Inherited farm lease query

phildub · 06-11-2022 2:26pm

Yes but it's automatic, your mothers probate should be done first and then your fathers. He was alive when your mother passed so his estate is entitled to his share of her assets.

AnRothar · 06-11-2022 2:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119840664#Comment_119840664

Your mother predeceased your father.

Her estate must be resolved first.

This includes inheritance due to your father from your mother under law.

Only then you can commence the distribution of your father's estate as per his will.

Malbcull22 · 06-11-2022 2:55pm

Thanks Phildub,for clarication on this point

coylemj · 07-11-2022 3:07pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119840664#Comment_119840664

The fact that probate hadn't been completed on your mother's estate doesn't alter the fact that your father was entitled to 2/3 of her estate as she died intestate. You seem to be under the impression that her estate can now be distributed with no reference to the father i.e. her farm will be inherited by the four children because the your father is now dead. It doesn't work like that.

Poster phildub has explained how it works in post #29 above. On the disposal of your mother's estate, the four children are entitled to 1/12 each and the remaining 2/3 of her estate will form part of your father's estate. To be disposed of according to his will. But you've told us that the mother's farm was not mentioned in his will. That means it falls into the residue of his estate - was that mentioned in his will? If not, it will be disposed of as if he died intestate and each of you would get 1/4 each of the 2/3 of the farm which your father inherited by her intestacy. Along with the 1/12 you each inherited direct from her estate, that would leave each of you with 1/4 of her farm.

But if the father left the residue of his estate to your brother, he would inherit all of the 2/3 of your mother's farm which was inherited by your father and the other three siblings (incl. you) would be left with 1/12 of the farm each. He would have the 1/12 he inherited direct from the mother, along with the 2/3 bequeathed to him by your father so he would end up with 9/12 or 3/4 of the mother's farm.

Malbcull22 · 07-11-2022 6:53pm

Thanks Coylemj for your reply.This now makes sense to me;.I will get back later with an update

endacl · 07-11-2022 7:03pm

Paging John B Keane…

Malbcull22 · 07-11-2022 7:07pm

In reply to your comment Coylemj,I can confirm that my father made no mention of my mother's farm in his will.He did leave his farm and house to my brother(previously mentioned in post).However,my father did specify that the residue and remainder of his estate be divided amongst the rest of us(4 children).We are hoping to sell my mother's farm in the long term,how will the proceeds of sale then be divided amongst the 5 of us?The legal advice I've got so far,did not refer to my mother's estate,forming part of my Dad's estate,after her death.

Rusheseverywhere · 07-11-2022 9:17pm

Farmer here and first of sorry that you have all this to go through on top of your parents' deaths. As said my understanding is that two thirds of your mother's estate went to your father on her death automatically. IMO opinion your brother is in a strong position your father owned 2 thirds of this farm ie your mother's land after she died, you said he told your brother to farm it and he did. There is alot been left out as who was insuring it, fencing it etc.

https://www.fwi.co.uk/business/business-management/succession/analysis-supreme-court-rules-on-disinherited-sons-claim-to-farm

Malbcull22 · 07-11-2022 10:08pm

With regards work been carried out on my mother's farm,my brother would have fenced off fields etc.We recently took out public libility insurance on the land as there was none in place after my Dad died.I know my brother probably has a strong case with regards ownership etc.,but he's not very cooperative,and it makes any kind of dealings with him very difficult.

coylemj · 07-11-2022 10:36pm

OP, if your father left the residue of his estate to the four of you then it means that your mother's farm will be divided four ways so you will each end up with 1/4.

To be precise, you as an individual will inherit 1/12 direct from your mother's estate (1/4 of 1/3) and 1/6 from your father's estate (1/4 of 2/3). Which adds up to 1/4 (1/12 + 2/12 = 3/12 = 1/4).

893bet · 07-11-2022 10:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119847271#Comment_119847271

No. there is 5 siblings so the first 1/3 is split 5 ways. Then the residual 4 ways.

Rusheseverywhere · 07-11-2022 11:36pm

Try some sort of a family chat.Farming is tough and little out of it he may feel aggrieved that he slogged away at home and then sisters/brother arrive looking to take farm and get money. The other side is it is very unfair with farms that to keep them viable one person gets all and the rest get the door. Solicitors eat into the value of land like this once a dispute starts and it can destroy families. Probate on your father and then for your mother will be expensive and once any kind of a dispute they will ream it on probate alone.

I paid for the farm I have 2 per cent of the farm value which worked out at €20k for straightforward probate with a will and that was just for probate not include putting land into my name. Figure out what land worth I say average price of 7k an acre depend where etc etc but land is gone back this year from what I see as farming is not making money. Then figure out what it worth to you as your share if no dispute then factor in legal fees etc. Also probate took nearly 2 years for me solicitors are so slow particularly with land as they know they have their fees as the land is there to pay them.

I hope you resolve this but as said try if at all to resolve it yourselves as a family.

Gone With the Wind said it all on Irish attitudes to land "Do you mean to tell me, Katie Scarlett O’Hara, that Tara, that land, doesn’t mean anything to you? Why, land is the only thing in the world worth workin’ for, worth fightin’ for, worth dyin’ for, because it’s the only thing that lasts.”

coylemj · 08-11-2022 1:57am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119847304#Comment_119847304

Sorry, you are correct. I saw a mention of 'four children' but that was a reference to the bequest of the residue of the father's estate. Which apparently excluded the brother who got the house and the father's farm.

So I figure that that brother is only entitled to 1/15 of the mother's farm, that being the share he inherited from his mother under the rules of intestacy. The 2/3 of the mother's farm which went to the father were (apparently unknowingly) bequeathed by him to the other four children. So each of the four will end up with 7/30 (1/6 + 1/15) or just under a quarter (23.33%) of the mother's farm.

893bet · 08-11-2022 8:00am

It’s a night mare. Fact he owns so little means he will unlikely be able to buy it out.

Malbcull22 · 08-11-2022 11:59am

Thanks for all the info on my post,definitely helped and cleared up a couple of points.

Inherited farm lease query

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