giving it a wltp range rating of 491km.

    The 491km when converted to epa is circa 439km which the car displays.

    However when u change the usable battery but leave the range rating the same unfortuanly the mathematical equation no longer works.

    A * B no longer equals C because you have changed the value or B but left C the same .



  • Registered Users Posts: 435 ✭✭mc2022B2TF



    So tesla never give a usable battery size because it means they can conveniently f*** about with buffers etc. to suit whatever narrative they want to peddle at any given time. VW emissions style without the emissions

    Totally unaccountable



  • Registered Users Posts: 435 ✭✭mc2022B2TF


    But yet they use a usable figure in all background calcs. Funny that.



  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,326 Mod ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy


    Yeah this should probably definitely have its own separate thread now at this stage………



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,132 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    Even the lower buffer cars won’t do 491km.

    Did you think before buying you’d get 491km from the car?



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,132 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    everyone understands, it’s getting enough people that has this “issue”.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,132 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    No need for the video presentation. People understand it perfectly well.

    no need to be ignorant in your replies.

    If you don’t like it bring it back and move on with life.

    Im going out not to try achieve the 57mpg bmw promised me in my 520d. Stupid bleeding buffers.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,130 ✭✭✭innrain


    On a happier note last night in a span of 2 minutes I've been blinded by 3 Teslas. Bloody Teslas everywhere now, and they can't fix they lights.

    Joke aside after the last upgrade the auto high beam came on by default but I've changed that immediately. Hope they'll fix it soon or we'll get a reputation.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,393 ✭✭✭Fingleberries


    I noticed that, too. Since the last update the Auto High Beams are on by default when you start the car (not just when you switch on AP

    Is there a way to switch this off by default? I forget to do it every now and again until I accidentally blind oncoming traffic or a poor pedestrian.



  • Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,326 Mod ✭✭✭✭AndyBoBandy



    I almost always know it's a Model 3 coming towards me because of the sudden blindness it induces!!

    I usually needed to 'level' my lights every few months, but I did it about 2 weeks ago, and needed to do it again a few days later as they crept up faster than normal.

    As for auto high beams in AP, I don't have it!!!! So I must be in some sort of hybrid unicorn than prevents it from enabling itself (I have a 2020 Fremont car, but with the refresh steering wheel).



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  • Registered Users Posts: 435 ✭✭mc2022B2TF


    Haha I think most of the "ignorance" on this thread came towards me when I initially raised the issue. I was completely shot down on multiple occasions and was certainly condescended to as a newbie who didn't know much.

    People getting their feelings hurt now because they find it hard to admit I was right and that even though I had only owened the car for a week, I had the common sense to know something was not right.

    And judging by 90% of the replies, eh no, this matter is not understood well at all.

    I'm sorry if me being right is hard to listen to and feels ignorant.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,130 ✭✭✭innrain


    I've done it in the controls screen.

    ON Note the symbol on the right hand side also tells you is set.

    OFF

    Also there was a question about auto heated seats

    This is auto. Slight darker shade of ....

    Manual once auto seats is disabled you see the slight border of the two buttons Auto and seats .




  • Registered Users Posts: 435 ✭✭mc2022B2TF


    Classic example of not understanding whats being said and more shouting down. Of course the car can do 491km if u drive it at 117 wh/km which could be done Sunday driving under the right circumstances.

    So it certainly can be done, maybe not in the real world but it's perfectly possible.

    Sure didn't we have someone on here a while back telling me he can get 105 wh/km out of the car! When trying to argue against me.

    When it's suits a narrative it seems like People can flip and argue both sides.

    "Ah sure just ask for a refund if u don't like it"



  • Registered Users Posts: 435 ✭✭mc2022B2TF


    Tesla aren't interested and won't look at other people's regs due to GDPR

    I asked them to look at the issue as a whole and they said they can't look at other customers cars unless they ask.

    They are not arsed.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,132 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    The difference is, I would never buy the base M3 expecting it to do the WLPT figure of 491km.

    Yes it’s possible in theory but to get the magical figure of 117 wh/km out of a the battery to achieve it is impossible in the real world as you’ve stated yourself.

    Nobody is belittling your issue, but when someone doesn’t exactly agree with you, you throw out the “nobody understands” comment.

    People perfectly understand. You posting in here about will do nothing so you must decide to keep the car or not.

    My 520d I’m sure can do 1000km from a tank if I drive it to achieve its WLPT mpg figure. But in the real world I can’t achieve that figure over a full tank.

    Nobody is disputing it can’t be done mathematically. Your BMS calibration issue based on a larger useable battery capacity is what has you miffed. And that’s what you need to A) get on with it or B) hand the car back.

    Unless Tesla release a software update to the “effected” cars I don’t see it going any other way.

    There’s a few threads on TMC Forum where they stated their LFP has a useable battery capacity of 52.5 kWh.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,155 ✭✭✭reni10


    I had an SR+ before I got the RWD version a few weeks ago so I am well versed in what the car can and cannot do!

    What I do expect though is that the car can do the advertised range using the actual figures that Tesla themselves provide and with this large buffer on the Sep delivered RWD that is just not possible so that is in fact my gripe!



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,132 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    So you expected 491km?

    What range can the car actually do?



  • Registered Users Posts: 21,938 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    He doesnt expect 491km.

    He expected the mathematical numbers to add up. 491km is calculated using a constant wh/km figure. Yes it is unachievable in real life. However that's not important. What's important is the sum total. So 117wh/km gives 491km. That gives a total available kWh energy. However what he is experiencing is that the total energy available doesnt match what is shown at the start.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,132 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    I get that. Hence the BMS battery calibration comment.

    I don’t think it can be fixed without a Tesla software change.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,155 ✭✭✭reni10


    I expect the car to be able to do the theoretical numbers that Tesla advertised to me and know very well in the real world it is not possible but my car is not possible to achieve the theoretical numbers either so that is the issue!

    Also yes we know it will be a software change from Tesla to lower the buffer so the theoretical numbers can be achieved but they are NOT listening so that is why we are highlighting it!



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