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Are Mick Wallace and Clare Daly Irelands greatest shame?

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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,383 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    I don't think his non-political activities come into.

    A vote for any politician is first and foremost an endorsement of their politics.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,749 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    Yes they bring shame to Ireland like a tap with a bad drip, it is drip after drip of the same anti-west sentiment combined with pro-Russia and pro-Chinese sentiment.

    These countries get more representation than Ireland do with these two MEPs, yet people will still vote for them in the next election. Do not overestimate or for that matter underestimate the intelligent level of the electorate, these two have the lower end of the market sown up.



  • Registered Users Posts: 473 ✭✭Ramasun


    I would have agreed with that before Donald Trump and Boris Johnson took their pre-politics fans to ballot box. I don't compare Mick Wallace's views or conduct with theirs.



  • Registered Users Posts: 473 ✭✭Ramasun


    It is different to landlords having agents monitoring people's votes.

    But if the Lords had known they only needed to fund a local football team to get the votes, without any questions asked, a lot of big houses might still be standing.

    Money is power.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,383 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Johnson and Trump have no redeeming qualities - political or otherwise.

    Prior to his getting into politics I liked Wallace and had time for him but none of that matters a damn any more given his views on the Russian invasion of Ukraine.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



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  • Registered Users Posts: 34,893 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Like massive VAT fraud, and stealing his employees' pension contributions?

    The Dublin Airport cap is damaging the economy of Ireland as a whole, and must be scrapped forthwith.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,125 ✭✭✭Elmer Blooker


    I’m her to defend Wallace in the interests of balanced reporting. This is what Wallace had to say, (from Irish Examiner) I presume ‘we’ve’ is referring to Daly as well

    "First of all, we've condemned the Russian aggression in Ukraine many times. We're still condemning it. We've already been very clear that when Russia invaded Ukraine, it was a breach of the UN Charter, which we completely disagree with. And it was illegal”

    I think criticism of the US of A for doing the exact same as Russia did is W and D’s biggest ‘crime’.



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,749 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    The Whataboutery of Wallace and Daly takes away from Russia's actions which are annexation, not like what the US did in Iraq, Afghanistan or elsewhere.

    Their anti-NATO stuff lacks them living with reality. The Baltic States would be Russian controlled now if they had not entered the alliance.



  • Registered Users Posts: 929 ✭✭✭ilkhanid


    It's not only Russia. They have the hots for any despotism that could be considered anti-west. They pooh-poohed the reports of Chinese genocide in Xinjiang and lately they've been defending the Ortega dictatorship in Nicaragua. Their criticisms of the Russia invasion are very pro forma, just getting it out of the way before the real meat of their spiels, how the USA and NATO are REALLY responsible for the war and its continuance.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,209 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout


    Big fans of Assad & Maduro too.

    It's such a weird collection of countries. Lots of hard-left types will always simp for Venezuela, Cuba and Nicaragua because their authoritarian regimes are seen as being on the correct "side". Beyond that though it starts to get more and more incoherent

    China: could be seen as an extension of that since they are ruled by a communist party (who don't really practice communism anymore)

    Russia: some kind of delusion about their Socialist past even though they officially left that in the dust 30 years ago and have embraced rampant klepto-capitalism

    Syria/Iran: Makes no sense whatsoever. Literally the only thing linking them to the rest is that they are allies of Russia, which really gives the game away about what their fundamental principles are here.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,198 ✭✭✭Good loser


    Excellent and exceptional post. Summarises their modus operandi to a T. They could be dupes/fellow travellers and/or gullible in the extreme. Or worse?

    Their stance is anti freedom, pro licence

    'Licence is the complete fulfillment of one's own will and, consequently, the overriding of everyone else's will.It goes hand to hand with the will to power and the desire to impose one's own ideas and opinions on everybody else. The man governed by licence always sets himself aims, and this only intensifies his lust for power: in order to achieve one's aim, one has to force everybody to act in concert and march in the same direction.'



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,886 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    "We condemn the Russian invasion of Ukraine, but everyone should stop helping Ukraine fight against it, and also we object to every effort made by other eastern european countries to protect themselves from potential Russian aggression."

    Their condemnation is worth precisely nothing because they do not mean it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,969 ✭✭✭Big Ears


    Pretty sure Wallace's biggest crime is defrauding the exchequer of millions of Euro and stealing his employees pension contributions.

    However he may have more skeletons in the closet, so who knows ?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,708 ✭✭✭Economics101


    Elmer Blooker: You conclude by saying: "I think criticism of the US of A for doing the exact same as Russia did is W and D’s biggest ‘crime".

    Sorry, but the USA never did anything approaching the genocidal ear of aggression against an entirely peaceful country like Ukraine. You "exact same" characterisation is totally wrong.



  • Registered Users Posts: 76 ✭✭Cllr_Dermod_Fahy


    I don't understand why Wallace and Daly get so much hate for raising the issues of the US being the same as Russia.

    We have enough voices supporting Ukraine.

    During the pandemic, Holly Cairns used her time in the Dail to go on about maternity leave for politicians. No one said "USE YOUR TIME TO FOCUS ON COVID ONLY!!"

    The UN had a vote the other day about trade embargo on Cuba. Only 4 countries in the world didn't vote against USA. Brazil, Ukraine and Israel. Not the bastion of morality at all.

    I'm glad Wallace and Daly are highlighting that the yanks are as bad as the Russians.

    Also have to LOL at Ukraine thanking Israel for support and having "shared values". You'd think Ukraine of all countries would side with Palestine when Israel are invading Palestine.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    Wallace and Putin are dumbass stooges for the Kremlin and Putin cum garglers.

    Pick an autocrat who's fond of butchering people and murdering journalists / civil society activists and they'll make a low-effort furrowed brow and go: "oh yes very naughty. BUT AMERICA / ISRAEL..." and drone the f*ck on for 20 mins about some bullsh*t they picked up from a Russian government bot on Twitter.

    They're complete roasters, have no respect for democratic institutions and should be on the watchlist of every intelligence agency across Europe. It would not surprise me in the least if it turns out these plonkers have been bunged money through some sort of front organisation to vom their nonsense in the European parliament.

    There is no splitting the difference, these two assh*les bring shame upon the constituencies they represent and should be recalled. Anyone speaking in defence of them are as bad and should have a chat with themselves.



  • Registered Users Posts: 76 ✭✭Cllr_Dermod_Fahy


    This is the problem.

    You think everything bad about USA is Russian propaganda. It's not. The US are as bad as Russia.

    It's got nothing to do with Russia.

    Wallace and Daly aren't saying "What Russia is doing is fine because the USA does it too". Wallace and Daly are saying "The US are the same and should be chastised the same as Russia." Wallace and Daly have repeatedly said Russias invasion is wrong.

    I don't really know why people can't accept that the US are evil aswell.

    I often see people saying "Because Daly and Wallace points are then broadcast on Russian tv!!".....Well maybe USA should stop meddling in other countries affairs and then Wallace and Daly wouldn't be saying the truth.



  • Registered Users Posts: 9,381 ✭✭✭Yurt2


    No, your sentiment is the problem. The "Yanks" are not as bad as the Russians.

    "The Yanks" are pretty much the only reason that the entire European continent wasn't turned into a Stalinist wasteland in the second half of the 20th century. They've spent the last 70 years providing the security backstop that has allowed Europe to thrive both economically and politically. Meanwhile, the USSR and laterally Russia spent that time crippling itself and making life miserable for both their citizens and any country unfortunate to border them.

    Instead of acknowledging that, you've snorted a line of sub-undergraduate Marxist reading group bollox.

    You don't need to send Joe Biden a thank you card, but ease up on the "both as bad as each other" nonsense. Because only one of the two has shattered the hard won European peace to go on a fascist rampage, and it's not the US.

    If "but America.." is the first thing to mind when a fascist creep launches the largest war in Europe since WW2, then sorry not sorry, but you've fallen hook-line-and-sinker for Kremlinite garbage. Because that's about the only thing a snaking-regarder can conceivably say without getting absolutely filleted.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,198 ✭✭✭Good loser


    Fatuous rubbish. Absurd equivalences.

    Can that pair not comment on the Ukraine situation without immediately linking it to a comparison with US? God knows the vast amounts of talking points that could be discussed re the conflict - illegality, war crimes, murder, Putin's predatory behaviour, courage, resilience. Yet they zero in on a US theme. Absolutely in line of course with their narrow, blinkered, quasi insane views on how the world is ordered. I suspect their bona fides.

    Refer you to Yurt2's two excellent posts above.

    Vincent Browne has a lot to answer for!!



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,622 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Clare Daly is a class act and fair play to her for calling out the utter hypocrisy around the Ukraine war. She's always been like that, no non-sense and calling it like she sees it.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 13,826 ✭✭✭✭Danzy




  • Registered Users Posts: 7,209 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout




  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69


    I’m calling it like I see it.


    Claire Daly can go and live in Russia where they support mass murder, rape and kidnapping of children.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,622 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Thats bullsh1t and you know it.

    Also just because something is wrong doesn't automatically make other wrongs right. One can be against Russia's war and still call out the western role/hypocrisy in it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,410 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,622 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    ?

    Its not like you wrote an essay or something.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,209 ✭✭✭Brussels Sprout



    Every single time they talk about the war they spend about 5% of their speaking time stating that they are "against Russia's invasion" (usually a single sentence at the very beginning) and then the remainder of their time laying into "the West for their hypocrisy".

    They're smart enough to realise that they cannot be overtly seen to be supporting Russia in this conflict. Hence they go through the box-ticking exercise of making a dispassionate statement of condemnation. They're not exactly being subtle about where their priorities lie.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,622 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    So what? Everyone else is talking 100% of the time about evil child eating genocidal Russia and 0% of the time about the lead-up to it. That should be quite enough, no?



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,886 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    The lead-up was the evil child eating genocidal Russia building up forces on the border, saying they would never invade, and then invading.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,198 ✭✭✭Good loser


    Clare Daly/class act/fair play idiotic inanity

    Clare Daly/utter hypocrisy laser guided precision

    That's for the three of you.



This discussion has been closed.
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