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National Broadband Ireland : implementation and progress

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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,549 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    The only constraint is probably the length of the roll of fibre, probably a couple of hundred meters long, likely they will run the fibre from the DP in the neighbour's manhole direct to your house.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,152 ✭✭✭heavydawson


    KN have connection pre-planned before they arrive on site. They know exactly which DP your house will be connected to. In our case it didn't even connect to the nearest DP distance-wise. From where it enters our house to the DP was 150m, split fairly evenly 75/75m over/underground. There's no constraint on the length they'll run for the vast majority of people. It'll be connected via the manhole you mention. The best rule of thumb is that they'll re-use the existing route for the copper phone line (where one exists)



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,727 ✭✭✭creedp


    Id like some advise om porting my existing phone number to my new Vodafone fibre service. My previous provider supplied a broadband and voip phone service via transmitter, so no physical phone line. When I asked VF to port existing number I was asked for an UAN number. My previous provider said no UAN exists with a Voip service but it wasn't needed to port the number. I passed this onto VF and they agreed it was OK and would port number within 24 hrs. I was away for a couple of weeks and didn't check if active but now 3 weeks later I find the existing number doesn't work but temporary VF number continues to operate. I contacted VF customer services and again it was stated that irrespective of what was said previously, my number couldn't be ported without an UAN. When I complained that was contrary to previous discussion I was told to get an email from previous provider confirming that the number could be ported and bring this to my nearest VF store. When I questioned why it couldn't be emailed to VF, I got a very confusing response something along the lines to email it to VFs social media site.

    I must admit it is very difficult to engage with VF customer services. The quality of the line I had wasn't great and combined with difficult to decipher accent, I found it extremely difficult to follow the discussion. In any case I think the guy got annoyed with my line of questioning and simply hung up. I now better understand the warning about poor customer service given by my previous provider when I stated I was moving to VFs FTTH service!

    Before I get back to VF again Id appreciate if someone could advise if it is possible to port an existing Voip number to VFs FTTH broadband/voip service without an UAN? Also does the fact that 3 weeks have passed since my previous service was terminated impact on my ability to port the previous number, ie has that ship already sailed? Thanks



  • Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,803 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    You can port your number. Your previous provider should be able to provide something that will work like a UAN. If they don't, they may have ComReg questions to answer.

    There shouldn't be any problem with keeping your number for at least six months. I don't often side with Vodafone, but the porting process requires a UAN. If you don't get anywhere with your old provider, follow their complaints process, and escalate to ComReg if you don't get anywhere.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,209 ✭✭✭irishchris


    Probably been asked before but boards search is so poor these days.

    With vodafone being my new nbi provider do they provide the router by post prior to install day or do kn networks have it with them?

    Due for install on Friday but no router arrived so assuming may be all done by kn?



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  • Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 28,803 Mod ✭✭✭✭oscarBravo


    Vodafone seem to depend entirely on KN to deliver routers, to the extent of ordering truck rolls in situations where an electronic switch would normally be possible.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,549 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Dept in before the PAC tomorrow morning.

    €278.98 million has been paid to NBI to date under the NBP contract.

    Minister of State at the Department of the Environment, Climate and Communications:

    The contract for the National Broadband Plan (NBP), signed with National Broadband Ireland (NBI) in November 2019, provides for the deployment, management and operation by NBI of a high-speed broadband network to all premises in the NBP Intervention Area. The maximum possible cost to the State for the NBP contract will be €2.7 Billion over the 25 year term of the contract. €278.98 million has been paid to NBI to date under the NBP contract.

    As part of Budget 2023 an allocation for 2023 of €218 million was announced for the NBP. The NBP budget allocation for 2024 will be determined next year as part of the 2024 Estimates process.

    National Broadband Plan – Tuesday, 4 Oct 2022 – Parliamentary Questions (33rd Dáil) – Houses of the Oireachtas



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,549 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Just some points from the discussion with the committee

    • 24% national take up of premises passed, higher than expected
    • Gap infill areas, discussions underway, outcome expected by year end
    • No money drawn down from the €100m encroachment fund and none planned even though there has been encroachment into the IAs
    • €500m contingency fund, there has been an application(s) in the low millions

    More importantly, really interested to know what the Dept knows about the rear-ending of an Inland Fisheries vehicle by an uninsured driver and the costs involved, considering the amount of time devoted to it by a TD in committee.🙄

    https://data.oireachtas.ie/ie/oireachtas/committee/dail/33/committee_of_public_accounts/submissions/2022/2022-10-12_opening-statement-mark-griffin-secretary-general-department-of-the-environment-climate-and-communication-r1503-pac33_en.pdf

    https://data.oireachtas.ie/ie/oireachtas/committee/dail/33/committee_of_public_accounts/submissions/2022/2022-10-11_briefing-document-mark-griffin-secretary-general-department-of-the-environment-climate-and-communications-r1500-pac33_en.pdf



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,788 ✭✭✭clohamon


    At one point I thought Fergal Mulligan said that the build would continue "for the next 5 - 6 years"

    On the positive side, take-up in the first DAs was quite high; Cavan is 30% and Monaghan 35% (or the other way around).

    And the NBI website is showing 85,411 'passed' as of 2022-09-30



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,549 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Someone mentioned 2027, must check the transcript when available.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,549 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Premises connected as of October 7th - 21,167 of 85,411 premises passed



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 3,734 Mod ✭✭✭✭The Real B-man


    I just read this aswell pretty poor performance to date to be fair https://bddy.me/3T5opn2



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,554 ✭✭✭wexfordman2


    Poor in what way ?



  • Registered Users Posts: 201 ✭✭Gunner3629


    If NBI is XGS-PON then its 10 Gbps down and up, symmetrical.

    If that is the case, why are their resellers only offering up to 100megs upload to customers. Shouldn’t we have the option of 1Gbps upload aswell, since that is technically available?

    We’re no longer limited from a upload perspective like we were with DSL, wireless technologies but are still following the old sales mindset of offering upload speed of 10% of DL.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,549 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Resellers can only resell what the wholesaler provides. Right now, the max NBI makes available to resellers is 2 Gbps/400 Mbps.

    Looking at their roadmap for 2024/25 they say, "Increased Speeds across Bitstream and VUA products", but no further indication what they might be.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,209 ✭✭✭irishchris


    You were right and two kn Vans showed up today and had the fibre ran and set up in just over an hour.

    Really helpful installers and ran it to where I wanted in house even if bit of extra work for them. Really tidy install too.

    After years of problems with poor speeds it's like another world with broadband that just works well and instant.




  • Registered Users Posts: 15,549 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Transcript of the debate is up; Fergal Mulligan mentioned build sanctions over the next 5-6 years

    We are in year three of the build programme, and for the first two years no sanctions were applicable under the contract. We are in the early stages of applying sanctions. The Comptroller and Auditor General reported upward of €30,000 per build, with another €100,000 being notified to NBI, so that amounts to €230,000. This process of build sanctions will continue for the next five to six years as the build programme progresses. The other sanctions apply for 25 years. It is early days to be looking at it through the lens of how big or small a sanction is

    The Dept's Ciarán Ó hÓbáin is still saying this is a 7-year build programme

    This is a seven-year infrastructure build programme. It is guaranteeing that people will have access to a high-speed broadband network when it reaches them, and that will be for the 25 years, and really the 35 years, that the contract provides for.

    Also

    On the targets, it is not necessarily that NBI can independently set a target and whatever it is, it is. It set a target in 2019 of seven years to complete the build. The contract, as of 2019, is still in place. If NBI misses that target, it is sanctioned. That is an important point to make.

    ...

    The target of seven years was set in the bid process in 2019. That was contractualised following a bid process




  • Registered Users Posts: 15,549 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


     On the gap intervention/adjacent infill areas

    Deputy Colm Burke: My second issue is also one I have raised before. I refer to the frustration in those areas which are borderline amber and blue. The blue areas are those where commercial entities are doing the connections. I have been told about several such situations in the last week alone. There is one area where the box that Eir has put in place is at the end of an avenue leading to a farm. That farmer is milking more than 350 cows. It is a major commercial operation. This farmer will not get connected because he is in the amber area. The likely connection date is the end of 2025. Likewise, a great many people have said similar things to me. One was a case where the pole where the box is based is halfway up an avenue to a farmyard, but because the farmyard itself is in the amber area it will not be connected, despite the pole sitting in the blue area. It does not make sense that there has not been engagement with the commercial companies in these instances where places are borderline. Can we do something to fast-track connections in those areas on the borderline between the amber and blue areas and where a premises might not be connected because it is on the wrong side of the road?

    Ciarán Ó hÓbáin: In some instances, the Deputy is talking about a situation where a network simply ends. There will always be a next house where the network ends. If a commercial operator wishes to extend its operations, it can. If it does not, however, we cannot compel it to do so. The other instance, then, is one where a home is trapped within an area where there is a network. NBI has gone to and engaged with the market, and it is running a process that is due to conclude before the end of this year. It has asked commercial operators to come forward with proposed solutions for those infill premises in areas where there is existing infrastructure. Therefore, NBI is specifically actioning this aspect.

    Deputy Colm Burke: When are we likely to have a decision on this aspect? It has been stated it will be by the end of the year, but when can the process of implementing the connections then start? Are we talking about February and March, or later?

    Ciarán Ó hÓbáin: We will have to wait for NBI to conclude that process and report on the proposals it received and the related practical usage in that regard. It will become clear before the end of this year where this process is going.

    Deputy Colm Burke: The commercial operators' argument would be that NBI is getting so many thousands of euro per connection, whereas if those operators do the connections they will not. If those commercial operators have any additional costs, they will not get any more remuneration. I think this is their big argument for not doing these connections. It is extremely important that we try to expedite this process, especially because of the number of people now running their businesses from home. I ask that this endeavour be expedited and perhaps it might be possible for the representatives of the Department to come back to the committee by the end of February to let us know what progress has been made on this issue.

    Mr. Ciarán Ó hÓbáin: We will certainly be happy to come back once the process has concluded.



  • Registered Users Posts: 946 ✭✭✭daraghwal


    I tried to do this this last May and eventually got it sorted in September. Pure Telecom failed to do it, eir failed to do it and eventually I got a ComReg case reference number, sent a complaint into eir and about 6 weeks into the complaints process they eventually sorted it without needing a UAN but after a lot of hounding by me to get them to do it. I don't know if Vodafone customer support will be as in-the-know as the eir complaints department regarding open eir (who do the porting end of things on the other providers behalf) but worth a try. PM me if you have no luck and want to switch to eir and I can put you in contact with the eir rep that sorted my issues after countless phone calls with customer service where they would do nothing for me.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,788 ✭✭✭clohamon


    IIRC, NBI CEO Peter Hendrick said there was no a bidder for the 'gap areas' ITT i.e. extensions to existing rural fibre. Which probably explains Mr Ó hÓbáin's diversion to a different group - 'infill'.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,549 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Peter Hendrick said a few months ago

    There might be some value in looking at adjacent infill. We engaged with Eir about that. It is not a product that it made available. We are looking at that, with the regulator, to see if there is value and the quantum of premises whereby it would made sense for Eir to offer as a passive product. We would not be plugging into all its fibre network; it would only happen in specific scenarios where we see the merit of it.

    From my reading of it this appears to me to be part of the same process Ciarán Ó hÓbáin is referring to, the only other infill we know about is the urban infill where they have decided to go with leased lines.

    Hopefully eir and Comreg can put together a product that would allow NBI connect into open-eir's existing fibre network without having to run many kms of fibre from a small local exchange, like ours, to service a few houses, like ours, with open-eir fibre only a few hundred meters away. Fingers crossed we'll hear some positive news about it when NBI next appear before one of the Oireachtas committees.

    Post edited by The Cush on


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,788 ✭✭✭clohamon


    This is the bit I was thinking of from the meeting in June

    Mr. Peter Hendrick: In our update in March, we shared that we had reached a pre-quali- fication stage with five bidders. That subsequently went down to three, and we could see the rationale for the three in terms of urban infill. In areas such as Dublin we have a number of amber areas in a predominantly blue area. We have adjacent infill where the threshold between blue and amber is at a particular level. The rural extension is very remote and will be dealt with in 2025 and 2026. We now only have two bidders. They are predominantly dealing with urban infill and the rural extension. We do not have an infrastructure partner today for the blue and amber transition.

    Chairman: The two bidders will deal with what?

    Mr. Peter Hendrick: They will deal with urban infill, where there is infrastructure in an urban area where there is also fibre very close. That mainly involves one-off homes in an urban environment. Rural extension is more remote in terms of wireless technology.

    Chairman: Does NBI see any possibility of bringing fibre to the home for those rural houses? When Mr. Hendrick speaks about urban areas, does that mean the outskirts of a city or town?

    Mr. Peter Hendrick: Predominately.

    Chairman: Not rural villages.

    Mr. Peter Hendrick: We are not talking about a rural village.

    Chairman: Will there be the option of fibre to homes in rural villages?

    Mr. Peter Hendrick: For very rural villages, no. Our network roll-out is very important in terms of getting to them. We are looking at wireless-----



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,549 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    Having reread the June discussion comments I still think Ciarán Ó hÓbáin's comments points to the gap intervention/adjacent infill areas discussed back in June. NBI may not have got a solution/bidder for these infills at that time but that wouldn't mean they had exhausted the process, and this could be where they're at right now.

    Mopping up pockets of a few premises, adjacent to existing fibre providers, which takes time and resources to get fibre to, allowing NBI contractors concentrate on areas that require larger rollouts.

    I acknowledge I could be totally wrong on this, but it'll be interesting to see what their plan is.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,209 ✭✭✭irishchris


    Just wondering if there is any way to remove the gigabox router from the nbi setup. It really is a poor piece of equipment and have two routers that I had in previous network setup, one asus for everything and other one (netduma) for gaming for the two kids. Ideally would prefer to be able to connect the Asus straight to the ont without having the gigabox router connected if possible?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,152 ✭✭✭heavydawson


    Yup. You just need to configure the Asus Router to use VLAN ID = 10, and grab the username/password from the Gigabox (I think others have posted the VF user/pass elsewhere on this forum or boards generally)



  • Registered Users Posts: 75 ✭✭davpower


    I have my Asus router directly connected to ONT, set the WAN connection type to PPOE, username gigabox serial no@vfieftth.ie and password vodafone. In LAN setting, click IPTV tab, in ISP profile select manual and then type 10 in internet VID box



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,209 ✭✭✭irishchris


    Got this set up last night on my netduma router and thankful to have got shot of the gigabox. Cheers for the heads up in the vlan id as that was the missing piece of the puzzle to get it working



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,222 ✭✭✭Scruff


    Finally got installed yesterday!! W00t!!!

    Went with Vodafone. My current mesh wifi does not support vlan tagging so is there a way to set the gigabox in bridge mode?

    Never mind! just found Expert Mode 😐️



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,131 ✭✭✭dashoonage


    Hi all

    so just checked the NBI website there for the first time in a long time and they are saying jan-march 2023 , how soon before then should you expect to see build going on ?

    D



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  • Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,487 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    My area says Jan-Mar 2023 as well and they are currently very active on the roads around me , stringing cables on poles etc.

    They've been very visible locally for a couple of weeks now.



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